Spin Training Question

aloft

aloft

New Member
Is spin training required for your initial CFI, or specifically for the CFI-A ride? If you do CFII as your initial, do you have to have completed your spin training prior?
 
aloft said:
Is spin training required for your initial CFI, or specifically for the CFI-A ride? If you do CFII as your initial, do you have to have completed your spin training prior?
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Spin training is required for a CFI, yes. If you have your spin training from your initial CFI-A and then go for your II you don't need to repeat it. If you go straight for your II you still need the spin training, it is a requirement for initial CFI.

§ 61.183 Eligibility requirements.

To be eligible for a flight instructor certificate or rating a person must:

(i) Accomplish the following for a flight instructor certificate with an airplane or a glider rating:​

(1) Receive a logbook endorsement from an authorized instructor indicating that the applicant is competent and possesses instructional proficiency in stall awareness, spin entry, spins, and spin recovery procedures after providing the applicant with flight training in those training areas in an airplane or glider, as appropriate, that is certificated for spins; and​

(2) Demonstrate instructional proficiency in stall awareness, spin entry, spins, and spin recovery procedures. However, upon presentation of the endorsement specified in paragraph (i)(1) of this section an examiner may accept that endorsement as satisfactory evidence of instructional proficiency in stall awareness, spin entry, spins, and spin recovery procedures for the practical test, provided that the practical test is not a retest as a result of the applicant failing the previous test for deficiencies in the knowledge or skill of stall awareness, spin entry, spins, or spin recovery instructional procedures. If the retest is a result of deficiencies in the ability of an applicant to demonstrate knowledge or skill of stall awareness, spin entry, spins, or spin recovery instructional procedures, the examiner must test the person on stall awareness, spin entry, spins, and spin recovery instructional procedures in an airplane or glider, as appropriate, that is certificated for spins;​
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aloft said:
Is spin training required specifically for the CFI-A ride? If you do CFII as your initial, do you have to have completed your spin training prior?
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See how the reg starts:
"§ 61.183 Eligibility requirements.

To be eligible for a flight instructor certificate or rating a person must:
(i) Accomplish the following for a flight instructor certificate with an airplane or a glider rating":..(spin endorsement follows).

That's for an AIRPLANE or GLIDER rating, or in CFI-speak, a CFI-A, or a CFI-G.

For all other CFI's such as Helicopter, or Instruments, this paragraph does not apply.
​
 
and for the love of all that is holy..... go somewhere that specializes in doing sping training, where you will learn how to teach it as it has to be done to instructional proficiency. A half hour in a 152 does not do it......
 
juskl said:
and for the love of all that is holy..... go somewhere that specializes in doing sping training, where you will learn how to teach it as it has to be done to instructional proficiency. A half hour in a 152 does not do it......
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:clap: IMO 3-5 hours!
 
If I have done spin training in a glider, do I need to do it again for a CFI-A?

Would the airplane spin training I did 10 years ago still count for the flight portion now?
 
drunkenbeagle said:
If I have done spin training in a glider, do I need to do it again for a CFI-A?

Would the airplane spin training I did 10 years ago still count for the flight portion now?
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If you have an endorsement saying you've received spin training then no, you don't need to do it again per the FAR's.

Now, if you think it's a good idea to skip out on it that's a whole other ballgame. When it doubt, go spin. It's fun!
 
drunkenbeagle said:
If I have done spin training in a glider, do I need to do it again for a CFI-A?

Would the airplane spin training I did 10 years ago still count for the flight portion now?
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Yes you need to do it again, look: "with flight training in those training areas in an airplane or glider, as appropriate,"

Notice if you are applying for a glider CFI you are set, if you are going for CFI-A you need to do your spins in an airplane. They are separate initial CFI certificates. Just like you can't get a tail wheel sign off in a glider to fly a tailwheel airplane.
 
drunkenbeagle said:
Are you sure? I'm pretty sure spin recovery is not required for a CFI-G add-on (as per the CFI-G PTS).
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I don't know if it's required for glider, but I know you can't do your training in a glider for your CFI-A. Though that regulation does sound like it is necessary for a glider, that was quoted right from the regulation I posted in my first reply. Of course this is just my interpretation, I don't have an AC to back it up, but it seems straight forward.
 
