To and From practice area

F

FOD

Well-Known Member
Looking for some training ideas for the down time flying to and from the practice areas. I usually give some type of malfunction (open door, annuctiator light,etc...), diversion, passenger medical problem, and thats about it. I'm running out of ideas and looking for some other ideas or some strange malfunction, anyone have something they like to do?
 
I was pretty famous for pulling an engine on the way back from the practice area when my students were a tired and thought the training was over...
 
In relation to what Doug is speaking of, I had a CFI that would reach over with her lft hand and start to monkey with the radios and or headset plugs(mine), like she couldn't hear. Of course I would get distracted, and just as that was happening and I couldn;t see her other hand, she would fail the engine on me and sit back.
 
as soon as they get the radios/gps and all set up, point out the window at something and screw it all up so they have to do it again really fast.
 
Just the other day I came up with a little game. Set the power at a very low setting when about 5 miles out, then try to land without touching the power, even into the flare. So you could say it's a simulated partial power loss into a soft field landing.

There's no real world application for such an exercise, but it's fun to play around with the drag associated with different airspeeds and flap/gear configurations. It also makes the student notice how greatly the RPMs can vary with airspeed. I think it's a good thing to do to break the monotony of commercial training.

I've also done a simulated engine failure before returning to the airport, then had the student fly back to the airport at 500 AGL. Again, I'm not sure about the educational value, but it was fun and relaxing for the both of us. I consider keeping a lesson fun a critical part of keeping the student motivated. It was a nice change of scenery from cruising back at 2500 AGL like we usually do.

Otherwise, all the things you mentioned are good. I especially make sure that pre-solo students can handle a door opening in flight.
 
I always liked to ask if there were any buttons/functions/switches in the cockpit that they didn't know yet. Usually got many questions. And somtimes I found myself digging into the supplements section after the flight!
 
I remember one time we were about 5-10 miles out coming back in and I asked the student what he would do if the yoke broke off and came out in his hands. He came up with all kinds of wild ideas about trying to reattach it as quick as posssible, and dig out his fuel tester with the screwdriver tip so he could repair it, and a few other things too. After listening to him go on and on about this stuff he asked what I would do. I said, first I would fly the plane, he said, well yeah, that is what we are trying to do but how do you do that if the yoke came off in your hands. I said I would use the other yoke that is still attached. He then says.... Ohhhh yeah.

Not that we really need a yoke to fly, we can fly with our feet right.
 
jrh said:
Just the other day I came up with a little game. Set the power at a very low setting when about 5 miles out, then try to land without touching the power, even into the flare. So you could say it's a simulated partial power loss into a soft field landing.

There's no real world application for such an exercise, but it's fun to play around with the drag associated with different airspeeds and flap/gear configurations. It also makes the student notice how greatly the RPMs can vary with airspeed. I think it's a good thing to do to break the monotony of commercial training.

I've also done a simulated engine failure before returning to the airport, then had the student fly back to the airport at 500 AGL. Again, I'm not sure about the educational value, but it was fun and relaxing for the both of us. I consider keeping a lesson fun a critical part of keeping the student motivated. It was a nice change of scenery from cruising back at 2500 AGL like we usually do.

Otherwise, all the things you mentioned are good. I especially make sure that pre-solo students can handle a door opening in flight.
Click to expand...

This can actually happen. Not all engine failures are catastrophic. A few months ago, a flight instructor friend had a partial power loss (to about 1700 RPM). They made it back to the airport and landed in the first few hundred feet of the runway. I think the cause was a stuck valve.
 
I do not know if this is so wise because of the panic it may cause but I read about it in a pilot magazine. The instructor put a decoy carbon monixide detector that displayed that there was CO in the plane. He passed out and the student had the student act on his on intuition. The student managed to land the plane safely. Again, I do not want to be liable for any accident but it was in AOPA magazine I believe.
 
Or did he pass out? I do not recall. He may have just acted sick and not capapble of flying. I do not recall. I know he had the student act on his own intution. It was a good scenerio because it taught the student to keep his cool in a bad situation as a pilot must, as well as a chance to land on his own.
 
as was said not all engine failures are full blown engine just rolls over and gives up type of thing. cylinders blowing, gaskets, stuck valves etc... (disclaimer im no A&P) could all cause partial loss of engine power. you are then left with the decision of whether or not you can make it to an airport that would definately be beyond power off gliding range, or pick an emergency landing point thats withing gliding range. quite often it isnt a catastrophic failure to begin with but may turn into one a couple minutes down the road. ill sometimes give them a partial engine loss soon followed by a full loss of power to emphasize that they should always have a plan if it goes from bad to worse. anyway works great when your already inbound.
another thing i have done before with students who respond quickly is to put them under the hood and vector them into the pattern and around onto final. it challenges them a little with everything thats happening and breaks up the mondane
 
One of the exameners that I had told me that engine failures pretty much go like this:

If it is an instant and immediate sort of engine failure it will usually be on climbout. The theory goes that the engine is still warming up and people like to save money on fast warmups in singles once they do a hundred of them. I can agree with that I suppose.

