Unions

3enginejock

3enginejock

Well-Known Member
First I would like to say I am not for or against unions. IMO they do good things and bad things.

My question is what good is a union if they decide to strike and the company simply fires anyone who strikes? AKA Amerijet.

The Amerijet union has recieved approval to strike and the companies response was they are going to fire anyone who strikes... Im curious what the reasoning is there. If I was an employee at that company id be asking myself if its worth it to strike when all that I am going to get out of it is an unemployment check and lose my job.

In this economy I would not be surprised if Amerijet is able to replace anyone they fire quickly.
 
It's an empty threat. If a majority of the pilot group strikes (virtually certain), then the company will have no choice but to deal or watch the airline destroy itself. They'll deal, and any terminations will be overturned as part of the contract settlement. My bet is that they get a deal before they even strike.
 
Unless a Company has scab pilots (our enough management pilots) waiting in the wings, trained and ready to go, most companies couldn't last long enough with no flights operating if an entire pilot group walks out. At least that's the hope of the Union. If pilots start to cross the line some flights get operated and the company starts getting a bit of an income stream and they may a) be able to last long enough for the Union to throw in the towel and come back or b) last long enough to train scabs to start flying and keep the income stream alive. Bad stuff.
 
Is it still not illegal to fire someone for a legal strike? Of course the company could fire someone for showing up 5 mins late or wearing your uniform wrong.
 
saxman66 said:
Is it still not illegal to fire someone for a legal strike? Of course the company could fire someone for showing up 5 mins late or wearing your uniform wrong.
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Isn't that what happened in the NW machinists strike? Aren't their still CAL pilots technicaly out of strike or something? Ridiculous, really, we have to jump through a million hoops before the NMB will "approve" a strike, and then the strike amounts to little more than us being allowed to not show up for work against the companies will.
 
BobDDuck said:
Unless a Company has scab pilots (our enough management pilots) waiting in the wings, trained and ready to go, most companies couldn't last long enough with no flights operating if an entire pilot group walks out. At least that's the hope of the Union. If pilots start to cross the line some flights get operated and the company starts getting a bit of an income stream and they may a) be able to last long enough for the Union to throw in the towel and come back or b) last long enough to train scabs to start flying and keep the income stream alive. Bad stuff.
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This is why you will ruin yourself if you ever, EVER do any of the following in this business:
1.) Fly struck work, or
2.) Cross a picket line, or
3.) accept employment from a company that has pilots on strike.
 
Unions are the devil.

They will suck you dry and spit you out.

They also support a public option. You know what that means! GUBMET IN YOUR HEALTHCARE! HAVING TO STAND BEFORE A DEATH PANEL!

Also, ALPA sucks and the IBT is the greatest ever.
 
doug_or said:
Aren't their still CAL pilots technicaly out of strike or something?
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The CAL strike of '83 was mostly resolved in 1985 with the "Order and Award". Some other issues were still outstanding up until 1993. But, the strike was officially over in 1985.
 
surreal1221 said:
Unions are the devil.

They will suck you dry and spit you out.
They also support a public option. You know what that means! GUBMET IN YOUR HEALTHCARE! HAVING TO STAND BEFORE A DEATH PANEL!

Also, ALPA sucks and the IBT is the greatest ever.
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Where do I sign up? That sounds kinda kinky. ;)
 
saxman66 said:
Is it still not illegal to fire someone for a legal strike? Of course the company could fire someone for showing up 5 mins late or wearing your uniform wrong.
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They can't fire you, but they can hire "permanent replacements." It sounds like a distinction without a difference, but not quite. The NWA mechanics that someone mentioned were a perfect example. They weren't ever fired, they were just replaced with permanent replacement workers. When the strike ended with a settlement, the strikers were all offered their jobs back if they would accept the new terms.
 
There is no management out there, with the exception of Skywest and maybe Southwest, that sees their pilots as an asset. Today, especially when the piloting profession is nothing more than a trade like a bus driver or a mechanic, done by the cheapest bidder, you have to go union.
 
FRP0747 said:
Sometimes Unions are a necessary evil.
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I don't see anything evil about Unions at all. Why would a group of like professionals that join together for the purposes of looking out for each other be evil? To me, it is similar to saying that countries, trade groups, home owners associations and football teams are evil.
 
Capt. Caucasian said:
I don't see anything evil about Unions at all. Why would a group of like professionals that join together for the purposes of looking out for each other be evil? To me, it is similar to saying that countries, trade groups, home owners associations and football teams are evil.
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First HOA are evil.
I wouldn't say Unions are evil but I will say in the perfect world they should not be needed. In some cases they do more bad then good.
 
Oh hell, in a perfect world, we wouldn't need insurance, policemen or prophylactics! :)
 
Gonzo said:
First HOA are evil.
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While I am no fan of my HOA board, I have no problem with the HOA itself. I just think that the folks that sit on the BOD are bored, sad, lonely people whose only form of entertainment is enacting silly rules. Other than that, I have no problem with the concept.
 
Capt. Caucasian said:
While I am no fan of my HOA board, I have no problem with the HOA itself. I just think that the folks that sit on the BOD are bored, sad, lonely people whose only form of entertainment is enacting silly rules. Other than that, I have no problem with the concept.
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HOAs are like communism, the concept looks good on paper. Then human nature takes over and it goes out the window. :)
 
kellwolf said:
HOAs are like communism, the concept looks good on paper. Then human nature takes over and it goes out the window. :)
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Really it's socialism.

Policies for the betterment of the society as a whole versus the betterment of the individuals that make up said society.

:bandit:
 
Capt. Caucasian said:
While I am no fan of my HOA board, I have no problem with the HOA itself. I just think that the folks that sit on the BOD are bored, sad, lonely people whose only form of entertainment is enacting silly rules. Other than that, I have no problem with the concept.
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HOA boards are comprised of men and women who were bullied in high school.

Capt. Caucasian said:
I don't see anything evil about Unions at all. Why would a group of like professionals that join together for the purposes of looking out for each other be evil? To me, it is similar to saying that countries, trade groups, home owners associations and football teams are evil.
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Here's my take. If I can walk into my boss' office and negotiate pay and QOL issues, no union needed. But if I'm signing a contract that applies to me and another 7,000 people in my workgroup, I want to elect representatives who will negotiate on my behalf to better my coworkers and I.
 
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