Spin training is ESSENTIAL, I don't care if you've had the TARE/PARE acronym pounded into your head, you will NEED it, and not just for the CFI training sign-off.

I've already employed my training a couple of times, and believe me, you are thankful afterwards if you insure that you get proper training.
 
nosehair said:
See how the reg starts:
"§ 61.183 Eligibility requirements.

To be eligible for a flight instructor certificate or rating a person must:
(i) Accomplish the following for a flight instructor certificate with an airplane or a glider rating":..(spin endorsement follows).

That's for an AIRPLANE or GLIDER rating, or in CFI-speak, a CFI-A, or a CFI-G.

For all other CFI's such as Helicopter, or Instruments, this paragraph does not apply.
​
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You, sir, are correct.

If you do your CFII as your initial, you will not need the endorsement. When you add-on the CFI-A (if you choose), then you'll need it.
 
IslandFlyer said:
You, sir, are correct.

If you do your CFII as your initial, you will not need the endorsement. When you add-on the CFI-A (if you choose), then you'll need it.
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After re-reading AC 61-65E, I'm not so sure. The endorsement doesn't specify category and class. And, for instance, it says it is okay to have the endorsement in ASEL for an initial MEI, or in gliders for and initial Sport Pilot CFI.

Seems odd to be getting exactly (word for word) the same endorsement twice.

46. Spin training: section 61.183(i)(1).
I certify that (First name, MI, Last name) has received the required training of section 61.183(i). I have determined that he/she is competent in instructional skills for training stall awareness, spin entry, spins, and spin recovery procedures.
/s/ [date] J. J. Jones 987654321CFI Exp. 12-31-05
 
nosehair said:
See how the reg starts:
"§ 61.183 Eligibility requirements.

To be eligible for a flight instructor certificate or rating a person must:
(i) Accomplish the following for a flight instructor certificate with an airplane or a glider rating":..(spin endorsement follows).

That's for an AIRPLANE or GLIDER rating, or in CFI-speak, a CFI-A, or a CFI-G.

For all other CFI's such as Helicopter, or Instruments, this paragraph does not apply.
​
Click to expand...

IslandFlyer said:
You, sir, are correct.

If you do your CFII as your initial, you will not need the endorsement. When you add-on the CFI-A (if you choose), then you'll need it.
Click to expand...

I don't agree with that. I read this as saying for "a flight instructor certificate" and a CFI, CFI-I, or MEI are all flight instructor certificates, regardless of the order completed. I don't understand how you got that interpretation. Could you explain.
 
I've done the spin endorsement, but I'll need to do it again I guess. At one point, I had my eye's set on a CFI-S rating, and accordingly, had the instructor sign off the endorsement for 61.405, and not both (61.183), like I should have. O well, its fun anyway
 
nosehair said:
See how the reg starts:
"§ 61.183 Eligibility requirements.

To be eligible for a flight instructor certificate or rating a person must:
(i) Accomplish the following for a flight instructor certificate with an airplane or a glider rating":..(spin endorsement follows).

That's for an AIRPLANE or GLIDER rating, or in CFI-speak, a CFI-A, or a CFI-G.

For all other CFI's such as Helicopter, or Instruments, this paragraph does not apply.
​
Click to expand...

anthenry said:
I don't agree with that. I read this as saying for "a flight instructor certificate" and a CFI, CFI-I, or MEI are all flight instructor certificates, regardless of the order completed. I don't understand how you got that interpretation. Could you explain.
Click to expand...

Read 61.183(i) again....."accomplish the following for a flight instructor certificate with an airplane or glider rating"

I did my CFII as my initial without the spin endorsement, and the Houston FSDO did my checkride. Not saying the FAA is perfect, but from what I understand, it's legal.
 
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