If it is a gradual/power slowly decreasing it is usually the cruise part of the flight or any other phase of flight becuase things tend to slowly lose power such as the leaky valve mentioned above. I think I can go along with this too as the engine is already warm and thermal expansion isn't really an issue any more as it has already happened.

While I am sure this isn't a 100% type deal, I bet it is pretty close to 100%. What do you guys think of this, anyone else agree?
 
dgRoot said:
This can actually happen. Not all engine failures are catastrophic. A few months ago, a flight instructor friend had a partial power loss (to about 1700 RPM). They made it back to the airport and landed in the first few hundred feet of the runway. I think the cause was a stuck valve.
Click to expand...

Very true. I guess it could be good practice for that sort of scenario.

The difference in the exercise I proposed was that I told the student to not add or reduce the power. During a partial power loss you at least have the option to reduce power.

Being forced to keep power in makes it quite a bit more challenging. There isn't enough power to maintain altitude, so you have to keep a clean configuration and maintain best glide speed in order to make the airport. However, then the reverse happens--you're a little high and fast, but it's hard to get the plane to come down with partial power still applied. Even with full flaps and gear extended, the final approach has to be very slow and shallow. Otherwise you'll balloon back up during the flare and possibly overshoot the runway because you're used to pulling the power to idle as you cross the threshold.

That's why I say I don't try to make this an emergency procedure. In an actual partial power loss I'd get close to the runway, then pull the power to idle for landing. This exercise is just intended to throw the student out of their routine and make them use other elements of flight to deal with a strange situation.
 
jrh said:
The difference in the exercise I proposed was that I told the student to not add or reduce the power. During a partial power loss you at least have the option to reduce power.
Click to expand...
How about a broken throttle cable?
 
SteveC said:
How about a broken throttle cable?
Click to expand...

I think a broken throttle cable will send the engine to full power, won't it? I could be wrong, but I think I heard that somewhere a long time ago. In any case...

Get within gliding distance of the field and chop the mixture. If by some freak chance the mixture control doesn't work, flip the mags off. Then if the key breaks off in your hand, use the fuel shutoff valve.

We don't think about it very often, but there are all sorts of ways to intentionally kill an engine.
 
I was shown by a DE how with the throttle stuck full on you can pitch the airplane up to Vfe and put full flaps in and then it will slow down for you. There's another one to try.


Mike
 
Interesting. What sort of situation did the DE say that procedure would be useful in? Keeping the plane from passing the maximum structural cruising speed? Or exceeding Va during a turbulent flight?

Unless you're flying at an extremely high density altitude and the aircraft is extremely heavily loaded, it's nearly impossible to land with full power.

Landing is the scenario I've been thinking about.
 
Or just let them fly the plane... Sometimes burning out a student with "busy work" after 50 mins of practicing engine failures, stalls, and other "busy work" makes it a lot less fun. If the student and you feel comfortable about the understanding and proficiency of the tasks of that day's lesson, then let the student sit and enjoy flying the airplane. Where do you want to go? Anything you want to try? Want to fly over that lake? Just have fun with it. etc... are all good things to say to students who just got a work out in the practice area. Don't forget that maneuvers and tasks we have them do are still new to them and not as easy as they are for us... It is good to let them put their guard down and enjoy flying.
 
jrh said:
Interesting. What sort of situation did the DE say that procedure would be useful in? Keeping the plane from passing the maximum structural cruising speed? Or exceeding Va during a turbulent flight?

Unless you're flying at an extremely high density altitude and the aircraft is extremely heavily loaded, it's nearly impossible to land with full power.

Landing is the scenario I've been thinking about.
Click to expand...


Oh sorry, the DE applied full power on downwind and used the flaps to slow it down so you could fly the rest of the pattern and towards the end of the runway at a reasonable rate (and with a shload of nose down trim!). The DE suggested pulling the mixture when the field is made, but I'd lean toward using the mags to kill the engine so you might have a better shot of getting the engine back if you wanted it. I could be wrong on that one though.


Mike
 
for steve c and jrh

a broken throttle cable may not actually cause the throttle to go full. this happened to me during multi training in a duchess. during a vmc demo i had the left engine idled and the right one full. after recovering the manuever the cable broke as i attempted to resync the engines. it was mid range around 20" 2300. we realized it was broken when i went to descend and pulled the throttle back and nothing happened. In attempting to trouble shoot we discovered that while pulling it back did nothing, pushing it forward gave us full throttle. We ended up flying back to the airport with plenty of speed and then feathering the right engine and coming in on the left.

as for having this happen in a single a DE told me that it happened to him in a 182 and that he simply used the mixture control by going lean of peak to control the rpms. maybe not the nicest thing to do to an engine but it beats shutting the engine off.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top