Two aircraft collide over Coolidge, AZ

All the Phoenix practice areas are a nightmare. They were a accident waiting to happen with inconsistent reporting points.

I always said in my time there that we should have used the PHX and or IWA VOR radials for position reports instead of "Cessna XXX over the hole inbound for Casa Grande"
 
big_news_1 said:
EDIT: After looking at AFTW.org again, I see there is a specific recommended radio procedure for the GPS 23.
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When I was working out there I attended the AFTW meetings. Normally we had guys from the TRACON and some of the towers as well. It was VERY productive and a huge benefit to safety. The procedure for the GPS 23 was actually written at one of the meetings I was at.

The problem stems from there just being a huge number of aircraft in the area, many of them being training flights with either students who are fixating on just flying the plane, or instructors who are really busy trying to teach and not paying attention out side as much as they should. Also, as was stated, there are multiple frequencies to monitor and there aren't always clear cut instructions as to when to monitor which one.
 
I did the majority of my training in the Phoenix area, instructed for years in Arizona (including instructing at Oxford), and unfortunately am not surprised this happened. Those practice areas are so congested and to find a place not in use you have to fly through many areas that are. Also, shooting approaches into Casa Grande is a nightmare. The stack on oneside with everybody trying to get an ILS and people shooting approaches to the opposite runway. I had my closest near midair pretty close to where this happened. I just don't see how this can change though. There are so many flight schools in a small vicinity with limited areas to practice. Keep your eyes open in the best advice.

I'm absolutely amazed anybody survived in the Cessna, and even more amazed they apparantly don't have life threatening injuries. RIP to the one student killed.

One question: was there an instructor onboard the Oxford plane? I'm assuming there was, and if so I'm assuming I probably know them (I still have a few friends working there). Does anybody know who was instructing? If so, can you PM me their initials or name? Thanks.
 
i agree its not just the south practice area. The north is bad too. The area north of SDL, between DVT and and the practice area is another accident waiting to happen.
 
sigmanu499 said:
i agree its not just the south practice area. The north is bad too. The area north of SDL, between DVT and and the practice area is another accident waiting to happen.
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Yup. Just lots of congestion that one must do their best to work through. I used to fly MTR VR-239 often back in the A-10 days, which started south of Lake Pleasant and went east around the Class B towards Pichacho Peak. Passing through the PHX VFR transition and getting released to the north, I'd come on freq and make regular position reports passing over DVT and approaching the Pleasant area, and there'd often be a large amount of training traffic. Just had to do the best to see, avoid, and communicate.
 
I instructed at DVT for about a year. Once I was flying north just southwest of Buckeye with a student. I was monitoring the Buckeye CTAF and looking for the 3 airplanes in the pattern.

We were right over the interstate (I-10? 1-8?) that comes from LA into Phoenix and out of the corner of my eye I saw a Cessna that couldn't have been more than 100 feet below us cross directly under the right main gear of our airplane.

I yelled some cuss words and asked my student if he had seen that plane approaching since I was looking the other direction. He said he had no idea there was anybody near us. I don't know if the other guy saw us or if it was dumb luck that I'm still alive.
 
Wow, I just talked to my old CFI I did my PPL and began my Instrument with when I heard this on the radio yesterday. When I was starting my Instrument we took a 172 to Coolidge from Glendale (via Air Safety actually) did some shortfields at Coolidge and were heading back to Glendale at 4500. Guy in another 172 heading SE was at 4500 as well with his head stuck in the map. I saw him coming right to left out of the corner of my eye, immediately pushed the yoke as a gut reaction, but we were already at cruise power, so basically we went weightless. A split second after this my CFI sees him and yanks power and we sink like a rock, probably missed the other guy by 80 yards...Scariest moment of my short flying life so far. Needless to say some heated calls were made on CTAF but no answer...I remember he was wearing sunglasses and had a mustache. I said to my instructor that someone was going to die out here sometime because of this...sad to see I was proven right.

Be safe folks.
 
