Delta or Southwest?

JordanD said:
That was one of the reasons I really started to rethink going to WN if they started hiring at my airport. I've been working there for 2 years and have only heard of them hiring twice, and the second one I heard through the grapevine and it never actually went public. That's a LOT of time to spend at the bottom of the totem pole.
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Yeah at the smaller stations with less frequent hiring, that's a legitimate concern. On the other hand, being a smaller station with less staffing headaches it may not be so terrible to be the low guy. I bet they don't get issued nearly as much mandatory OT. You wont get a day shift for some time though.
 
num1bearsfan said:
Yeah at the smaller stations with less frequent hiring, that's a legitimate concern. On the other hand, being a smaller station with less staffing headaches it may not be so terrible to be the low guy. I bet they don't get issued nearly as much mandatory OT. You wont get a day shift for some time though.
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Well, at least there's no cleaning. That's the sole reason I hate nights at airways!
 
num1bearsfan said:
Under ordinary circumstances, it would be no question in favor of Southwest, because frankly it's superior in nearly every aspect as an employer. However, with your scheduling limitations I might go with the place that has promised to work with your schedule. Because Southwest wont. As a new hire, you will work a great deal of involuntary overtime. It is double time pay, but it sounds like it's not a money issue. You'll also be given the least favorable hours and off days. We recently hired a guy who works in real estate as his main job and he's CONSTANTLY being extended out for double shifts and he's having a hard time making it work. The upside is that it's only a temporary stretch and once you're past it (more people get hired under you) you have it made in the shade. If you think you could buckle down for a good 6 months and work some overtime, Southwest would be the choice. If not, go with Delta.
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Roger's an awesome guy though. Even with that, he's always made it work.
 
Bigey said:
Which airline did you work for? How does the First Class stuff work? Do you have to pay a fee?
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I work for Delta Global Services about 12 hours a week. It's a great deal if you work less than 20 hours a week, anything more and it's not. There's no fee for First Class upgrades anytime you nonrev on Delta. Before I worked at DS, I flew Delta on a ZED fare and still got a free first class upgrade. Of course, that's if the seats are available. I suppose Delta's NRSA program and their Ready Reserves are why they can keep the labor so cheap, especially at my company. :whatever:
 
scramjet said:
I work for Delta Global Services about 12 hours a week. It's a great deal if you work less than 20 hours a week, anything more and it's not. There's no fee for First Class upgrades anytime you nonrev on Delta. Before I worked at DS, I flew Delta on a ZED fare and still got a free first class upgrade. Of course, that's if the seats are available. I suppose Delta's NRSA program and their Ready Reserves are why they can keep the labor so cheap, especially at my company. :whatever:
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Wait, so you work as a contractor within the Delta network? Whats the pay like at your 'company?'
 
Bigey said:
Wait, so you work as a contractor within the Delta network? Whats the pay like at your 'company?'
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Miserable. Obviously my company exists to save Delta money at outstations, but seeing as mainline is non-union, I really don't get why Delta doesn't just hire B-scale mainline employees or just lower pay across the board. The odd thing about it, though, is that it proves my theorem relating to menial airline jobs: offer flight benefits and highly qualified candidates will come regardless of the pay and working conditions. I'd say close to 70% of my coworkers are financially comfortable professionals with other careers who work a few times a month at DS to get the free flying. I've heard that the same is true for mainline ready reserves. Not that there's anything wrong with that, though.
 
scramjet said:
Miserable. Obviously my company exists to save Delta money at outstations, but seeing as mainline is non-union, I really don't get why Delta doesn't just hire B-scale mainline employees or just lower pay across the board. The odd thing about it, though, is that it proves my theorem relating to menial airline jobs: offer flight benefits and highly qualified candidates will come regardless of the pay and working conditions. I'd say close to 70% of my coworkers are financially comfortable professionals with other careers who work a few times a month at DS to get the free flying. I've heard that the same is true for mainline ready reserves. Not that there's anything wrong with that, though.
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Wow. You seem all too happy to be an exploited lower middle class American. You're actually advocating for your company to operate like that?
 
num1bearsfan said:
Wow. You seem all too happy to be an exploited lower middle class American. You're actually advocating for your company to operate like that?
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I'm was being somewhat sarcastic on my post, in case you couldn't tell. :) I tried to make a living at that place at one time, myself; realized it wasn't going to happen and went to part time while I started looking for other jobs/focusing on my flight training.
 
