Southwest 737 w/ wingtips
- Thread starter chrisesp
- Start date
CaliforniaSurfer
Well-Known Member
Tomayto...tomawto, but are you guys talking about winglets, or just plain 'ol wingtips?
Surf
Surf
CaptainMatt
Well-Known Member
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Tomayto...tomawto, but are you guys talking about winglets, or just plain 'ol wingtips?
Surf
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I'm pretty sure they are talking about the Big ole Blended Winglets that are massive....
Tomayto...tomawto, but are you guys talking about winglets, or just plain 'ol wingtips?
Surf
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I'm pretty sure they are talking about the Big ole Blended Winglets that are massive....
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What I can't figure out is how they intend to use the double jetways at SAT and ALB with those wingtips in the way.
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John,
What are "double jetways" I keep hearing about????
I was even in SAT a few weeks ago. I guess I should have checked it out.
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Below is a link where I asked the same question. Didn't get a response, though. You don't suppose it's one of those things like snipe hunting, do you?
click here
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What I can't figure out is how they intend to use the double jetways at SAT and ALB with those wingtips in the way.
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John,
What are "double jetways" I keep hearing about????
I was even in SAT a few weeks ago. I guess I should have checked it out.
[/ QUOTE ]
Below is a link where I asked the same question. Didn't get a response, though. You don't suppose it's one of those things like snipe hunting, do you?
click here
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
Double jetways allow for use of both the forward and rear doors. HERE'S a page with some information. I believe what John was questioning was how they are going to slide the jetway to the rear door over the wing when there is a giant winglet sticking up in the way.
On a similar note, does anybody know if it is possible to design the winglets to minimize wake votices? It would be nice to minimize some of the junk coming off the back ends of some heavies. I followed my first 757 the other day. Even with a REALLY long ATC seperation it was like riding a roller coaster.
Ethan
On a similar note, does anybody know if it is possible to design the winglets to minimize wake votices? It would be nice to minimize some of the junk coming off the back ends of some heavies. I followed my first 757 the other day. Even with a REALLY long ATC seperation it was like riding a roller coaster.
Ethan
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[What are "double jetways" I keep hearing about????
I was even in SAT a few weeks ago. I guess I should have checked it out.
[/ QUOTE ]
They have them in AUS too...at least they did last time I was there.
They are jetways that hook up to doors 1L and 2L at the same time allowing passengers to deplane from the front and back. Everyone ends up going into the terminal through the same door, so it's more like a jetway with two openings than a double jetway.
It's just like the jetways the use at some foreign airports for the widebodies - one opening hooks to the front door for first/business class customers and the other hooks up to the middle door for everyone else...except these somehow go over/around the wing to reach that back door.
[What are "double jetways" I keep hearing about????
I was even in SAT a few weeks ago. I guess I should have checked it out.
[/ QUOTE ]
They have them in AUS too...at least they did last time I was there.
They are jetways that hook up to doors 1L and 2L at the same time allowing passengers to deplane from the front and back. Everyone ends up going into the terminal through the same door, so it's more like a jetway with two openings than a double jetway.
It's just like the jetways the use at some foreign airports for the widebodies - one opening hooks to the front door for first/business class customers and the other hooks up to the middle door for everyone else...except these somehow go over/around the wing to reach that back door.
Alchemy
Well-Known Member
Yep, they have them at AUS too, I deplaned using the rear portion of a double jetway a few months ago.
I gave instruction to the director of southwest ground ops at AUS a couple of weeks ago and he said the double jet ways will be programmed to "lift themselves" over the winglets, then drop back down into place once clear of the wing.
I gave instruction to the director of southwest ground ops at AUS a couple of weeks ago and he said the double jet ways will be programmed to "lift themselves" over the winglets, then drop back down into place once clear of the wing.
NJA_Capt
Well-Known Member
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I see a HUGE accident (well, actually an incident) waiting to happen.
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No, you're right. It would be an accident because it is sure to be more than 25K. The wingtip on a CX is about 64K. I imagine a "winglet" on a 737 is a bit more.
What rocket scientist came up with the double jetway idea for a guppy (737)? And out of two high density airports like AUS and SAT no less. (sarcasm). Back in the good old days we had these strange and exotic things called S-T-A-I-R-S.
747/2 jetways = 200+ people per door.
737/1 jetway = 140 people per door.
Is it really that much quicker?
I see a HUGE accident (well, actually an incident) waiting to happen.
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No, you're right. It would be an accident because it is sure to be more than 25K. The wingtip on a CX is about 64K. I imagine a "winglet" on a 737 is a bit more.
What rocket scientist came up with the double jetway idea for a guppy (737)? And out of two high density airports like AUS and SAT no less. (sarcasm). Back in the good old days we had these strange and exotic things called S-T-A-I-R-S.
