When the controller says break

As soon as he cleared him for takeoff he can already start his roll into the runway and takeoff. If the radios are busy and only clear after you in the air, what's the use of replying. It's not idle, but I've seen it happen
What if that take off clearance wasn't for you? Where is this that the airport is so busy that you don't have time to read back a takeoff clearance? You may think that is somehow "not idle" but acceptable, you need to revisit that thought and ask yourself the possible ramifications of a misread takeoff clearance. Your profile says Ft. Lauderdale. So I'm going to assume FXE because god knows FLL isn't that busy. Although not surprising that this "technique" would be passed around with the quality of pilots floating around there, FXE is NOT "busy". What's the harm in reading it back? If there truly isn't enough time, which I've never encountered in my career, then you have no business taking off and joining the rest of us up there. Maybe the person developing this technique needs to work on their radio skills that way they can read back a clear and concise instruction with out "ands" and "uhs".
 
I fly in and out of some of the busiest airports in the world and have never had a problem reading back my takeoff clearance before I start my takeoff roll.

If I am not mistaken, the controllers at KJFK specifically tell you not to read back.
 
Is this defined in the .65 somewhere? I wasn't able to find it, nor in the PCG. I'm feeling it shouldn't be used at all.

If I need to "roger" someone and immediately talk to another plane, I either un-key briefly or just go right into talking to the next guy.

I mean:



Where is this stated?



Only time I have used it is when I am halfway through a non-critical transmission and noticed an critical situation developing(I.E. someone busting an altitude with traffic in their face), stopped said "break" and addressed the critical situation.

To use the 'technique" like the OP stated is inviting confusion and mistakes into the party.
 
If I am not mistaken, the controllers at KJFK specifically tell you not to read back.

You would be mistaken, I fly in and out of JFK all the time. ORD ground controllers don't want you to read back when they are busy.
 
You would be mistaken, I fly in and out of JFK all the time. ORD ground controllers don't want you to read back when they are busy.

Emphasis for the non-aware, not you Gonzo, taxi instructions are a little different than runway use clearances. And it is still a rule violation not to require a readback, ORD gets away with it because, well I guess because they are ORD, queeno might be able to provide a little more perspective as he worked C90.
 
Is this defined in the .65 somewhere? I wasn't able to find it, nor in the PCG. I'm feeling it shouldn't be used at all.

If I need to "roger" someone and immediately talk to another plane, I either un-key briefly or just go right into talking to the next guy.

I mean:



Where is this stated?

Its not, but even I periodically use it when two aircraft check on in very quick succession and I anticipate there not being very much dead time on the frequency. I never use it when issuing control instructions, too great of a chance of someone getting the wrong instruction and not catching the read-back.
 
Its not, but even I periodically use it when two aircraft check on in very quick succession and I anticipate there not being very much dead time on the frequency. I never use it when issuing control instructions, too great of a chance of someone getting the wrong instruction and not catching the read-back.

Im with bart, the only time I use it on a regular basis is for multiple checkins when it is busy.
 
Our controllers can see us from the tower so if it's VERY busy I'll just takeoff and let him talk to the other guy. He cleared you, and can see that you took off, end of story. He told the other guy he's number 2 to land, that's an important piece of information to repeat

Oh Good God. I fly out of EWR multiple times of day where it's a firestorm of arrivals, departures, and runway crossing clearances being rocketed off at a rate of a billion words per second. Never have I even considered not reading back my takeoff clearance. Tower would tear your face off and plaster it on the hold short line as a warning for other pilots. You fly out of a relatively dead empty airport, I can only imagine what mess would be in your pants with that kind of reckless attitude at a real airport.
 
Thanks for the input guys. My Facebook had a fit and decided it was no longer going to allow me to log into JC with it so... New non-fb account here I come..
 
Original poster, saw your runways, and thought hrm... I want to investigate this further, clicked your profile and it all made sense. I have a highly growing distaste with the tower controllers at that airport. I have a very big suspicion that the higher ups in this tower are upset because of the amount of foreign schools at their airport, and that dissension has traveled down the chain to the newest of controllers. I have never heard more rude controllers than at this airport. Sometimes, I will literally change freq as soon as I hit 2,400 MSL as opposed to the lateral boundaries because I can't stand to hear the way they will berate the next pilot to call up. It's bone chilling sometimes just how they treat the pilots in this airspace and have contemplated filing a formal complaint many of times in the previous few months. Now, I go do touch and go's at other area airports with GOOD controllers.
 
Controllers who use "break" regularly aren't good controllers.

To answer your question: he probably had no idea who should read back what.

