Daughter of the Texas plane crash Pilot says...

poser765 said:
All I am trying to say is I would be a lot more perceptive to someones point when they make it in a way that doesn't kill people.
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But would you have heard his point if he didn't? Would any of us know who Joe Stack was if he just wrote a 'letter to the editor' of some local newspaper? That is just about the only way to be heard these days, and nobody cares 2 seconds after they set the paper down. Writing your congressman doesn't do anything. Voting is nonsense. You can't reserve 10 minutes on CNN to address the nation. In his letter he explained the harsh reality that nobody listens, nobody is heard, unless there is a body count. It is unfortunate, but true. Unless you are some massive public figure who probably has far less things to complain about than a middle-class person in this country, you have nowhere to be heard. This guy spent most of his life trying to be heard. He finally settled on this last act to try and make his point at least noticed in the least.

I won't dismiss someone's argument if they kill people or not. Everything should be heard, even if it is from a lunatic or a completely sane person. The problem, though is that just about nothing is heard by anybody. Ignoring ideas based on how they are presented isn't the way I would want to live.
 
jasoN534ER said:
But would you have heard his point if he didn't? Would any of us know who Joe Stack was if he just wrote a 'letter to the editor' of some local newspaper? That is just about the only way to be heard these days, and nobody cares 2 seconds after they set the paper down. Writing your congressman doesn't do anything. Voting is nonsense. You can't reserve 10 minutes on CNN to address the nation. In his letter he explained the harsh reality that nobody listens, nobody is heard, unless there is a body count. It is unfortunate, but true. Unless you are some massive public figure who probably has far less things to complain about than a middle-class person in this country, you have nowhere to be heard. This guy spent most of his life trying to be heard. He finally settled on this last act to try and make his point at least noticed in the least.

I won't dismiss someone's argument if they kill people or not. Everything should be heard, even if it is from a lunatic or a completely sane person. The problem, though is that just about nothing is heard by anybody. Ignoring ideas based on how they are presented isn't the way I would want to live.
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Sorry, but he had more chance to be heard now than anyone ever did in the past, what with the internet, blogs, etc. I'm not buying the "this was the only way he could get noticed" argument. He chose to be heard in a very dramatic, and criminal way. That says something about his mental state, and I can't put much stock in the opinions of someone who also holds the opinion that killing people to make a point is an appropriate thing to do.
 
troopernflight said:
He's definitely no hero to us general aviator's. That knuckle head is going to make our lives much more difficult when try to rent a plane. Let's see how long it takes Washington to get their hands on this one.
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Yet it's still easy to rent a Ryder truck... sigh.
 
poser765 said:
You realize that describes like 3/4 of the united states population. Most of them aren't flying planes into people. This is NOT the event to wake us up to the dangers of our government. This is an event to mercilessly ridicule that ass hole who killed someone because of their own selfishness
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Not sure where you got your statistic, but I'm willing to bet it's not very accurate. But then again, 92.35% of all statistics are made up anyhow.

I'm not saying he did the right thing necessarily, but angry, desperate people do angry, desperate things. I don't know his side of the story and I'm not going to judge him even if I did, that's not for me to do. It is an unfortunate situation with tragic results.

What are you hoping to prove or achieve by ridiculing him?
 
Xiph said:
He only wins if we acknowledge his problems by instituting the change he wanted ("we should change the tax code because it drove this guy to fly an airplane into a building").
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Kind of like the terrorists have won post-9/11, since they've caused us to change SO many of our ways here, particularly as it comes to air travel, even though air travel security wasn't a failure in 9/11.

Point is, we already let people.....in the Queda case, terrorists......win.

Nothing new.
 
Holocene said:
"But these enemies of mine, who did not want me to reign over them, bring them here and slay them in my presence".

-Jesus Christ (Luke 19:27)
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WHAT? That can't be true! Jesus? Murder? For not believing what he thinks is right? Nooooooooooooooooo. Was his middle name Mohammed?
 
MQAAord said:
A lot of people are very angry at the government right now. VERY angry. In no way are this man's actions justified, but it shows just how angry & frustrated people are getting.

Personally, I'm of the opinion that offing yourself in some stupid prank is easy, but working hard to make real change in a cause you believe in, now THAT'S hard. It's so hard most people would rather sit around & complain than actually take any actions towards it. Some people take some action, like writing their representatives or something, and get discouraged quickly when nothing happens, then they feel like they can't make a difference no matter what. Instead of persevering & working some end up going off the deep end and doing something incredibly stupid (like flying their plane into a building) because they feel like they have no other recourse.
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:yeahthat:

FiveO said:
Too bad he didn't lose an engine on upwind and just create his own smoking hole.
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:yeahthat:
 
modernicarus said:
Not sure where you got your statistic, but I'm willing to bet it's not very accurate. But then again, 92.35% of all statistics are made up anyhow.

I'm not saying he did the right thing necessarily, but angry, desperate people do angry, desperate things. I don't know his side of the story and I'm not going to judge him even if I did, that's not for me to do. It is an unfortunate situation with tragic results.