Since you're starting a business I'd say go with the one that gives you the ability to focus the majority of your time towards it.
 
Cav said:
Since you're starting a business I'd say go with the one that gives you the ability to focus the majority of your time towards it.
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This is what it ultimately came down to. Delta is going to afford me the freedom to focus on my business vs. focus on their business. I never thought in a million years I'd shoot down Southwest, but hey, I guess it happens!
 
Bigey said:
This is what it ultimately came down to. Delta is going to afford me the freedom to focus on my business vs. focus on their business. I never thought in a million years I'd shoot down Southwest, but hey, I guess it happens!
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Well congrats on your decision! Welcome to the Southernjets team!
 
For everyone who's saying "ZOMGZ SOUTHWEST!". What do you really know about working there? After Highschool I actually interviewed for Delta Ramp, Southwest CS, and Skywest Ramp/CS(interviewed for ramp they wanted me in CS). Despite having no job experience other than an internship I was offered all 3, went with Skywest because they had the best flight benefits living in SFO as UA is non-stop to most places. Most of the Southwest and Delta part-timers I know are 5 days a week. Part-timers where I work are 3 days a week. HUGE difference if you travel a lot. I know people there who love the job, they're all into airplanes. Some people who aren't really don't give a crap about it anymore than the people I used to work with in CS, they just have to put on a smile more than others. You have to buy ZED whenever you want to leave the country, and you can only fly coach. Delta offers 6 free International flights a year, then after that I think you have to buy an ID90. But still, that's HUGE compared to every other carrier out there. Free first class, and they don't automatically upgrade frequent flyers for the hell of it so you actually get first sometimes unlike on other airlines. You can also see up-to-date airport standby lists and look at what the gate agent is looking at to see upgrades, revenue standbys, seat requests, all that stuff to give you a good idea of how you stand on that flight and what seat to expect. They fly pretty much everywhere you've ever heard of, and while people complain that the flights are always full, but if you're good at non-reving you'll always find a way. Non-reving on Southwest they are always very very friendly and help you out(well, except in SMF), but if the flight is even close to full you can expect a middle seat since everyone picks their own seats and gets on before you. Its pretty awkward to stumble around the airplane looking for the last middle seat while everyone is staring at you watching you hold up the pushback. Kind of confusing that Southwest won't ever give out exact loads too, they'll say "More than 3 seats open and 3 standbys" then you show up to the airport and there's 20 people on the 737, or there's 4 seats left open, always random.

Don't get me wrong, I like Southwest, but I don't ever think its "Hands down go to Southwest and frolic free with Herb and Colleen in the rolling Texas hills!". They are better than a lot of companies to work for, but some other airlines have more to offer. Keep in mind all this is from a guy who non-revs a lot and works as little as possible, if you don't travel much and want a job, you may not share my opinion.
 
ChasenSFO said:
For everyone who's saying "ZOMGZ SOUTHWEST!". What do you really know about working there? After Highschool I actually interviewed for Delta Ramp, Southwest CS, and Skywest Ramp/CS(interviewed for ramp they wanted me in CS). Despite having no job experience other than an internship I was offered all 3, went with Skywest because they had the best flight benefits living in SFO as UA is non-stop to most places. Most of the Southwest and Delta part-timers I know are 5 days a week. Part-timers where I work are 3 days a week. HUGE difference if you travel a lot. I know people there who love the job, they're all into airplanes. Some people who aren't really don't give a crap about it anymore than the people I used to work with in CS, they just have to put on a smile more than others. You have to buy ZED whenever you want to leave the country, and you can only fly coach. Delta offers 6 free International flights a year, then after that I think you have to buy an ID90. But still, that's HUGE compared to every other carrier out there. Free first class, and they don't automatically upgrade frequent flyers for the hell of it so you actually get first sometimes unlike on other airlines. You can also see up-to-date airport standby lists and look at what the gate agent is looking at to see upgrades, revenue standbys, seat requests, all that stuff to give you a good idea of how you stand on that flight and what seat to expect. They fly pretty much everywhere you've ever heard of, and while people complain that the flights are always full, but if you're good at non-reving you'll always find a way. Non-reving on Southwest they are always very very friendly and help you out(well, except in SMF), but if the flight is even close to full you can expect a middle seat since everyone picks their own seats and gets on before you. Its pretty awkward to stumble around the airplane looking for the last middle seat while everyone is staring at you watching you hold up the pushback. Kind of confusing that Southwest won't ever give out exact loads too, they'll say "More than 3 seats open and 3 standbys" then you show up to the airport and there's 20 people on the 737, or there's 4 seats left open, always random.

