Offshoot: FAA DUI Policy thread

falconvalley

falconvalley

Absentee Dad of the OOTSK, Runner, Cat Frustrator
Driving drunk sounds harsh to me. I know there are a few peeps out there who are "token" drunk drivers. They felt fine at around .08 and under and got pulled over on a technicality and the officer rewarded them with a alcohol related offense on record. They will still have to go through the motions. It's all about making sure the public is safe from people who shouldn't be flying. The FAA's system for figuring the difference between those who just made a mistake and those who have a problem and just haven't been caught at their "low" yet is to take a good look at them. Counseling and extra paperwork doesn't seem to be much to ask for a break from the FAA. Anyone got a problem with that? I like feeling that my wife and kids are safe on the road in one of the most dangerous states in the Nation for drunk drivers.
 
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A real good friend of mine got pulled over last year for a DUI, he's spent about 20k so far, and the cost of his SR22 is going to be brutal. I think its a little harsh when he was pulled over for a tail light being out. One size fits all is a little ridiculous, I think it should be up to the officer whether you have to blow or not.
 
Re: FAA DUI Policy

falconvalley said:
I like feeling that my wife and kids are safe on the road in one of the most dangerous states in the Nation for drunk drivers.
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I'm sure I'd like feeling that way, too. But what does it have to do with medical certification procedures for airmen with DUIs?
 
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Forget the Baby Boomers and age 65! That sounds like a WHOLE lot of pilots with past instances ( EVER) will be ineliglble to fly in 60 days or face the wrath of the FAA. Makes no difference if found guilty or not as I read it.
 
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My Flight Surgeon said:
The DUI represents the personality trait to make foolish decisions and to ignore the "rules". The data I have seen indicates alcohol is the one of the common causes of accidents.
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Ahhhh!!!!! The 'ole personality disorder diagnosis. To those of you who get caught.....welcome to my world fellas. It's a helluva process. Google HIMS; read, study, and inwardly digest.

Cheers!:beer:



atp


P.S. - Ok that wasn't funny; but I couldn't resist.:rotfl:
 
Re: FAA DUI Policy

My Flight Surgeon said:
Airmen must now report arrests, convictions, and administrative actions by checking “yes” at line 18.v of FAA Form 8500-8.
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While I'm not planning on drinking and driving, it's the arrest or administrative actions that scares me. Let's say I'm arrested for suspicion of DUI. I submit to my breath or blood test, and I'm released. I'm not charged with anything. But I still get "punished" by this anyway.

I still end up automatically having a medical deferred, or paying to prove I did nothing wrong in the first place.

If that sounds far fetched, it really isn't. Since I won't do a voluntary field sobriety test, the odds of me getting arrested are pretty good. They aren't required by law, so I won't do one on principal.
 
Re: FAA DUI Policy

Ok....let me redeem myself.

This is a very serious matter. Believe me when I tell you, the FAA leaves no stone unturn when it comes to having the Office of General Counsel of the FAA to investigate your background. So, if you have something that you previously didn't report and you get a DUI or some other kind of alcohol/susbstance abuse related arrest, be assured....just as Dr. Forred said.....your renewal will be differed to OKC and possibly Washington DC.

If it goes to DC, get ready; you will be investigated and the decision to renew your medical will be delayed....possibly months. No joke.



atp
 
Re: FAA DUI Policy

drunkenbeagle said:
While I'm not planning on drinking and driving, it's the arrest or administrative actions that scares me. Let's say I'm arrested for suspicion of DUI. I submit to my breath or blood test, and I'm released. I'm not charged with anything. But I still get "punished" by this anyway.

I still end up automatically having a medical deferred, or paying to prove I did nothing wrong in the first place.

If that sounds far fetched, it really isn't. Since I won't do a voluntary field sobriety test, the odds of me getting arrested are pretty good. They aren't required by law, so I won't do one on principal.
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You refuse to ever do any field sobriety test (because you're sober), therefore you have to submit extra paperwork to the FAA. Sounds like this is your issue. It's your life/career/job/money/time, be as principled as you want. Doesn't bother me a bit.
 
Re: FAA DUI Policy

Clocks said:
You refuse to ever do any field sobriety test (because you're sober), therefore you have to submit extra paperwork to the FAA. Sounds like this is your issue. It's your life/career/job/money/time, be as principled as you want. Doesn't bother me a bit.
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I am not legally required to do so, so I won't. For the same reason if the police ask to search my house, the answer is no, show me a warrant.

It should bother you by the way. I have no sympathy for drunk drivers. I think they should Lose their licenses for life. But I am not going to voluntarily give up my rights either.

I just do not like any guilty until innocent system. It follows you the rest off your life. I think focusing on the actual convictions is a better use of time, and represent the real problems out there.
 
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Clocks said:
You refuse to ever do any field sobriety test (because you're sober), therefore you have to submit extra paperwork to the FAA. Sounds like this is your issue. It's your life/career/job/money/time, be as principled as you want. Doesn't bother me a bit.
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Just so you know...

