Thoughts on High Altitude Endorsement...

M

MercFE

Well-Known Member
Recently received an e-mail about an upcoming High Altitude clinic being put together in my area. While unable to fit into my schedule, the e-mail got me interested in the requirements for this endorsement.

Looking into FAR 61.31, it gives a pass to military pilots that have completed a PIC check. However, the training that is required by the FAR is given all military aircrew members, officer and enlisted. In fact, I attend this training once every four years to maintain currency in the subjects.

While, I'm far from every being PIC in a high altitude aircraft, I'm definitely interested in every sign off I can get out of the military for free. I'm curious if it's even worth posting the question to the FAA about whether I meet the requirements of the FAR.

What do y'all think?
 
Does the high alt endorsement consist of purely physiological training, or does it also involve high altitude flight operations/class A training? If it is just physiology, I'd sure hope the normal initial/recurrent physiology training we do would satisfy the requirement.
 
Find of off the instructors that has a civil CFI and get him to sign your book. There is no flight portion required. It is all physiological requirements. If you have been through the altitude chamber your good to go if you get the sign off. The FAA doesn't even require that.
 
KDoersom said:
Find of off the instructors that has a civil CFI and get him to sign your book. There is no flight portion required. It is all physiological requirements. If you have been through the altitude chamber your good to go if you get the sign off. The FAA doesn't even require that.
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If you're referring to the High-Altitude endorsement found in 61.31, you're incorrect:

(2) Except as provided in paragraph (g)(3) of this section, no person may act as pilot in command of a pressurized aircraft unless that person has received and logged training from an authorized instructor in a pressurized aircraft, or in a flight simulator or flight training device that is representative of a pressurized aircraft, and obtained an endorsement in the person's logbook or training record from an authorized instructor who found the person proficient in the operation of a pressurized aircraft. The flight training must include at least the following subjects:
(i) Normal cruise flight operations while operating above 25,000 feet MSL;
(ii) Proper emergency procedures for simulated rapid decompression without actually depressurizing the aircraft; and
(iii) Emergency descent procedures.
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adk said:
If you're referring to the High-Altitude endorsement found in 61.31, you're incorrect:
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Agreed... However, there are no flight time requirements associated with this FAR, and I doubt the training involves dropping a real aircraft out of the FL's for some emergency descents. Sounds more like drills, simulators, and discussion items then stick time.

Again, all things I participate in as an aircrew member. And that's where the question lies, what training am I missing to receive the sign off?

I've asked my squadron's pilot evaluator. He agrees that I should qualify for the endorsement. However, he doesn't have his civil CFI. I do have a couple younger, non Aircraft Commander types, that do have current CFI's. I just don't want to put them in a position where the FAA may cry foul.
 
jtrain609 said:
I don't even have one!
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I don't either. And I bet I never end up with one or need one. 61.31g3iv No one under 121, 125 or 135 really needs one. So only a pt 91 flight ever needs it IF you've never done a PIC check in a pressurized high alt airplane.
 
MercFE said:
Agreed... However, there are no flight time requirements associated with this FAR, and I doubt the training involves dropping a real aircraft out of the FL's for some emergency descents. Sounds more like drills, simulators, and discussion items then stick time.

Again, all things I participate in as an aircrew member. And that's where the question lies, what training am I missing to receive the sign off?

I've asked my squadron's pilot evaluator. He agrees that I should qualify for the endorsement. However, he doesn't have his civil CFI. I do have a couple younger, non Aircraft Commander types, that do have current CFI's. I just don't want to put them in a position where the FAA may cry foul.
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I believe you have to be the sole manipulator of the controls to get the endorsement. When you start flying commercially it won't be a problem to get this sign off. So free is a good price but not really needed.:) Several friends have upgraded from the backseat to a window seat and this was taken care of in training.
Shouldn't be a problem for you when you get to that point in your career.
 
Murdoughnut said:
Hell I have it in my logbook. Got it in the 738 sim. Fun times.
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Yea in the Sim is the easiest thing if that option is available to you. I got mine at FSI and went through their high altitude training class. I knew of a place that was doing it in a Cessna 340 but not sure what they were going to do with the "emergency descent procedure" of 61.31 unless they just practiced/simulated running through the procedures.
 
So a type rating checkride for a part 91 operator would still require a high altitude endorsement?
 
5Right_5Left said:
Yea in the Sim is the easiest thing if that option is available to you. I got mine at FSI and went through their high altitude training class. I knew of a place that was doing it in a Cessna 340 but not sure what they were going to do with the "emergency descent procedure" of 61.31 unless they just practiced/simulated running through the procedures.
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That would tend to be a very expensive endorsement if the actual emergency descent procedure was conducted in the 340.

"Excuse me, I need to buy a flat of cylinders..."
 
jtrain609 said:
I don't even have one!
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I don’t have on either but I don’t have a tailwheel or a high performance one either. All grand fathered.

Got 4 types but missed getting grand fathered in the Falcon 200 back when it and the Falcon 20 was the same type, I never flew a 200.
 
I received my high-altitude endorsement my first day in a King Air 200... Empty leg back, my CA just requested a simulated emergency descent from about FL180 or so...
 
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