Hot: Air France Jet Missing (AF 447)

Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

Looks like they've confirmed it officially.:(

Brazil confirms Air France jet crashed in ocean

FERNANDO DE NORONHA, Brazil – Brazilian military planes found a 3-mile (5-kilometer) path of wreckage in the Atlantic Ocean, confirming that an Air France jet carrying 228 people crashed in the sea, Defense Minister Nelson Jobim said Tuesday. Jobim told reporters in Rio de Janeiro that the discovery "confirms that the plane went down in that area," hundreds of miles (kilometers) from the Brazilian archipelago of Fernando de Noronha
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http://www.yahoo.com/s/1080268
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

Couple years ago a Kenya Airways 737-800 that was pretty much brand new went down in the vicinity of a thunderstorm. They've never found out the exact cause of the crash. I have a feeling this crash will be something similar.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

Trip7 said:
Couple years ago a Kenya Airways 737-800 that was pretty much brand new went down in the vicinity of a thunderstorm. They've never found out the exact cause of the crash. I have a feeling this crash will be something similar.
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I share that feeling/ thought. This sucks. Unbelievable. 200+ people wiped off the face of the earth. Snip of a finger, and you're done. How many more people affected?
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

Cessna414JJB said:
I share that feeling/ thought. This sucks. Unbelievable. 200+ people wiped off the face of the earth. Snip of a finger, and you're done. How many more people affected?
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Not to dismiss the seriousness of it all, but I am still amazed at the huge masses of people that were LITERALLY wiped away in the tsunami.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

Finding the black boxes will take one hell of a heroic effort. May take years. Explorers or treasure hunters maybe the ones that find them eventually. The debris is already reported to be at least 55 miles wide! The Brazilian ships and planes are having a hell of a time with the stormy weather and seas. And to put icing on the cake, the sea floor is 22,000 ft deep with a mountainous topography. So sad that this accident may become an unsolved mystery.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

Trip7 said:
Finding the black boxes will take one hell of a heroic effort. May take years. Explorers or treasure hunters maybe the ones that find them eventually. The debris is already reported to be at least 55 miles wide! The Brazilian ships and planes are having a hell of a time with the stormy weather and seas. And to put icing on the cake, the sea floor is 22,000 ft deep with a mountainous topography. So sad that this accident may become an unsolved mystery.
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Wouldn't a debris field that is that large indicate a catastrophic even at a higher altitude? Or, did the length of time it took to find the debris field mean that ocean currents played a part of making the debris field so large? It would seem that if they map the wreckage found they could apply mathematics to calculate a rough approximation of where the hull would be using the strengths of the ocean currents and models about how far they could take the kinds of things that were found. Or, I am full of crap...but I am eager to know which.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

Trip7 said:
Finding the black boxes will take one hell of a heroic effort. May take years. Explorers or treasure hunters maybe the ones that find them eventually. The debris is already reported to be at least 55 miles wide! The Brazilian ships and planes are having a hell of a time with the stormy weather and seas. And to put icing on the cake, the sea floor is 22,000 ft deep with a mountainous topography. So sad that this accident may become an unsolved mystery.
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http://news.yahoo.com/s/livescience/20090603/sc_livescience/subsetsrecordindivetooceansdeepesttrench

Maybe they can use this to find the boxes.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

WacoFan said:
Wouldn't a debris field that is that large indicate a catastrophic even at a higher altitude? Or, did the length of time it took to find the debris field mean that ocean currents played a part of making the debris field so large? It would seem that if they map the wreckage found they could apply mathematics to calculate a rough approximation of where the hull would be using the strengths of the ocean currents and models about how far they could take the kinds of things that were found. Or, I am full of crap...but I am eager to know which.
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I just got done reading a news article that stated where some of the debris is being found, compared to other pieces of debris, is consistent with ocean currents in that area. Also, to back up what Trip7 said, the ocean floor is up to 22,995 feet deep in the area where most of the debris is being found.

Using models may be a great way to determine where the hull is, or at least an approximate location. I've seen them do this on Discovery Channel, etc., to locate wreckage. I do know they have such models that can help. It will be interested to see if they decide to utilize all of those type of resources.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

Jimmy_Norton said:
Exactly. How could it have saved lives in this situation?
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It has nothing to do with it being able to save those already killed. It has more to do with being able to find the FDR/CVR with more easiness in order to PREVENT the future loss of lives by analyzing the data. Money always does the talking, unfortunately.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

WacoFan said:
Wouldn't a debris field that is that large indicate a catastrophic even at a higher altitude? Or, did the length of time it took to find the debris field mean that ocean currents played a part of making the debris field so large? It would seem that if they map the wreckage found they could apply mathematics to calculate a rough approximation of where the hull would be using the strengths of the ocean currents and models about how far they could take the kinds of things that were found. Or, I am full of crap...but I am eager to know which.
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Debris spread over a wide area indicates break up in flight (meaning the plane didn't nose dive into the ocean). Smoking hole usually means straight into the ground or water. TWA 800 is a good example of inflight breakup. You could drop some sonobouys in the water, programmed for various depths to see what effect the current had on the debris. Just my 2 cents and trying to remember my NPS Mishap Investigator lessons.
 
Okay if a debris field like that "indicates" a midair breakup; what would cause one other than an explosion? Could an aircraft hit turbulence or updraft forceful enough that could over stress the fuselage or the wings of the aircraft enough to make it break apart?:confused:
 
ready2fly said:
Which is scary. If that's what brought down that plane, it must have been damned near Biblical.
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From an article I just read

"......Officials have released some details of these messages, but a more complete chronology was published Wednesday by Brazil's O Estado de S. Paulo newspaper, citing an unidentified Air France source.

Air France and Brazilian military officials refused to confirm the report. But if accurate, it suggests that Flight 447 may have broken up thousands of feet in the air as it passed through a violent storm, experts told The Associated Press.


The report said the pilot sent a manual signal at 11 p.m. local time saying he was flying through an area of "CBs" — black, electrically charged cumulo-nimbus clouds that come with violent winds and lightning. Satellite data has shown that towering thunderheads were sending 100-mph updrafts into the jet's flight path at that time.

Three minutes after that, more automatic messages indicated the failure of two other fundamental systems pilots use to monitor air speed, altitude and direction. Then, a cascade of other electrical failures in systems that control the main flight computer and wing spoilers.

The report repeats a detail previously released by Brazil's Air Force: that the last message came at 11:14 p.m., indicating loss of air pressure and electrical failure. The newspaper said this could mean sudden de-pressurization, or that the plane was already plunging into the ocean....."
 
ChrisH said:
Satellite data has shown that towering thunderheads were sending 100-mph updrafts into the jet's flight path at that time.
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:eek::eek::eek::eek:

I can't form a sentence that would express my reaction to that as well as the (non)smiley does.

Anyone know how many Gs going from relatively smooth air into an abrupt 100mph updraft would create?
 
firebirdswm said:
:eek::eek::eek::eek:

I can't form a sentence that would express my reaction to that as well as the (non)smiley does.

Anyone know how many Gs going from relatively smooth air into an abrupt 100mph updraft would create?
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:yeahthat: That sounds so damn scary, Imagine being apart of it!:panic:
 
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