Refusal to submit to a field sobriety test (or give a breath/blood sample) automatically results in a six month suspension of driving privileges in most states, regardless of whether or not you are convicted of a DWI/DUI charge. Even if the DWI/DUI charge is dismissed in the criminal action, the state can and will suspend your driving privileges for lack of submission.
 
Re: FAA DUI Policy

drunkenbeagle said:
I am not legally required to do so, so I won't. For the same reason if the police ask to search my house, the answer is no, show me a warrant.

It should bother you by the way. I have no sympathy for drunk drivers. I think they should Lose their licenses for life. But I am not going to voluntarily give up my rights either.

I just do not like any guilty until innocent system. It follows you the rest off your life. I think focusing on the actual convictions is a better use of time, and represent the real problems out there.
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Pilots are held to a different standard when it comes to alcohol and motor vehicles. So are politicians (except the Kennedys), and I'm sure you could find more examples. Don't like it? /shrug... I don't write the rules. One less resume in the pile with mine anyway.
 
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killbilly said:
Just so you know...

Refusal to submit to a field sobriety test (or give a breath/blood sample) automatically results in a six month suspension of driving privileges in most states, regardless of whether or not you are convicted of a DWI/DUI charge. Even if the DWI/DUI charge is dismissed in the criminal action, the state can and will suspend your driving privileges for lack of submission.
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The distinction here is "sobriety test required by law." Field sobriety tests generally are not required by law. Breath/blood/urine tests are the ones that generally are.

Declining to take a field sobriety test will NOT result in your license being suspended in Florida. You will most likely be arrested, then are required to take a Breathalyzer, and assuming you haven't been drinking, get released the next day.

I don't drink and drive, my point is though, at least in FL, by taking a breathalyzer and passing, an arrest is involved to even get to that point. They only do breath tests at the jail here. By doing the test and passing, you are already in trouble with the FAA.
 
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drunkenbeagle: Stop making waves and just present your papers like the rest of the proles, or it will go on your Permanent Record!
 
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How does the FAA view alcohol related arrests that don't involve driving? I am asking because I know of a Corporate Captain that was arrested for Public Intoxication, Lewd conduct and trespassing. I won't go into the details but the situation is the epitome of poor decision making. Does this incident need to be reported or does the FAA only concern itself with DUI?

Just curious.
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From my experience they will deffer any alcohol related convictions. Including underages that happened awhile ago. But from my experience with a underage they grant it as long as you sent in all the papers and dont require you to get a substance abuse evaluation. They just send you a letter saying if you ever do it again you will be forced to under go alcohol evaulations.

Refusal to submit to a field sobriety test (or give a breath/blood sample) automatically results in a six month suspension of driving privileges in most states, regardless of whether or not you are convicted of a DWI/DUI charge. Even if the DWI/DUI charge is dismissed in the criminal action, the state can and will suspend your driving privileges for lack of submission.
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Actually in most states you are only required to take a field sobreity test if you are under 21 or on parole. If over 21 and not on parole you have the right to refuse and no penality can be assessed against you. Here in Ohio you have the right to counsel before blowing. The choice to blow or not depends on what you hope to get out of it. If you know you are going to blow over the limit and a DUI could hurt your career than dont blow. But the consequences of now blowing is losing your license for a year because of the implied consent law. But the advantages to now blowing is it generally takes about 2 hours from time they arrest you till they can get a warrant for a blood test. During those two hours if you were just over the limit it is possible that by time they do the test you will be under the limit and you will get out of the DUI. You will still loose your license for a year but you wont have the DUI on your record. With the new changes in the wording to arresst though, you still may loose your medical because of this even if not convicted.
 
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Those laws vary by state. From the lawyers I have spoke with they all say don't take the field sobriety test and don't take a breathalizer.

I'd be interested in hearing an aviation lawyer's opinion on this.
 
Re: FAA DUI Policy

Bandit_Driver said:
Those laws vary by state. From the lawyers I have spoke with they all say don't take the field sobriety test and don't take a breathalizer.
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...if you've been drinking, so that you can pay them thousands of dollars to go to court and lose.

And because Mr. Drunky has nothing to lose by denying a field sobriety test, and their body naturally destroys the evidence on the way to the police station, the FAA wants to know about it.
 
Re: FAA DUI Policy

Clocks said:
...if you've been drinking, so that you can pay them thousands of dollars to go to court and lose.

And because Mr. Drunky has nothing to lose by denying a field sobriety test, and their body naturally destroys the evidence on the way to the police station, the FAA wants to know about it.
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I know many people that have had DUI's in the .01 to .04 range. The video of them balancing poorly on one leg didn't help matters.

In court, the police will "estimate" what your BAC would have been how ever many hours in the past, so it doesn't really matter that much.
 
Re: FAA DUI Policy

drunkenbeagle said:
While I'm not planning on drinking and driving, it's the arrest or administrative actions that scares me. Let's say I'm arrested for suspicion of DUI. I submit to my breath or blood test, and I'm released. I'm not charged with anything. But I still get "punished" by this anyway.
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If you mean simply being handcuffed while the officer does his thing on teh spot that is not being arressted. The way it's been explained to me.
 
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