suicide attempt

applepwnz

applepwnz

New Member
okay, so I'm scheduled to take my first, first class medical on April 26th. I've got a question though. When i was 18 (about 2 and 1/2 years ago) I had tried to kill myself. It was over situational depression (I don't have any history of depression before or after that) does anyone have any experience with this? I know that it's not automatically disqualifying, but I figure that at best I'll have a lot of paperwork to do.
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First off join AOPA if you haven't already and then give them a call and talk with them. They are usually very helpful.

These are the only disqualifying conditions (from AOPA):

- Diabetes Mellitus requiring Insulin or oral medication
- Angina Pectoris
- Coronary Heart Disease
- Myocardial Infarction
- Cardiac Valve
- Pacemaker
- Cardiac Transplant
- Epilepsy
- Substance* Dependence or Abuse
- Failed DOT Drug Test
- Disturbance of Consciousness or Transient Loss of Nervous System Function without Satisfactory Explanation
- Personality Disorder
- Psychosis
- Bipolar Disorder (Manic-Depressive Psychosis)

So there are two things that could happen:

1. The AME issues you a medical certificate in their office.
2. They defer to the FAA, which simply means the regs don't allow them to make the decision. The FAA then will want other tests / documents. This is why you should call AOPA, they can tell you exactly what the FAA will ask for. That way you can get a jump on things.

My guess is that given this was a situational thing you're probably going to be issued in the office.

Finally other people here will simply tell you to not say anything about it to the FAA. I personally think that is a really bad idea, because lying to the government is a bad idea. I also feel (nothing personal) that given a previous suicide attempt, situational or not, I would not want you in the air with me unless an AME and/or the FAA checked you out.

Like I said nothing personal, and I wish you luck.

Naunga
 
thanks for the good advice Naunga. I've always felt myself that honesty is the best policy (I mean, if you lie about something on your medical and someone finds out, you're done, I wouldn't wanna risk that.) Hopefully I should be alright though. Well, if not it would royally suck, but at least I've already got a backup plan (I'd just go to school for aerospace engineering.)
 
Who knows about it and how much of a paper trail is there? If at all possible, I'd not bring this up to the doc and not put it on the form. You could be opening up a can of worms for yourself.

It's nice you want to be honest. My experience with dealing with the FAA over the years is to have as little contact with them as possible and give them as little reason to contact you as possible.

Also, if it seems like this issue might be a grey area. Feel the AME out about it before the official exam. If he says he must report it, I'd run away and try as many as 10 different AME's before I gave up trying to find one that would try to be "more helpful" to you with this issue.
 
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t's nice you want to be honest. My experience with dealing with the FAA over the years is to have as little contact with them as possible and give them as little reason to contact you as possible

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One thing I should mention...

There is a difference between being honest and volunteering too much information.

If the form says: "Have you ever eaten dirt from Mexico?" and you've only eaten dirt from Guam. Check no not yes.

Of course some of questions are intentionally broad. When I went in for my first medical I had a question about a question on the form so I left it blank and when the AME got to it I asked her about it and she told me I could check 'no' for that one.

Of course I have a kick ass AME, and even though she is in Ohio and I'm in Georgia I will continue to get my medicals from her, because she honestly WANTS to give me a medical and will be an advocate for me to the FAA.

Like the man says try to find a good AME, some function like mine, wanting to get people in the air, and others will look for every reason to ground you.

Naunga
 
Ok, sneaky way around this. Call an AME in another state, Call yourself John Q. Ask him what he thinks. Call another AMe in another state and ask him. Based on their responses, tell you AME about the situation.
I hope the best turn out for you. I really hate to hear about a situation that was a one time thing stop someone from doing what they love.
 
There's a big difference between lying and not volunteering information that isn't asked for.

So, if it says, have you ever attempted suicide, then you MUST answer yes.

But if it says, have you ever been diagnosed with psychosis, then you don't have to answer yes. Why? Because, if I recall from my psych classes way back when, depression isn't considered a psychotic disease.

See what I mean?

My two cents is if you've gotten counseling and your shrink says you're okay, that's good enough for me.

But if you're still seeing a shrink about this, then I think you've got to get it resolved and evaluated first.

And I'm not the AME, so my opinion doesn't count
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There's a big difference between lying and not volunteering information that isn't asked for.

So, if it says, have you ever attempted suicide, then you MUST answer yes.

