Two planes near miss Newark

Typical media trying to crucify someone for it. I was working with a retired FAA guy when I first read about this in April, he was quick to tell me that if you're working at a busy Bravo airport, its a matter of when, not if, you screw up like this. I guess today with LiveATC and the viral media, a loss of separation is more likely to make the rounds.
 
ChasenSFO said:
Typical media trying to crucify someone for it. I was working with a retired FAA guy when I first read about this in April, he was quick to tell me that if you're working at a busy Bravo airport, its a matter of when, not if, you screw up like this. I guess today with LiveATC and the viral media, a loss of separation is more likely to make the rounds.
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VERY TRUE !!
 
Slow news day? Better head over to an airport with parallel runways and pretend to be planespotters.
 
They almost DIED in the worst aviation accident ever if only the planes had flown closer and made some sort of contact!!!!!

Worst EVER!
 
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ChasenSFO said:
Typical media trying to crucify someone for it. I was working with a retired FAA guy when I first read about this in April, he was quick to tell me that if you're working at a busy Bravo airport, its a matter of when, not if, you screw up like this. I guess today with LiveATC and the viral media, a loss of separation is more likely to make the rounds.
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But someone is to blame. I don't think "hey, everyone makes mistakes" is a good quality/safety control philosophy in that line of work.
 
jtrain609 said:
Sure it is.

Because if you've found somebody that doesn't make mistakes, the only thing you've found is somebody that can cover things up really, really well, which is an even worse safety philosophy.
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That's right up there with the compulsive liars and the "That's Not My Job"bers. Never fun to work with.
 
Jeez not again. Its a chain reaction. Sometimes I really hate technology. If this was back in the early 90s, you wouldn't have heard a peep about it. Why? Because it WASN'T NEWS and it still isn't news. This crap happens every other day. You never heard about my near miss experience with a separation of about 300 feet when some yahoo decided it was a good day to wander into ORD airspace in a Cirrus. We dipped, dove, dodged and uhh dodged. As soon as we landed back in ORD from the 15 minute PIA trip, our phones started ringing. One from the tower chief, one from a fed and one from CS. Apparently it was a big deal because Mr.Cirrus wasnt suppose to be there. Captain K.K was the friggin man.
 
Because that was the most dangerous thing that occurred in Newark on that day.
 
Being based at EWR I must say this configuration is tricky. With 22R closed, if they launch from 22L and land 29 it isn't a big deal. But launching 04R and landing 29, well this is precisely what will happen if a guy is taking off and another has to go around because 29 sits on the departure end of 04R. Recently they have really been squeezing them in there and these tower controllers make MSP look like child's play.

For this particular event, it is a big deal. The loss of separation - both vertical and horizontal - was extremely close by any standards. Since we have a EWR/JFK base our airline already put out a pdf file detailing this incident as a heads up.
 
Heres an ATC fun fact, you know this may not be a separation error on the controller heres why. The rule for arriving and departing aircraft on intersecting runways state that the departure be airborne and through the intersection prior to the arrival crossing the landing threshold. If the controller sent the arrival around prior to crossing the threshold there is no separation error. All the controller has to do is provide traffic advisories and visual separation which he did. I know I know what you are all thinking, yea it dose sound crazy but thems the rules.
 
queeno said:
Heres an ATC fun fact, you know this may not be a separation error on the controller heres why. The rule for arriving and departing aircraft on intersecting runways state that the departure be airborne and through the intersection prior to the arrival crossing the landing threshold. If the controller sent the arrival around prior to crossing the threshold there is no separation error. All the controller has to do is provide traffic advisories and visual separation which he did. I know I know what you are all thinking, yea it dose sound crazy but thems the rules.
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Not exactly.

https://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/publications/ATpubs/ATC/atc0310.html

3-10-4. INTERSECTING RUNWAY SEPARATION

Issue traffic information to each aircraft operating on intersecting runways.

a. Separate an arriving aircraft using one runway from another aircraft using an intersecting runway or a nonintersecting runway when the flight paths intersect by ensuring that the arriving aircraft does not cross the landing threshold or flight path of the other aircraft until one of the following conditions exists:

REFERENCE-
FAAO JO 7110.65, Para 2-1-21, Traffic Advisories.

1. The preceding aircraft has departed and passed the intersection/flight path or is airborne and turning to avert any conflict.
(See FIG 3-10-6 and FIG 3-10-7.)

2. A preceding arriving aircraft is clear of the landing runway, completed landing roll and will hold short of the intersection/flight path, or has passed the intersection/flight path.
(See FIG 3-10-8 and FIG 3-10-9.)

NOTE-
When visual separation is being applied by the tower, appropriate control instructions and traffic advisories must be issued to ensure go around or missed approaches avert any conflict with the flight path of traffic on the other runway.

REFERENCE-
FAAO JO 7110.65, Para 7-2-1, Visual Separation, subpara a2.

b. “USA/USAF/USN NOT APPLICABLE.” An aircraft may be authorized to takeoff from one runway while another aircraft lands simultaneously on an intersecting runway or an aircraft lands on one runway while another aircraft lands simultaneously on an intersecting runway, or an aircraft lands to hold short of an intersecting taxiway or some other predetermined point such as an approach/departure flight path using procedures specified in the current LAHSO directive. The procedure must be approved by the air traffic manager and be in accordance with a facility directive. The following conditions apply:

NOTE-
Application of these procedures does not relieve controllers from the responsibility of providing other appropriate separation contained in this order.
 
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