Don't get me wrong, I like Southwest, but I don't ever think its "Hands down go to Southwest and frolic free with Herb and Colleen in the rolling Texas hills!". They are better than a lot of companies to work for, but some other airlines have more to offer. Keep in mind all this is from a guy who non-revs a lot and works as little as possible, if you don't travel much and want a job, you may not share my opinion.
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Southwest employees can see the exact loads. OALs are the only ones who have to rely on that estimate system. We have a whole nice big intranet site with all of the non rev listing tools. I would never even show up for a flight booked to the point where I would be looking for that middle seat. I have never had a problem flying exactly when I wanted to on Southwest. Southwest has so many frequencies to everywhere they fly that it's actually a breeze. The sure bets are the first and last flights of the day. We have very generous flight benefits on our own metal. Being a trainer, I actually receive positive space passes. We can also fly fourth jump seat in a pinch (does anyone else let their ground ops people ride in the jump seats?). We also get 16 (round trip) buddy passes per year that can be used on any flight at any time and are completely free (no taxes or fees). Literally just a voucher printed on ticket stock "good for one free flight" that you can hang onto and redeem at any time, or give away to anyone to use (no name printed on it). Employees, children, and parents fly unlimited NRSA anywhere anytime free.

We indeed do not have any international destinations, but overall I would not trade my benefits with that of Skywest. I suppose from the perspective of someone who's only taking the job on a PT basis in order to gain the flight benefits, taking the OO, DL, or what ever else job sort of makes sense - but frankly how do you pay your bills? Are you telling me you work PT (at a lower wage), travel the world (all the time), and pay your bills? That's difficult to believe. I would rather take the higher paying gig, and simply be able to afford to pay for that ZED once or twice a year (which is how often I suspect anyone with full time international flight benefits actually flies anywhere international). Sorry I just don't buy it. It sounds like you're trying to trying to live off of that romantic idea that we all had when we were new that this would be some sort of amazing lifestyle of working and just jet setting all over the place on our spare time. Then reality hits when you realize that flying on an airplane just to do it isn't that fun anymore, and that there things like HOTELS and CARS and FOOD and ENTERTAINMENT that cost MONEY. Something that's hard to afford as a part timer at OO with a lot of spare time to fly around.

How many years at Skywest are you and what's your current hourly rate?
 
ChasenSFO said:
After Highschool I actually interviewed for Delta Ramp, Southwest CS, and Skywest Ramp/CS(interviewed for ramp they wanted me in CS). Despite having no job experience other than an internship I was offered all 3
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So you actually applied, interviewed, past screening, and were given conditional job offers for all 3 airlines at the same time? That's quite a juggling act. And it's crazy how all 3 airline's hiring processes took the same amount of time. And after weighing your options you went for the cross utilized agent at the regional.
 