Where EVER did you learn/hear this? There is nothing in the 7110 that supports this either way. Sounds like someone doesn't like someone's technique.

BREAK:

It's pretty typical for military controllers and miltiary pilots doing aircraft/airspace coordination (FACs and the like) to use "BREAK".

Interestingly, it has an additonal use in a tactical setting: it also means "I'm about to unkey the mic to see if anyone needs to use the freq so I don't hog it, but as soon as I hear that nobody else needs to talk, I'm going to continue my message."
Yessir. Lots of info to pass to multiple assets and not a lot of time to get it out. The read back generally goes in order of issuance.
 
I've only heard "Break" once so far, over channel 9 on a United flight in St. Maarten. It makes sense there seeing as one controller does clearance, ground, tower, departure, and approach for SXM and the surrounding islands, sounds like they get super busy sometimes. So I wouldn't go as far as to say it means the person is a bad controller, it all depends on the situation.

"Break" is simple enough to me. I'll admit, it was never covered in any ground-school course I took, but after looking it up on my own years ago, pilots are expected to read back clearances in the order they are received. I wouldn't think a controller would use break for more than 2, or maybe even 3 aircraft, so it shouldn't be that hard. If the controller is giving simultaneous instructions to 3+ aircraft all at once when its busy, then maybe something isn't right. But I doubt that happens.
 
Controllers who use "break" regularly aren't good controllers.

To answer your question: he probably had no idea who should read back what.

Wow.... This is a little naive. Using a transmission break is no more indicative of skill level as a clearance for takeoff without delay or immediately.. How it's used might hold a little weight and add to your point but the OP didn't post nearly enough background information to make that sort of assumption. A frequency break is as valuable a tool as anything else. Hopefully you wouldn't judge a controller so irrationally when soliciting a short approach. They are technically doing the same thing, buying time from the future.

A frequency break might allow me to issue an IFR clearance instead of idly waiting to make a transmission just because someone is "about" to have a departure slot on the runway. Or maybe I can issue an efficient departure release now instead of waiting 15 seconds so I can keep from blowing someone through final. In which case waiting to issue the release so I can turn on final in 15 seconds indicates a lack of skill, not the other way around. It's all in how you use it. Obviously if you "regularly" break because you realize that a higher priority duty is due and you forgot about it, that would indicate a lack of skill but the fact that you broke a transmission doesn't indicate in the least that skill is in short supply.

Also, to those of you talking about "the busiest airports".... You should know that just because you have a lot of airplanes around you doesn't mean that the controllers are the busiest.. I work at MKG ATCT/TRACON and we're slow 80% of the time.. 10% of the time we're moderately busy which equates to the work load that a controller might be under at a "busiest" airport.... 10% of the time there are more tasks than time at the end of the minute and buying seconds is a necessity. When you count the airplanes though, it can seem a lot less busy but when the controller is working Flight Data, Clearance, Ground, Local, and CIC the fact is, no controller at JFK will ever be as busy as a controller at a slower facility with all of the combined positions. If you want to argue about that, then go talk to TMU at any of these "busiest" airports and find out what their job is. It's to ensure that controllers don't get over worked. The controllers are often limited to 7-9 aircraft, of which they're only actively talking to a couple and don't have the need to tend other positions.

In no way am I saying that I work harder or stay busier than anyone else but I do know that there are times that it's everything I can do to keep everyone moving. We feed EAA Airventure Oshkosh and there are times that I'm servicing 20-25 aircraft at the same time and the guy next to me is doing the same thing.. Transmission breaks... nuff said..

Hopefully I didn't ruffle too many feathers but I seriously take offense.

Edit: Also, I expect the last person that I talked to to respond as I won't break a high priority transmission to talk to a low priority aircraft.
 
Original poster, saw your runways, and thought hrm... I want to investigate this further, clicked your profile and it all made sense. I have a highly growing distaste with the tower controllers at that airport. I have a very big suspicion that the higher ups in this tower are upset because of the amount of foreign schools at their airport, and that dissension has traveled down the chain to the newest of controllers. I have never heard more rude controllers than at this airport. Sometimes, I will literally change freq as soon as I hit 2,400 MSL as opposed to the lateral boundaries because I can't stand to hear the way they will berate the next pilot to call up. It's bone chilling sometimes just how they treat the pilots in this airspace and have contemplated filing a formal complaint many of times in the previous few months. Now, I go do touch and go's at other area airports with GOOD controllers.

The tower has a phone number, you know? Give them a call and ask why they are doing what they are doing, and what they expect... We are all the same team, right?

BTW, second transmission after break is what I've always expected too- given, it shouldn't happen to often. And runway clearances always warrant a readback, asked for or not.
 
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