I flew at Air Safety for many years, flying back and forth to geu p08. always head on a swivel. Now I live in Coolidge, and it amazes me the amount of traffic in the area. When I would fly around the area shooting approaches or practice it seemed manageible, buk now knowing the sheer volume, its scary! I've been thinking lately how much fun it would be to go back to GA flying, but incidents like this make me happy im flying for skywest, in a more controlled enviroment

does anyone know the location of the accident, street names, land marks, distance or direction from airport, or downtown?
 
phoenixflyer said:
I flew at Air Safety for many years, flying back and forth to geu p08. always head on a swivel. Now I live in Coolidge, and it amazes me the amount of traffic in the area. When I would fly around the area shooting approaches or practice it seemed manageible, buk now knowing the sheer volume, its scary! I've been thinking lately how much fun it would be to go back to GA flying, but incidents like this make me happy im flying for skywest, in a more controlled enviroment

does anyone know the location of the accident, street names, land marks, distance or direction from airport, or downtown?
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I live just north of town there.

Appeared to be just east of town, eastbound on Coolidge Ave, northwest of the airport. Appears to possibly one plane heading to P08, the other departing.
 
I can't say I'm surprised on a couple different levels.

As far as practice area co-ordination goes, if you're ever around DVT, tune the frequency for the NW on the weekends when the weekend warriors head out there. Listening to that for even 15 minutes makes me want to wait for them to touch down and smack them upside the head with a book on proper radio etiquette. Some of them use it as their own personal frequency to shoot the breeze with the other guys. Others use words that make even "non-standard" unsuitable to describe them.
 
Scandinavian13 said:
I can't say I'm surprised on a couple different levels.

As far as practice area co-ordination goes, if you're ever around DVT, tune the frequency for the NW on the weekends when the weekend warriors head out there. Listening to that for even 15 minutes makes me want to wait for them to touch down and smack them upside the head with a book on proper radio etiquette. Some of them use it as their own personal frequency to shoot the breeze with the other guys. Others use words that make even "non-standard" unsuitable to describe them.
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Hell, listen to darn near any transpac plane around DVT with the unintelligable speaker, speaking broken english, and keying the mike for 30 seconds to do so; thus garbaging up the air with his crappy non-understandable transmission.
 
Not too surprised this happened as well. Had a close call myself in the northeast practice are over Rio Verde community. At the left corner of my eye I saw a 172 that could not have been more than a 100 ft away at my altitude (4500ft) zipping by in a bank. The cessna was so close that I could have seen his tail number. It was sheer luck that our wingtips did not touch.

After this incident I realized that you could be doing all your radio calls and looking out but someone could come from a blind spot and thats who is going to kill you.

RIP to the deceased pilot and fly safe out there.
 
WTF???

"saw one of the two men on board the Cessna jump to his death from the aircraft"

Anyone?
 
About a week after the Hudson incident, I was dooing slow flight, just east of Rio Verde, when my student yelled traffic. I looked over to his side and it was maybe 500 feet away, maybe closer, I don't know. But I do know we were on a collision course and that in the 100 degree heat in slow flight my plane wasn't going to climb for . The quickest way to move was to flip it over on its back, dive and pull out in the other direction. As I was doing it, I mean I was almost waiting for the impact it was so close. The eariest thing (pardon the spelling) was hearing my student screaming like he was going to die as we were diving towards the ground. It was his first flight. If you hear someone in the practice area making calls every three minutes its probably me lol.
 
rockman2343@aol.com said:
About a week after the Hudson incident, I was dooing slow flight, just east of Rio Verde, when my student yelled traffic. I looked over to his side and it was maybe 500 feet away, maybe closer, I don't know. But I do know we were on a collision course and that in the 100 degree heat in slow flight my plane wasn't going to climb for . The quickest way to move was to flip it over on its back, dive and pull out in the other direction. As I was doing it, I mean I was almost waiting for the impact it was so close. The eariest thing (pardon the spelling) was hearing my student screaming like he was going to die as we were diving towards the ground. It was his first flight. If you hear someone in the practice area making calls every three minutes its probably me lol.
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Commonly called a split-S :D:D

Good job evading the traffic and staying alive to tell about it.
 
And to that note. For all the SE Valley traffic, the aerobatic box and training area for Chandler Air Service is located just east of the Santan peak and runs from the Hunt Highway, down towards Sacaton from 5500 and below. Just a heads up, as we are there quite a bit. We have been trying to stay up on 122.85 as much as possible to put out our position and to listen for traffic, but sometimes need to go to Phx App due to the issues with the heavy traffic going into Willie. Just a friendly reminder if you could pass on the information. Have had many the close call with Sabena and Transpac... others too, but your planes stand out.... Anyways, heads up and we will do the same... thx..
 
Huh I have about 50 hours in that 152 when it was based in Cali. Small world.

=Jason-
 
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