FAA Fatigue Rules

Re: New Pilot Time/Duty Limitations

seagull said:
2. Regarding "fancy gadgetry", au contraire. The much vilified Airbus FBW control law just might have prevented this accident.
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Very true. And why do you think it is that no "regional" aircraft manufactures put that stuff in their planes? I'd posit that it's because airlines have already decided what they are and aren't willing to pay for.
 
Re: New Pilot Time/Duty Limitations

BobDDuck said:
Very true. And why do you think it is that no "regional" aircraft manufactures put that stuff in their planes? I'd posit that it's because airlines have already decided what they are and aren't willing to pay for.
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Money talks
 
Re: New Pilot Time/Duty Limitations

BobDDuck said:
Very true. And why do you think it is that no "regional" aircraft manufactures put that stuff in their planes? I'd posit that it's because airlines have already decided what they are and aren't willing to pay for.
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Do any of the current CRJ/ERJ or future designs have FBW?
 
Re: New Pilot Time/Duty Limitations

Fatigue is relative, and peoples fitness and age levels I think influence it. Back in the Navy we could rack up 180 hrs a month Flight time with tons of brief/debrief time to boot... I was mid 20's back then, I wouldn't imagine it today.

If I had to put my family on a plane I would prefer it be the crews first leg, first day of a trip sometime after 9AM. About the time bankers get to work.:beer:
 
Re: New Pilot Time/Duty Limitations

I have no desire to discuss Colgan, as I have done that at the time of the incident on another forum and everyone can certainly read the NTSB report for themselves and the transcripts of the CVR , the backgrounds of the two pilots, what their conditions were prior to their duty time etc., and I seriously mean no disrepect here........but really what has happened to Aviate, Navigate, and Communicate? What has happened to Situational Awareness and actually flying the damn plane? Are hand flying skills a forgotten memory? Why are we looking at the aircraft to save the day? Is that not what pilots are paid to do? Is stall recovery a useless skill? (more importantly is why they got to a stall in the first place that should have never occurred to begin with)

Even an autopilot, which is great for reducing workload must be monitored closely and properly. What happened to actually checking your airspeed? What happened to assessing yourself and calling in if you are not fit due to severe fatigue, illness or whatever and choosing not flying that day? What happened to a sterile cockpit? CRM anyone? FBW will not "make up" for poor skills and poor training or any of what I have mentioned above.

And I am really trying not to be unkind. If two professional pilots are found completely overwhelmed and over their heads in this situation, as they were, and make the errors that they did, what does that say really? It says many things to me and none of them are about having more systems to fly the plane. And yes, I understand the life of many commuter pilots.....it's horrible. But bejebus, is the answer to let the automatics perform what you cannot actually perform yourself and all will be well? How dangerous is it to become so overly reliant/compliant on automatics and FMS's that you cannot actually fly your aircraft?
 
Re: New Pilot Time/Duty Limitations

ATN_Pilot said:
Yep.
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How about if the regulation would state that all pilots have to live in their crew base? What if it created a series of very short trips with days off in between to you couldn't ever enjoy a block of time off absent vacation? What if it instated a rule that would ensure the pilot was actually resting before a trip, even on time off?

Still easy?
 
Re: Proposed FAA Rest Regulations: Out Soon

jtrain609 said:
The press conference isn't going to happen until 1:00 p.m. eastern, but Bloomburg is reporting 9 hours of rest, 13 hour duty day maximums, and 30 hours off consecutively per week.

If this is all true, it better mean 9 hours of behind the door rest, not "rest" under the current structure.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-...said-to-get-more-rest-under-faa-overhaul.html
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Used to commute 45 mins both ways to HPN...With ZERO traffic and assuming I fall asleep as soon as I get home thats less than 6 and a half hours of rest on a minimum rest day...Throw in the normal necessities of being a human like showering, using the bathroom and eating, and it's less than 6 hours...

9 Hours, uninterrupted rest behind closed doors would be amazing.
 
Re: Proposed FAA Rest Regulations: Out Soon

jtrain609 said:
The press conference isn't going to happen until 1:00 p.m. eastern, but Bloomburg is reporting 9 hours of rest, 13 hour duty day maximums, and 30 hours off consecutively per week.

If this is all true, it better mean 9 hours of behind the door rest, not "rest" under the current structure.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-...said-to-get-more-rest-under-faa-overhaul.html
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YOU FORGOT TO MENTION THE 10HR MAX FLIGHT TIME A DAY...:mad:
 
Re: Proposed FAA Rest Regulations: Out Soon

I might catch some heat for this one, but I'm not entirely opposed to flying 10 hours in a day if it's under the right circumstances.

Like a 10 hour turn? Fine, great. It's one takeoff, and one landing for each pilot. But a 10 hour day with 6 legs? No thanks!
 
Re: Proposed FAA Rest Regulations: Out Soon

jtrain609 said:
I might catch some heat for this one, but I'm not entirely opposed to flying 10 hours in a day if it's under the right circumstances.

Like a 10 hour turn? Fine, great. It's one takeoff, and one landing for each pilot. But a 10 hour day with 6 legs? No thanks!
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And what regional you work for that you "regularly" if at all get a 10hr turn???
 
Re: Proposed FAA Rest Regulations: Out Soon

Well the 10 hours could help a lot with the trancon pilots.... Go ATL-LAX-ATL twice a week... Get about 20 hours..... 2 days on 5 days off... :) 20 days off a month! Oh how I would give my left (blank) for that.....


*Note, done day dreaming now*
 
Re: Proposed FAA Rest Regulations: Out Soon

Apparently Lahood let out a few details this AM:

U.S. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood, on his Fastlane blog, has given us these details into the pilot fatigue/rest rule coming out Friday, and we quote:
•One consistent rule for domestic, international, and unscheduled flights

•A nine-hour opportunity for rest prior to duty (a one-hour increase over current rules)

•New approach to measuring a rest period that guarantees the opportunity for eight hours of sleep

•Different requirements based on time-of-day, number of scheduled segments, flight types, time zones, and likelihood that a pilot is able to sleep


Features to manage cumulative risk include:

•Weekly and monthly limits on duty time of any kind

•Thirty consecutive hours free from duty every week (a 25% increase over current rules)
​
He adds: "The proposed rule also gives pilots the right to decline an assignment if they feel fatigued--without penalty."




http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2010/09/lahood-lets-out-a-few-details.html
 
Re: Proposed FAA Rest Regulations: Out Soon

So is this just a proposal for everyone to see and argue - read: Airlines - or is this the new law that will be signed immediately?
 
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