Should jtrain take recall?

dasleben · Feb 27, 2010

CRJDriver said:
How can you bypass when you are an involuntary furlough? You would be refusing work (assuming you are collecting unemployment) and would not be elgible to collect UI benefits.

Maybe the XJT contract is different. At Comair only the voluntary furloughs can bypass (up to 1 year). As an involuntary, you either take it or leave it!

XJT involuntary furloughs (there are no voluntary furloughs, actually) are eligible to bypass without a problem.

By the way, I really doubt most people collecting UI benefits would be bypassing. The only people I know bypassing have other jobs they don't want to leave just yet.

SlumTodd_Millionaire · Feb 27, 2010

You already know what I think. Stick with law school.

WacoFan · Feb 27, 2010

Whatever you do, don't do anything half-assed. If you can manage law school while working and you can do a good job of it, then that is an option (although I would get through your first year with no distractions). If you cannot manage to do both, then pick one - but whatever it is be excellent at it. If you remain in law school, be excellent at it. If you decide to become at janitor, be excellent at it. If you take the ExpressJet recall, be excellent at it.

The issue with ExpressJet, and other piloting jobs, is that they stress conformity and "excellence" is generally judged as being a unifom model of what the airline says you should be. Will this standard work for you long-term with the ego you have? Serious question. You have also made a point of saying that you goal is to devote your life to the poor using your law degree as the tool - how does this goal of helping the poor jibe with being a regional FO?

Whatever you do is irrelevant to me - just don't do anything half-assed. If you can manage law school part time and you think you can do it justice, that is probably an option I would explore.

Malko · Feb 27, 2010

I seriously doubt you give a rip what JC 'thinks' you should do, but with that being said it comes down to:

From a very high level:

Future $$$ .vs Present $$$

You would then have to break down into QOL, commute, time with Em, is ti worth it... etc......

If Em can support the two of you for now, then stay in school. If she cannot, take the recall and work law school into your schedule somehow.

I figure you'll stay in school so you can graduate and be able to 'stick it to the man....' Whoever that is.....

MQAAord · Feb 27, 2010

dasleben said:
XJT involuntary furloughs (there are no voluntary furloughs, actually) are eligible to bypass without a problem.

By the way, I really doubt most people collecting UI benefits would be bypassing. The only people I know bypassing have other jobs they don't want to leave just yet.

Ah, so a bypass is an option. You are fortunate to have that option!

WacoFan · Feb 27, 2010

JEP said:
I seriously doubt you give a rip what JC 'thinks' you should do, but with that being said it comes down to:

From a very high level:

Future $$$ .vs Present $$$

You would then have to break down into QOL, commute, time with Em, is ti worth it... etc......

If Em can support the two of you for now, then stay in school. If she cannot, take the recall and work law school into your schedule somehow.

I figure you'll stay in school so you can graduate and be able to 'stick it to the man....' Whoever that is.....

He was not getting into law school for the money though. He was doing it to help the poor. That was the stated goal. So, money now or money later is irrelevant - he is doomed to be poor (by his own choice). Given the track he wanted to take with the law, he may be the only law school student that has a career track that makes Regional FO look like a financial windfall.

mshunter · Feb 27, 2010

NO! A Law degree will be a much more stable career option. Why would you throw away what you have already spent what I am assuming to be a buttload of money on (law school) to just stop halfway through. Fly for fun. Listening to you on here, you are too good of an "attourney type" to leave that one alone.

Besides, you bitch about flying to much to be a paid pilot(now where was that sarcasim tag?).

ATC RET 2003 · Feb 27, 2010

jtrain609 said:
So here it is folks, you get to decide my fate!

jtrain609 said:
I wouldn't listen to anybody on here...

You're an adult, you can make decisions.

The rest of the world can piss off.

Become a flying lawyer.

twotwowoo · Feb 27, 2010

WacoFan said:
He was not getting into law school for the money though. He was doing it to help the poor. That was the stated goal. So, money now or money later is irrelevant - he is doomed to be poor (by his own choice). Given the track he wanted to take with the law, he may be the only law school student that has a career track that makes Regional FO look like a financial windfall.

:yeahthat:

If your goal is to help the poor, then stick with law school. Being a regional FO isn't going to help anybody.

Hootie · Feb 27, 2010

If it works out that you can do it just for the summer, then great. I know you are not going back, but if you did I will laugh at you when you are a 10 year fo on the jungle jet after coming back from your second furlough. The airlines are GREAT.......if you love spending half your life on the road.

twotwowoo · Feb 27, 2010

Hootie said:
If it works out that you can do it just for the summer, then great. I know you are not going back, but if you did I will laugh at you when you are a 10 year fo on the jungle jet after coming back from your second furlough. The airlines are GREAT.......if you love spending half your life on the road.

