Stalls: Scary yet fun

Theotokos

Theotokos

New Member
I think it is my fear of going into a spin that feeds my fear of stalls--I guess I fear the dreaded spin caused by a stall. I remember him telling me to slow to about 50 kts and maintain that airspeed and maintain altitude and as my airspeed decreased, I quickly nosed down to increase speed and did not at all mind if I was above 50. But he told me to maintain 50 so I slowed, flirting with stalls. He was trying to get me used to the feeling of slow flight. Then he showed me a few stalls and then had me try one. My words were, "Oh God." He said the fear is normal though and told the comic story of a female student actually grabbing onto his arm and screaming. With full flaps and the throttle pulled out, I pitched up and airspeed decreased. Finally that eerie horn sounded, and he had me increase the AoA even more until finally we nosed down. I added power and retracted flaps. I only practiced one though, as another student was booked right after us. I was supposed to go again tommorow but a cold front is right in my backyard--literally, the leading edge of the clouds are right over my back yard--and so tommorow looks like another of many cancellations and since he is taking Friday off, I probaly will not get to go till next week. Yes, stalls are scary, but yet at the same time kind of fun. He said he was going to show me a spin eventually but I thought they were forbidden except in aircaft tests--may be he was joking? I hope so.
 
Stalls really aren't an abrupt maneuver. If you're in a Cessna and your instructor is comfortable with it, I'd actually reccomend you go up and do some spins if that is what you're really afraid of. I think everyone is a bit nervous when they begin doing stallls but eventually it becomes a non event. They're important to learn so that you know 1) how to recognize an imminent stall so you can avoid them 2) how to recover from them
 
Nope you can spin a 172. But not sure spin recovery is part of your PPL training.

In my PPL training we talked about how to recover from a spin. But we didn't actually do them in the plane. From what I know that occurs in the CFI portion of training.

Have fun...be safe,listen and learn!

-Matthew
 
We did a few spins when I was training for my private, I'm pretty sure they were just 'for my information' though. Max is right, most spins do come in CFI.
 
I recommend you find some aerobatic instruction near your area and go up for a few hours. You'll get a whole new perspective on flying and realize that the flight envelope is much, much larger than what you experience in standard private pilot training. When you think logically about it, what are we afraid of exactly? We're afraid of experiencing strange physical sensations. However, like a roller coaster, you get used to the sensations quickly and they become a non-factor. Good luck in your training!
 
Realms09 said:
However, like a roller coaster, you get used to the sensations quickly and they become a non-factor. Good luck in your training!
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I dont even think that saying stalls are like being on a roller coaster is acurate, they're much more calm than that.
 
All my private students do a lesson on spins if they like it of not. I wont sign them off if the dont.

We have a DPE that will do spins with a private applicant if their instuctor hasn't.

It should be in the PTS for a PPL.
 
ryanmickG said:
All my private students do a lesson on spins if they like it of not. I wont sign them off if the dont.

We have a DPE that will do spins with a private applicant if their instuctor hasn't.

It should be in the PTS for a PPL.
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I'll agree with your last sentence. :)

I'm not too fond of the first two paragraphs. :mad:



.
 
it's a pity more CFI's don't do a spin lesson, mine did in a C-150 just before my check, I regarded it as one of the most valuable lessons I got from him.
And yes spins are required for your CFI.

It should be in the PTS for a PPL.
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I'm not old enough to remember, but I think spin training used to be required and was subsequently changed to "spin awareness" for safety issues, maybe one of the more seasoned fellows can shed some light.
 
ryanmickG said:
All my private students do a lesson on spins if they like it of not. I wont sign them off if the dont.

We have a DPE that will do spins with a private applicant if their instuctor hasn't.

It should be in the PTS for a PPL.
Click to expand...


