Military Aviation Question

Jeremy

New Member
Hello,

Just wondering, if a person was to become a pilot in any branch of the military (particularly Navy or Air Force), what determines what they will be flying. From what I know, the better pilots fly fighters while other pilots who aren't as great fly transport. Is flying skill the only deciding factor of what kind plane the pilot will be put in?

Also, I'm pretty sure I already know the answer to this question, but is it harder to get a job flying fixed wing aircraft in the Air Force or the Navy?

Thanks, and sorry for the unspecific title (couldn't think of anything else to call it :confused:)
 
Hello,

Just wondering, if a person was to become a pilot in any branch of the military (particularly Navy or Air Force), what determines what they will be flying. From what I know, the better pilots fly fighters while other pilots who aren't as great fly transport. Is flying skill the only deciding factor of what kind plane the pilot will be put in?

Also, I'm pretty sure I already know the answer to this question, but is it harder to get a job flying fixed wing aircraft in the Air Force or the Navy?

Thanks, and sorry for the unspecific title (couldn't think of anything else to call it :confused:)

1. Needs of the service
2. What's available for your class.
3. How you rank/rate
4. What your desires may/may not be.

Of the two, it's easier to get helos in the Navy, if that's what you're asking.
 
1. Needs of the service
2. What's available for your class.
3. How you rank/rate
4. What your desires may/may not be.

Of the two, it's easier to get helos in the Navy, if that's what you're asking.

What do you mean by rank/rate?
 
Oops, almost forgot to mention...

I was wondering out of the 10 years required service for an Air Force pilot, how many of those are active? All of them? It seems kind of odd to get out of the AFRTOC at age 32 :whatever:

And why don't Navy pilots have to serve 10 years?
 
Oops, almost forgot to mention...

I was wondering out of the 10 years required service for an Air Force pilot, how many of those are active? All of them? It seems kind of odd to get out of the AFRTOC at age 32 :whatever:

And why don't Navy pilots have to serve 10 years?

All are active, unless there are any early outs for times when there's too many pilots, etc. But those times come and go. I thought USN was 10 yrs too, or is is 8?
 
All are active, unless there are any early outs for times when there's too many pilots, etc. But those times come and go. I thought USN was 10 yrs too, or is is 8?

8 year obligation for all USN pilots which begins the day your pin your wings. For all the jet guys I know, this translates into 10 years of active duty since flight school takes 2 years for us. I am actually very junior compared to most of my buds who are tracking along with me, but by the time I wing next month, I will have been in flight school for 25 months. Most of my classmattes have been on AD for nearly 3 years now, and my Marine classmatte will pin Capt later this year about the time he starts the FRS/RAG. P-3 and helo guys typically run about 16-18 months in flight school, depending on class dates and how quickly they get through their flights in advanced.
 
8 year obligation for all USN pilots which begins the day your pin your wings. For all the jet guys I know, this translates into 10 years of active duty since flight school takes 2 years for us. I am actually very junior compared to most of my buds who are tracking along with me, but by the time I wing next month, I will have been in flight school for 25 months. Most of my classmattes have been on AD for nearly 3 years now, and my Marine classmatte will pin Capt later this year about the time he starts the FRS/RAG. P-3 and helo guys typically run about 16-18 months in flight school, depending on class dates and how quickly they get through their flights in advanced.

So it almost comes out to same-same, within a year or so. For AF it comes out to about 11 yrs. For me it was 8 yrs also back in the day.

Flight school 25 months? Holy crap. To give you perspective, I did OTS, UPT, land and water survival school, A-10 RTU (RAG), PCSd to Korea, did mission qual, and was a mission qualed A-10 pilot, all while still an O-1.
 
Hello,

Just wondering, if a person was to become a pilot in any branch of the military (particularly Navy or Air Force), what determines what they will be flying. From what I know, the better pilots fly fighters while other pilots who aren't as great fly transport. Is flying skill the only deciding factor of what kind plane the pilot will be put in?