First off, WOW. Are you that bored? I'm sorry you have to personally attack me for not wanting to work at your company back in 2008. It happens.

num1bearsfan said:
So you actually applied, interviewed, past screening, and were given conditional job offers for all 3 airlines at the same time? That's quite a juggling act. And it's crazy how all 3 airline's hiring processes took the same amount of time. And after weighing your options you went for the cross utilized agent at the regional.
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Yeah I pretty much accepted all 3 jobs then turned 2 down, ethical? Nope, but I was 18 and I like to tease, what can I say. SFO created a scholarship for me(wasn't given out before or since) to help with my flying because I'm just that awesome, it got a fair amount of local press, and airlines were eager to hire me, I took advantage. I "weighed in my options" between working for DL with no one under age 40, working with a bunch of koolaide drinkers like yourself, or working at a place that I can actually hope to fly for in the near future. It was about the equivalent of telling 3 girls you love them, sleeping with all of them, then choosing the one who was best in bed and telling the others to get lost. Now what happens next MAY confuse you, so listen closely. I chose the puny inferior regional that doesn't have any big shiny airplanes with middle seats. GASP! I know right? ZOMGZ AIR FORCE ONES ON THE GOOOOOOOOOOOO! But I did have some valid reasons:
1) I hope to fly there.
2) They had the hottest chicks working there and the youngest crowd.
3) Southwest offers 4 more buddy passes(roundtrips) a year than I get, but I can throw a girl's fine ass into a first class seat to Seoul tomorrow if I want to. It ain't stuntin' if you got it. Rule 1054 of hood life, chapter 15, section 6c.
4) They fly to all the college towns such as CIC and SBP so I can party with friends I otherwise wouldn't see much of and...umm..."keep in touch" with lady friends.
And finally, I only had to put in 24 hours a week, and even then I can trade shifts so I never have to be there.

This brings up your next assertive holier-than-thou question, how does a 20 year old kid who lives at home, has 1 bill, and has a 10 minute flat commute from the driveway to the employee garage afford to travel on a whim and work 3 days a week? Ok, this is TOO HOT FOR TV, so listen up! There are a few methods for this. One, I make a little over $2000/mo(wait but I thought I don't get paid anything at this crappy regional part-time job?!?!) which is all money in my pocket, and I can rent cars at a discount even being well under 25(something I quickly found out the all mighty Whiskey November doesn't offer its young employees) and get hotel discounts in most cities, so that helps. Two, this is a hobby job for a lot of the people at SFO and most people are well-off from other careers, so I travel with them mostly. In fact, they would probably laugh you out of the sauna for your "Who needs more than 2 ZEDs a year for INTL?" comment. I have co-workers who commute from Buenos Ares and Honduras to work the ramp here for the benefits, such as free health care(BUT ITS A REGIONAL AIRLINE dubbya tee eff?!). I also already have trips to AMS, SXM, MNL(you guys may never see me again after that one), YVR, and AKL planned for 2011. I'm at a stage in my life where I have a disposable income, I'm having the time of my life, and my job is just a job. The way it should be when you're 20.

Long story shot, get off your high horse. I was giving my opinion based off what I know about each company, and you come in screaming in like a SEAL in the Bin Laden compound with rapid fire attacks on a personal Jihad against me after I said Southwest wasn't the best airline OF ALL TIME. Dude, I have a lot of friends who post here, hell my best friend does, so I don't know who you're trying to prove I'm a phony to when people who have known me for years could back it up in a second. There is a book called "How to win friends and influence people". You can get a copy of it from a guy named Mitch who used to post here. If I wasn't that much of a fan of Southwest before your posts, yours sure didn't help. But then again, I'm a big boy and I know I can't go taking one persons actions and applying it to the masses. That's stereotyping. Like assuming Skywest agents were cross-ultilized at SFO. You Regional Airlineist. Kthxbai.

Pssst, PS: In about 2 hours there is a Brasilia with a bunch of open seats going to Modesto. Can you just hop on it on a whim? Didn't think so. Point: Skywest.
 
num1bearsfan said:
Southwest has so many frequencies to everywhere they fly that it's actually a breeze.
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That's going to be true for any airline when you live in one of its biggest hub cities. But where I live if I want to go out west they only have 1 daily PHX and one daily LAS, both of which seem to fill up pretty consistently. The whole not giving out exact loads to OAL things really rubs me the wrong way too. My airline has no problem telling people, and really, does it matter? It really has to be a pain if you're an OAL crew member trying to commute and WN doesn't want to give you the exact loads.
 
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