USMC KC-130J/F-35B midair near KNJK

MikeD

Administrator
Staff member
now I have no idea the materials a refueling hose is made of, but ask anyone who has ever used a tow strap, if that thing has stress on it and it snaps it going flying forward. No different than when you shoot a rubber band with your finger. I’d assume the hose has some flex/stretch built into it.
it does, but it has a take up reel on one end, and on the receiver end, you cant pull that much on it before the overcenter locks disconnect. Mainly both to control any whiplash or sine wave back to the refueling pod. So, if assuming/speculating all of those working, and this still happened, the question would then be, what took down the F-35? Which is why that’s just not a possibility by itself.
 
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Flyinthrew

Well-Known Member
It’s painfully clear that this has nothing to do with the hose coming forward. They’re traveling at 230 indicated and the hose and drogue weighs a ton. The sheer physics of it is impossible. Plane to plane contact didn’t even need to be that bad. As demonstrated by the C130T that came apart over Mississippi a few years ago once a prop fails it has lots of nasty higher order effects.


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Fixtur

Prefamulated Amulite
It was pretty bumpy over the area on the day in question - we got rocked pretty good descending past TRM on the way into CRQ
 

MikeD

Administrator
Staff member
It was pretty bumpy over the area on the day in question - we got rocked pretty good descending past TRM on the way into CRQ
Usually not too much of an effect, as the tanker and receiver are riding the same air and thus turbulence affecting them pretty much the same. But the receiver is flying off a couple different references anyway, and maintaining those, maintains position. Normally, the worst mistake is backing out too far and accidentally disconnecting, which it’s designed to do.
 

///AMG

Well-Known Member
A hose just failing somehow in the middle typically requires a rotor system....
I've seen a couple KC-135 hoses get a bubble midway down the hose. Normally fails in pretty short order after that. One time a long time ago, I was in country in a bit of fuel extremis after this scenario had played out (this being the alternate tanker after we had burned gas and time to get there following our ATO fragged tanker falling out). No other tanker, no good divert options due to sand/thunderstorms closing the only divert we had gas to get to. I asked and received permission to plug anyway. About 80% of the fuel just spewed into my windscreen and over the jet, but I was able to get just enough to get healthy again....at least before the tanker crew decided they had played with fire for long enough.
 

MikeD

Administrator
Staff member
I've seen a couple KC-135 hoses get a bubble midway down the hose. Normally fails in pretty short order after that. One time a long time ago, I was in country in a bit of fuel extremis after this scenario had played out (this being the alternate tanker after we had burned gas and time to get there following our ATO fragged tanker falling out). No other tanker, no good divert options due to sand/thunderstorms closing the only divert we had gas to get to. I asked and received permission to plug anyway. About 80% of the fuel just spewed into my windscreen and over the jet, but I was able to get just enough to get healthy again....at least before the tanker crew decided they had played with fire for long enough.
you have played with the Iron Maiden? I’ve heard that particular drogue is a pain.
 

///AMG

Well-Known Member
you have played with the Iron Maiden? I’ve heard that particular drogue is a pain.
You get lucky every now and then with a KC-10, but for the most part, all maiden (other than around the boat of course)
 

Cherokee_Cruiser

Well-Known Member
I don’t know what people talk about AQP being easy peasy. Every sim session is jam packed full of various stuff. No sooner did you finish one thing and bam another. Oh and now V1 cuts. Oh and then this. By the time the sim is done, you couldn’t even name the first malfunction you got in your sim session.

If you don’t study every day and chair fly this stuff, you’re gonna struggle. That’s been my key takeaway. I’ve been doing that and seem fine. But I can see at least one person in our class struggling. For the Bus guys coming over, the big complaints are no hands on yoke/throttles (especially on throttles!) and rudder during engine out work. The Bus is a 3-axis autopilot that will eventually correct your rudder incompetence in an engine out, but the 737 is like the CRJ-200 in that it’s a solely 2-axis AP. The rudder is all you during engine out stuff.
 

knot4u

Repeat Offender
For what I paid for it they damn well better repair and put it back into service.

Also, it should have a kill marking on it henceforth! ;)
Did you hear about the Bearcat that taxied into a fire extinguisher in Hawaii recently after being ferried over by our navy from Southern California? I'd rather see the Bearcat repaired.
 

trafficinsight

Well-Known Member
Did you hear about the Bearcat that taxied into a fire extinguisher in Hawaii recently after being ferried over by our navy from Southern California? I'd rather see the Bearcat repaired.
The B-25 that was over there went down in a field a month or so ago after being ferried back. I hope they both get repaired eventually.
 
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