Also, I'm pretty sure I already know the answer to this question, but is it harder to get a job flying fixed wing aircraft in the Air Force or the Navy?

Thanks, and sorry for the unspecific title (couldn't think of anything else to call it :confused:)

The better pilots don't always fly fighters, the needs of the service generally determines who fly's what. Granted, one must make the tailhook cut to fly jets/E-2/C-2 but it's not always consistent. Tailhook grades is defined at the top 50%. I think the great ones stand out later on in their career.
 
8 year obligation for all USN pilots which begins the day your pin your wings. For all the jet guys I know, this translates into 10 years of active duty since flight school takes 2 years for us. I am actually very junior compared to most of my buds who are tracking along with me, but by the time I wing next month, I will have been in flight school for 25 months. Most of my classmattes have been on AD for nearly 3 years now, and my Marine classmatte will pin Capt later this year about the time he starts the FRS/RAG. P-3 and helo guys typically run about 16-18 months in flight school, depending on class dates and how quickly they get through their flights in advanced.

If that's my nephew I was sure he would be a major.
 
The decision on what track you take is made about halfway through UPT, and your specific assignment is awarded a couple weeks before graduation. As MikeD said, what's available in your "drop" depends on the needs of the service, but who gets what within that drop is decided by what's called your MASS score and preference. (I think it stands for something like Merit Assignment Selection System).

As you might expect, everything at UPT is graded. Unless it's changed recently, checkrides count 40% of your MASS, daily flying grades 30%, flight commander ranking 20%, and academic performance 10%. Everything is straight-forward except for the flight commander ranking. It can be based on whatever he wants to base it on (helpfulness with the flight, additional duties, officership, leadership, physical fitness, whether he likes you or not). Some flight commanders take an active role in determining the flight commander rankings, others do not. Our flight commander did not change the rankings from what was computed from the other three weighted components, but that 20% he has discretion with can make a huge difference in the end, especially since the spread in scores can be very small among the top performers. Therefore, it pays to not piss off your IPs and flight commander, because even if you're the best stick in the flight, if you're a d-bag you're probably not going to get the assignment you want.

Once the final ranking are determined, the #1 student gets his first choice, the #2 student gets his #1 choice if available (otherwise #2 choice), and so on down the line. Generally, the T-38 (fighter/bomber) track is the most competitive, but if the #1 student in the flight wants to go T-1 (tanker/transport) track instead, that's what he gets. Other possibilities are to fly T-44s at Corpus Christi w/ the Navy (follow on=C130), or helicopters at Ft. Rucker. The MASS rankings for advanced phase are computed again and major weapon system assignments and handed out in similar fashon at the end of the program.
 
^ And to add on for a USN perspective (since OP said he would be interested):

- You do API (ground school and survival stuff at NAS Pensacola), then move along to primary at NAS Whiting Field, FL, NAS Corpus Christi, TX, or Vance AFB, Enid, OK (very few Navy types go here, but there are always a few). Whiting and Corpus are still flying the T-34C (though Whiting is getting it's first T-6B's as we speak), while Vance flies the T-6. I'm not entirely sure how they compute overall grades for the Navy guys at Vance, but at either of the NAS's you have what is called an NSS computed from all of your graded flight and simulator events. When you complete your last flight of primary, they tabulate your NSS and this is used pretty much exclusively to determine where you stand amongst your peers. Selection is done shortly thereafter, and is made on a weekly basis for the most part. Like the AF types, your grades, needs of the service, and personal requests are taken into account. IIRC the CO has some input, but from what I saw, he normally just endorsed whatever it was that you asked for (assuming your grades qualified you for it). Minimum score to select into the tailhook pipeline (jets and E2/C2) is a 50 NSS. Anything less than that, and you have to go helos, P-3's or E-6's (big 707 looking jet). Above a 50, and it can vary week to week what you get. I knew people who finished with 60+ NSS who didn't get tailhook because there just weren't any more slots their week. I also know lots of folks who were right around the low 50 mark who got it because they selected on a good week. Like Bunk22 said, there are plenty of good pilots out there who didn't get jets cause they had bad timing, or simply didn't want them.