This post reminds me of one of my favorite anonymous quotes, that I'm sure applies to most pilots on this forum: "I love flying, I hate the aviation industry." Flying is awesome, flying for the airlines involves a LOT of sacrifice of things that are probably very important to you.

jrh · Feb 27, 2010

I've never understood why anyone would want to be an airline pilot *or* a lawyer, so any guidance I'd give would be worthless.

All I can say is, in the future, don't complain about where you put yourself. This is a point in your life where you're making the bed you'll have to lie in.

mtsu_av8er · Feb 27, 2010

On July 20th, 2009, didn't you say the following?

jtrain609 said:
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><meta name="ProgId" content="Word.Document"><meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 11"><meta name="Originator" content="Microsoft Word 11"><link rel="File-List" href="file:///C:%5CUsers%5CLloyd%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml"><link rel="Edit-Time-Data" href="file:///C:%5CUsers%5CLloyd%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_editdata.mso"><style>  </style> I'm done paying my bills by flying airplanes for a living

Or, was that just the cool thing to be saying at the time?
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twotwowoo · Feb 27, 2010

Didn't you also say:

jtrain609 said:
Screw airplanes, family matters more.

Take your own advice.

KLB · Feb 27, 2010

Do both! If you had the looks, you could get loads of tale. The lawyer/pilot look is a combo the ladies can't resist! Oh wait...you're married. Hmmmm. I'm not sure what you should do.

Seriously though. Stretch out the furlough as long as you can to get as close as you can to finishing the law degree. Then see if you can work a schedule that allows you to do the law school deal part time until you get it finished. That way you have a back up plan to this chaotic aviation industry.

Remember the grass is always greener. Thats why one of my former students who is a lawyer wishes he was a professional pilot.

Malko · Feb 27, 2010

WacoFan said:
He was not getting into law school for the money though. He was doing it to help the poor. That was the stated goal. So, money now or money later is irrelevant - he is doomed to be poor (by his own choice). Given the track he wanted to take with the law, he may be the only law school student that has a career track that makes Regional FO look like a financial windfall.

It is very relevant.

His present dollars now are ($0) in he has no job. His future dollars would likely be more.

If he accepts his recall, then his present dollars would be ($0 + Xjet salary).

Again, depending on whether or not Em can support the both of them could help in the decision...

falconvalley · Feb 27, 2010

Ask yourself why you want to do either. I know a couple lawyers and from what I've seen, it's a somewhat stable career, but neither of them are bathing in money. One of them is still paying off school, 10 years later. The hardest thing for me in that decision would be knowing that going back to flying is taking a chance that there will be no movement for me. I've been furloughed for about as long as you and I'm going back on the 8th. At this point, my wife and I actually do better financially with me on the street. I do bid for Guard trips, but those aren't guaranteed and I can only count on drill pay. But having me as Mr. Mom is saving us $1500/month in child care. The pros of me going back are:

1. I get to do something outside the house regularly
2. Alison and Natalie get to spend more time with other kids at daycare

Cons:

1. Nearly all of my year 1 FO salary is going to go to child care
2. My schedule will initially take over rather than just give me a little me time

I have loved flying as far back as I can remember. If I could have any job, it would involve flying. My wife is envious that I look forward to work. My joy of the job makes the time away from home tolerable, but I'll always be looking for more time off.

Would I quit school? Depends entirely on how much my heart was in it and how difficult it would be for me to finish, down the road.

dasleben · Feb 27, 2010

You know guys, for a while I was considering law school myself, but really, lawyers really don't make as much money as you think they do. Unless you're top of your class at Harvard Law, you're not getting a six-figure job at a big firm. You're more likely to get hired on at ~$50,000-$60,000/year (if you're lucky) and work at that salary for a few years before moving up.

It's not a clear cut decision in my mind at all. Staying at an airline could be better financially. Nobody stays a regional FO for the entirety of their careers.

sr22driver · Feb 27, 2010

Coming from someone who quit the dream to make money. Follow your passion. If it is the law then finish school, get a job make enough to pay off the loans, buy a house and a Porsche. Spend copious amounts of time at the office and in a few years make partner then buy an airplane and find the time to fly it.
Or go back to the jet spend copious amounts of time away from home try and figure out when there will be enough money to pay off the loans, scrape together enough money to put a down payment on a house and forget the porsche for a while.
Just don't be the guy 7 years later that is just going through the motions at work and thinks about how to get back into _________. It's not going to be easy on the spouse when she can tell you gave up _______ for ________. And make DAMN SURE that you can live with the choice.
I hope this helped

MikeD · Feb 27, 2010

John,

Go back to ExpressJet. Two reasons:

1) You will again have the credibility to comment on contract/union matters in the Airline Pilot forum here, since you'll be back on the front line and have a stake in the matter.

2) The naysayers who are also regional piots just want you out of their way on their rise to the top when the national seniority list comes out.....

Should jtrain take recall?

That's just, like, your opinion, man

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That's just, like, your opinion, man

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