Would that be the Grabenator?:)
 
Screaming_Emu said:
I dont even think that saying stalls are like being on a roller coaster is acurate, they're much more calm than that.
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I was speaking of aerobatics as a whole. However, I was not making a comparison of G-forces and attitudes, but rather providing an example of how our body reacts to new sensations. At first they are a cause of anxiety, but they quickly fade into "business as usual."
 
first off read 91.307(c&d) refering to the required use of a parachute for spinning. now i have heard numerous definitions of this reg even from fsdo guys that im not even going to get into it but not a bad thing to take a look at.

during your practice of stalls try to (as always) look outside the aircraft. then draw an imaginary straight line up the sky as you increase elevator pressure. use the rudders rather than the ailerons to keep that line straight. especially in power on stalls students tend to concentrate to much on keeping the ball centered rather than just looking outside and using whatever rudder necessary to keep it in a staight line. if the nose is drifting left add right rudder. my experience has been that this allows for a much more coordinated stall for ppl level students than them staring at the instruments. remember your vfr.

as far as the old requirement for student pilots to do spin training that was done away with years ago. i believe it was 60's but cant really remember and too lazy to look it up. the reasoning behind it was the high amount of stall/spin accidents. what was happening is students would get a couple hours of instruction in spins and then figure they were good to them alone. too many inexperienced pilots spinning caused a high accident rate. as it is now not too many people spin aircraft because they have not received any training on it. once again i do not have the numbers on it but the percentage of stall/spin accidents has decreased dramatically since that time. now i think that spin training is very important and should be a requirement if they could somehow get the point across that spins should not be practiced with limited experience.
anyway my two cents
 
91.307 is somewhat vague.
Hey, the student wants to get his CFI and will move on to an arrow for his commercial, instrument, and CFI training so I want to endorse him for spins in the 172. There you go.
 
My CFI spun my during my first lesson. Scared the heck out of me, but I'm glad I did it because I was very careful about my stalls after that and the one time I did go incipent (sp?) I was able to recover very quickly. I didn't teach privates ever, and didn't do initial CFIs (ATP) but I wouldn't sign off a CFI SE until I had seen them do spins in both directions and I had played dumb student and spun out of a stall and locked on the controls. The first couple spins can be a little scary, but after that they get sort of fun. Besides, spin recovery in a Cessna is easy. Let go of the yoke and scream.
 
I accidentally got myself into the beginning of a spin during my second lesson. Rember people "Right rudder, right rudder, right rudder":)
 
next time...right before it stalls yank that yo...nevermind.

Yah stalls and spins are tons of fun. I used to require that my student pilots be able to recover from a full spin as well as recover from an uncorodinated stalls that lead to initial spins pre-solo.

I may be wrong but I believe the Tomahawk or Traumahawk as it is referred to is directly responsible for the removel of the spin requirement. I always thought it was ironic how they named that plane after something that was invented to spin through the air and cause serious injury/death.

By the way the record for the 150 I've heard is 13 complete rotations.
 
sheesh, I didn't know a 150 could get high enough for 13 twists.
I think I did 5 or so in the decath, maybe 6 I don't remember.
 
When I was instructing, I strongly encouraged spins when it came time to learn stalls, particularly the power-on stall. There's just no other manuver that can match it for learning rudder coordination and building student confidence. I've had several students who went from timitd, wallowing, never-ending stallhorn schreechers to brisk, efficient, precice stalls in one lesson. Even the accelerated stalls seem like no problem after learning spins.

I think a lot of it is mental: An instructor who is afraid for his student to spin will make his student afraid to spin, and so the student is so afraid of 'loosing control' that he gets timid and ham-footed. Once they actually spin the thing, and see how easily the 172 recovers, it's like a lightbulb goes off: "Oh! You actually have to hold the rudder down to keep it spinning! That's not so bad at all! Kinda fun really..." and once the fear of the worst happening is gone, everything just smooths out.

I wouldn't force my students to spin, but I don't think it's a bad idea. If you sign off a guy for solo, and he goes and spins it in because he never learned how to recover and freaks out, what good have you done him? I think you should give your student as many life-saving tools as possible. Granted, the PTS is clear that stalls are not necessary, and a student is within his rights to refuse to do spins, an instructor is also within his rights not to sign him off, so I think it's a judment call really. Moreover, the one reason a student would refuse to spin is fear. I think fear should be replaced with knowledge and skill everywhere in a persons life, particularly in the cockpit. Being afraid is just not a good enough reason; in fact, it's dangerous.
 
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