What are you hoping to prove or achieve by ridiculing him?
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My statistic come right out of my bum. I THINK you kind of figured that though. The [point I was trying to make is that there are a LOT of unhappy and hopeless people in the world. And LOTS of them don't go around killing people.

Yes angry desperate people do angry and esperate things, but when they do they're plight is of little concern to me when they start killing people. I don't care about his side of the story. I really could care less about his angst or anyones else's who do what he did. What I WILL judge him on is the actions that lead to another's death.

And what I am hoping to achieve with ridicule is to make sure people remember he was a selfish murderer...not an extremely dedicated political activists who changed our lives for the better.
 
If he were a real man, he would have done it Buddhist style: find a nice, clear sitting space in front of the IRS building, douse self in gasoline and calmly light self on fire and roast.

The guy scared his family so much they ran off to hotel, then he burned down his house and flew a plane into a building with the intent to kill. He was clearly nuts. The reasons he chose his target are totally irrelevant. His behavior was inexcusable.

And it was terrorism. Not organized, international terrorism, sure, but terrorism nonetheless. For those saying it isn't, how big of a plane would the guy have needed access to for it to have been terrorism? A Seminole? A Meridian? Maybe a Caravan? Would an Eclipse have counted because it has jets? Maybe if he had loaded the tanks with fertilizer instead of something flammable like, I don't know, avgas?
 
I think terrorism has more to do with having a goal of instilling fear in people. Although it looked like what we all think is 'terrorism,' I wouldn't say he was trying to scare the people of the nation and make everyone feel terrorized, like what happens when al qaeda attacks us. Maybe we can call it 'Attentionism' since he wanted to be heard and he wanted his ideas known, it seems, more than he wanted to make everyone fear for their lives. It is more of an act of rebellion than terrorism, I have to say.
 
ILS37R said:
And it was terrorism. Not organized, international terrorism, sure, but terrorism nonetheless. For those saying it isn't, how big of a plane would the guy have needed access to for it to have been terrorism? A Seminole? A Meridian? Maybe a Caravan? Would an Eclipse have counted because it has jets? Maybe if he had loaded the tanks with fertilizer instead of something flammable like, I don't know, avgas?
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:yeahthat:

It's getting a little disturbing to see how readily people are willing to bend their definition of "terrorist" when they can relate or sympathize with their cause and it's no longer a black and white America vs. foreign "evildoers" scenario.
 
Ugh!

So why don't we argue for what is really going on in this world? Why don't we see daily accounts of our country's actions abroad. Two wars going on and I don't recall the last true news story I watched about either of them. We have mentally and/or physically wounded veterans who will raise their voices long after the fires have been quelled.

We are satisfied with our cable, video games, etc, passified and relaxed in our safe coccoons. Falsely feeling safe from evildoers. Rights eroded and a blind eye turned.

This guy was no hero. I don't defend him. Unfortunately he felt this was his only recourse. It is sad that as a country we have come to this point. After World War 2 we have lost so much prominence which we had at that time. For whatever reason our nation is softer, weaker, poorer, and definitely not what our founding fathers envisioned nor cast the mold for what they believed in.

Late Night Rant Off.
 
jasoN534ER said:
I think terrorism has more to do with having a goal of instilling fear in people.
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If that was the case I think Al Qaeda would just stick to taking hostages and making scary videotapes. After all it saves a lot of money on flight training and business class tickets. When they plot for years to topple two of the world's tallest buildings that housed 50,000+ people on a given day I'd say they're pretty hell bent on causing as much death and destruction as possible.
 
SurferLucas said:
I have on good authority that "we" didn't drop the bomb...it was actually WHALE AND DOLPHIN! OMG!

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My sources said it was CHICKEN AND COW!
 
JordanD said:
If that was the case I think Al Qaeda would just stick to taking hostages and making scary videotapes. After all it saves a lot of money on flight training and business class tickets. When they plot for years to topple two of the world's tallest buildings that housed 50,000+ people on a given day I'd say they're pretty hell bent on causing as much death and destruction as possible.
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That death and destruction can serve two purposes for them. One is just what you said - death and destruction, but the other, less obvious one is chaos and fear. I think they also had a pretty good idea that it would hurt the economy quite badly, too. I don't think anyone can say that they just wanted to kill and destroy without making the country feel fear.

They also kidnap whoever they can and then behead them. Its just that not too many people (who they want to kill) are kidnap-able in that part of the world, which is why it is always some journalist getting his head sawed off. I wouldn't be afraid of getting beheaded if I just stayed here, so they need to attack us somehow to make us feel fear and danger where we live. Of course, that isn't their number one goal, but the idea of terrorism is that you are making people feel fear, not that you are just blowing up buildings, otherwise, demolition crews would be terrorists, too.

It is just an argument of semantics and the english language. Everyone interprets words differently, I just happen to think that terrorism has more to do with the motive than just the act itself.
 
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