For the guys who DO get tailhook, you move along to either NAS Meridian, MS, or NAS Kingsville, TX for intermediate jet training in the T-45. You do phase I (called Ijet) which normally takes around 6 months, and then another cut is made for those going E2/C2 or moving along to jets. There aren't that many slots for E2/C2, and so it normally comes down to those who request it or folks who had enough trouble in phase I that it makes sense for them not to continue on in phase II (advanced strike). If you go E2/C2, your next stop is to carrier qualify, and then you finish out training at NAS Corpus Christi in the T-44 doing multiengine prop stuff. If you continue on to phase II, you stay in the T-45, do all the advanced strike stuff, and carrier qualify normally somewhere towards the end of that. From there you wing and select Hornets, Super Hornets, Prowlers or Growlers. Again, grades, needs of the service, and Commander's input are all factors in this. At this stage of the game, it seems like these selections are a little bit more subjective in terms of your strengths and weaknesses in advanced, but I'm sure there is still mostly the element of availability and grades playing into it.

Anyway, hope that helps clear up questions you had about our side of training.
 
Okay, thanks guys. I guess it was pretty ignorant for me to say the best go to the fighters...

I'm probably just misunderstanding this, but did someone say that some AF pilots are based off of aircraft carriers?
 
Okay, thanks guys. I guess it was pretty ignorant for me to say the best go to the fighters...

I'm probably just misunderstanding this, but did someone say that some AF pilots are based off of aircraft carriers?

No, I was speaking to Navy and USMC training here. There have been a very small number of AF pilots to carrier qualify historically, but these guys have done it while on exchange tours flying Navy jets.
 
Question while on the topic......How do USAF guys go about getting carrier qual'd? I don't know if I will even have a chance in my career to do this but how does the process for something like this generally work? I think it would be a very neat thing to do.
 
Question while on the topic......How do USAF guys go about getting carrier qual'd? I don't know if I will even have a chance in my career to do this but how does the process for something like this generally work? I think it would be a very neat thing to do.

I know that Kingsville has taken several AF exchange instructor pilots (at least one U-2 guy, not sure about others), and they are able to get a training command qual in the T-45. I have also heard of AF guys in Hornets and Prowlers doing this, but I don't know any of the details re: how. I know my current skipper did an exchange in F-15C's, and normally those go both ways, so I would suspect whoever went Navy in that exchange probably had the opportunity to get the qual.
 
Question while on the topic......How do USAF guys go about getting carrier qual'd? I don't know if I will even have a chance in my career to do this but how does the process for something like this generally work? I think it would be a very neat thing to do.

I'm working on getting carrier qaul'd in the C-5 :pirate:

maybe I should finish getting qual'd period first......
 
AMG - On a side note, I was a DV on the Truman in January, and observed aviators doing their first solo quals in the hornets...One of the guys made maybe 7 passes before being sent back to the beach...Only landed once, and only got wheels on the deck once or twice...

I was told that if this was this guy (or girls) second attemp at quals, that would be it for him...He would lose his wings, and most likely have the option to seperate, as it is hard for him to join any other communitys, especially as an Officer, having failed out of aviation...

How much truth to that, and could you explain a little more of that process?

thanks.
 
I know that Kingsville has taken several AF exchange instructor pilots (at least one U-2 guy, not sure about others), and they are able to get a training command qual in the T-45. I have also heard of AF guys in Hornets and Prowlers doing this, but I don't know any of the details re: how. I know my current skipper did an exchange in F-15C's, and normally those go both ways, so I would suspect whoever went Navy in that exchange probably had the opportunity to get the qual.

So it's true... you guys do go both ways.
 
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