Descent Below VASI on Approach

Zero1Niner

Zero1Niner

Well-Known Member
Seem to recall a discussion with someone telling me that it was in the FAR's or AIM that it is not permitted to descend below VASI at night on an approach.

I cant find any reference to this in either the FAR or AIM. Anyone have any idea what the deal is with this? Is this a fact or fiction?
 
91.129 (e) (3) Each pilot operating an airplane approaching to land on a runway served by a visual approach slope indicator must maintain an altitude at or above the glide path until a lower altitude is necessary for a safe landing.

...through language in 91.130 and 91.131, it also applies in class C and B airspace.

-mini
 
minitour said:
91.129 (e) (3) Each pilot operating an airplane approaching to land on a runway served by a visual approach slope indicator must maintain an altitude at or above the glide path until a lower altitude is necessary for a safe landing.

...through language in 91.130 and 91.131, it also applies in class C and B airspace.

-mini
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Thanks Mini! Your like a machine!!
 
matt152 said:
Liquid metal.

I wonder why PAPIs are not included in this reg? Anyone got an idea?
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I believe when they say "visual approach slope indicator" it is a generic term covering PAPIs and all sorts of weird flashy thingys that indicate your target slope.
 
jynxyjoe said:
You again?

Could someone please bring up shock cooling?
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:D

One I remember from long ago were guys arguing over falling out of an airplane with no parachute.....how you'd suffer "windburn" of up to 2nd degree burns to exposed skin areas from the freefall wind blast. :)
 
MikeD said:
:D

One I remember from long ago were guys arguing over falling out of an airplane with no parachute.....how you'd suffer "windburn" of up to 2nd degree burns to exposed skin areas from the freefall wind blast. :)
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Quickly, someone bring up those POS Cirrus's and their GD parachutes.

Oops, I did it again.
 
jynxyjoe said:
Quickly, someone bring up those POS Cirrus's and their GD parachutes.

Oops, I did it again.
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133 kts to pull the chute? How does that work after a wing falls off at 180 kts?

At an 800' AGL TPA, or at about 500' for that dreaded base-final turn, how far below the ground will the airplane be before the chute is fully deployed?


FYI:
"The minimum demonstrated altitude loss for a CAPS deployment from a one-turn spin is 920 feet."
:deadhorse: :D I love playing the antagonist.
 
MikeD said:
Yes. The term is generic and is inclusive of most of the systems covered here:

http://forums.jetcareers.com/technical-talk/30702-mikeds-tech-tips-3-vasi-review.html
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Mike,
VASI is not generic for the other systems. The generic term is VGSI (Visual Glideslope Indicator) which includes VASI, PAPI, Pulsating Systems, Tri-color Systems, and Alignment of Elements Systems. IOTW, a PAPI is not a type of VASI, it's a type of VGSI.

I know many use VASI in a generic sense, but in a letter from FAA Regional Counsel, they state that the term VASI in 91.175 (visual references for descent below DA/MDA), does not allow for substitution by other systems, to include PAPI.

Gary
 
ghogue said:
Mike,
VASI is not generic for the other systems. The generic term is VGSI (Visual Glideslope Indicator) which includes VASI, PAPI, Pulsating Systems, Tri-color Systems, and Alignment of Elements Systems. IOTW, a PAPI is not a type of VASI, it's a type of VGSI.

I know many use VASI in a generic sense, but in a letter from FAA Regional Counsel, they state that the term VASI in 91.175 (visual references for descent below DA/MDA), does not allow for substitution by other systems, to include PAPI.

Gary
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Its a generic term in the sense of how pilots use it. Not the technical definition. Yes, its a VGSI, but I was referring to the common nomenclature.

Unfortunately for the FAA, and for pilots, many airports have IAPs where there is no VASI, but more often PAPI or one of the other VGSIs (OLS, for instance). In this case a pilot is more than likely going to use that in conjunction with other visual references, and it would be transparant to everyone concerned.
 
ghogue said:
I know many use VASI in a generic sense, but in a letter from FAA Regional Counsel, they state that the term VASI in 91.175 (visual references for descent below DA/MDA), does not allow for substitution by other systems, to include PAPI.

Gary
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Got a copy of the letter?
 
Just asking the question: Why would you want to descend below the VASI? Do you need a rule to say that? :confused:
 
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