But if it says, have you ever been diagnosed with psychosis, then you don't have to answer yes. Why? Because, if I recall from my psych classes way back when, depression isn't considered a psychotic disease.

See what I mean?

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Then there's the question of were you actually officially diagnosed with any such psychopathology?

As for concealing something they directly ask for, keep in mind that in the post-9/11 era, the FAA is seeking (and getting) jail time for people who falsify applications for medical or pilot certificates. Do you really want to test their ability to find out the truth?

Since depression is a disqualifier (or is it simply being on antidepressants?), at the very least, I suspect you'll need some sort of clean bill of mental health from a mental health care practitioner stating that you're over it.
 
Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating lying on the application.

Just saying that there's a world of difference between lying and not volunteering information that's not asked for.

Because if they want to ask, do you have any mental problems, we all have to answer "yes."

Otherwise, why would we want to make flying a career?
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Thanks for the advice everyone. I liked the idea of just leaving that question blank on the paper, and talking to the AME about it, maybe he'll say that I don't have to put it down after he hears the story. I couldn't ever lie about anything, but I'll also be carefull not to volunteer information if they don't ask me. I don't have any history at all of depression or other mental disease, it was just one incident based on something bad that had happened to me, so hopefully it will all work out okay. I've already got a backup plan though just incase.
 
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Thanks for the advice everyone. I liked the idea of just leaving that question blank on the paper, and talking to the AME about it

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Not a good idea. Don't EVER talk to your AME about anything other than football, flying, women, etc. If you want an AME's opinion, call one anonymously, and see if you can ask him/her over the phone.
 
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Since depression is a disqualifier (or is it simply being on antidepressants?)

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It's the meds, not depression. Otherwise, US Air and United might be 45% grounded due to depressed pilots. My wife is waiting for the FAA to get around to actually updating their research on anti-depressants. There's no more of a chance of someone on Zoloft or Provac putting a plane in the ground as someone on blood pressure meds. There's just that whole stigma surrounding anti-depressants.
 
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Since depression is a disqualifier (or is it simply being on antidepressants?)

[/ QUOTE ]

It's the meds, not depression. Otherwise, US Air and United might be 45% grounded due to depressed pilots. My wife is waiting for the FAA to get around to actually updating their research on anti-depressants. There's no more of a chance of someone on Zoloft or Provac putting a plane in the ground as someone on blood pressure meds. There's just that whole stigma surrounding anti-depressants.

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Do you guys think that it will help then, that I never needed anti-depressants? Like afterward, my parents made me to to a counselor, or psychiatrist or something and she said that I never needed anti-depressants because it was a situational thing, not an actual clinical depression thing.
 
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Do you guys think that it will help then, that I never needed anti-depressants? Like afterward, my parents made me to to a counselor, or psychiatrist or something and she said that I never needed anti-depressants because it was a situational thing, not an actual clinical depression thing.

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I think that's your answer right there.

It wasn't clinical depression. Therefore, you have never been diagnosed as suffering from one of the mental diseases that the FAA asks about, nor have you taken any of the meds that are prohibited.

I don't recall the questions on the medical, but you can truthfully answer no if there is a question about being diagnosed with a mental disease.
 
From FAA Form 8500-8:

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18 m. (yes or no) Mental disorders of any sort; depression, anxiety, etc.

18 p. (yes or no) Suicide attempt


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...that's from the form you'll be filling out for your medical, good luck (w/ all sincerity).
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From FAA Form 8500-8:

[ QUOTE ]
18 m. (yes or no) Mental disorders of any sort; depression, anxiety, etc.

18 p. (yes or no) Suicide attempt


[/ QUOTE ]


...that's from the form you'll be filling out for your medical, good luck (w/ all sincerity).
smile.gif


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well I guess I'll have to just answer yes to 18 P and no to 18 M. I think I'd be really screwed if I answered yes to both, but okay with just one, also I found this:

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Personality disorder that is severe enough to have repeatedly manifested itself by overt acts

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note the "repeatedly"
 
Still before you go to the AME call AOPA.

It really will help you out if you get deferred.

Naunga
 
I know I'm chiming in pretty late here, but I just renewed my 1st class medical last Thursday, and I remember "Suicide Attempt" as a "yes/no" question on the medical form. Like everyone else said, you'll probably just have to explain it to the AME. If it was a situational type thing, I wouldn't worry about it too much,
 
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