747/2 jetways = 200+ people per door.
737/1 jetway = 140 people per door.
Is it really that much quicker?
Alchemy
Well-Known Member
It's not an accident waiting to happen, it already has happened. Several months ago one of the dual jet ways at AUS impacted a 737 wing (without winglets) and caused significant damage. They are using them at AUS and SAT specifically becaues they are not high density airports....I believe they're still in a trial testing phase (have been for at least a year now). WN does have about 60-70 flights per day departing AUS and probably about the same number out of SAT, if not more.
av8trxx
Well-Known Member
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Just curious about this one but today I saw a SW 737 with wingtips in the old paint scheme. I thought the ones with wingtips were newer jets and whould be painted with the new color scheme? Are they just adding the wingtips to older jets, or are these newer jets?
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The whole -700 fleet is being retro-fitted, regardless of the colors. If one with the old scheme is scheduled for a retrofit, then they get the blended winglets but will get the new paint later on. New delieveries and the retrofits of the 133 a/c without are being done by Aviation Partners Boeing. The first set of 169 winglets went on in Oct 2003 and the remaining installations were forecast to be complete within two years. SWA has options for 373 additional blended winglet sets through 2012 (to cover the -300s too).
SWA figures they will "save 92,000 gallons of fuel per yer per a/c, add 115nm extra range and lower engine maintenance costs and reduce takeoff noise (lesspower needed due to reduced drag). Plus the aerodynamic boost provided will permit payload increases...as well as shorten the time to cruise altitude".
Just curious about this one but today I saw a SW 737 with wingtips in the old paint scheme. I thought the ones with wingtips were newer jets and whould be painted with the new color scheme? Are they just adding the wingtips to older jets, or are these newer jets?
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The whole -700 fleet is being retro-fitted, regardless of the colors. If one with the old scheme is scheduled for a retrofit, then they get the blended winglets but will get the new paint later on. New delieveries and the retrofits of the 133 a/c without are being done by Aviation Partners Boeing. The first set of 169 winglets went on in Oct 2003 and the remaining installations were forecast to be complete within two years. SWA has options for 373 additional blended winglet sets through 2012 (to cover the -300s too).
SWA figures they will "save 92,000 gallons of fuel per yer per a/c, add 115nm extra range and lower engine maintenance costs and reduce takeoff noise (lesspower needed due to reduced drag). Plus the aerodynamic boost provided will permit payload increases...as well as shorten the time to cruise altitude".
Mr_Creepy
Well-Known Member
It may have been Austin and not San Antonio where I saw them in Texas. Commuting to PHX I went through both of those cities fairly often. That incident in AUS/SAT was several years ago and it hasn't happened since that I know of.
ALB has one and I understand BWI is installing one. I have no idea how they are going to get over the winglet.
About the winglet mod, the pilots swear it saves fuel and adds 4kts to the speed.
ALB has one and I understand BWI is installing one. I have no idea how they are going to get over the winglet.
About the winglet mod, the pilots swear it saves fuel and adds 4kts to the speed.
Currently the dual jet bridges are in AUS, DAL, and ALB. The ones in ALB are capable of getting over the winglets, but the ones in DAL and AUS can't. It is quite a sight in ALB because the aft portion of the jetway sticks up at about a 45 degree angle when they are not in use... they move inward & then down to clear the winglets.
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
NJA makes a good point. Is there a reason for using the double bridges? From the sound of it, it takes longer to move them into position, not to mention they have to cost more to install and operate then the singles. They might make sense for aircaft with 400 or more people, but last I checked you aren't going to find more then 175 people on ANY southwest flight. In reality, once the door actually gets opened, it doesn't take that long to get off a narrow body plane. If they were really going for cost savings and efficency they would install airstairs on both doors and invest in a whole bunch of unbrellas in case it rains.
Ethan
Ethan
av8trxx
Well-Known Member
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NJA makes a good point. Is there a reason for using the double bridges?...If they were really going for cost savings and efficency they would install airstairs on both doors and invest in a whole bunch of unbrellas in case it rains.
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Several years ago when the double bridge idea first came out the company said it would be a time saver on quick turns. Kinda like BUR and their double end airstair operation. The winglets are a quandry they hadn't thought of when the jetway went into service because SWA didn't have them at the time. I wonder if these 'test' jetway projects have really proved themselves that much faster than doing it the old fashioned way. Nowadays days getting 137 off and on with all their rollerbags can be quite time consuming (no 10 minute turn there), but AUS has so many business travellers with out all the pesky carry ons maybe it was worth it.
NJA makes a good point. Is there a reason for using the double bridges?...If they were really going for cost savings and efficency they would install airstairs on both doors and invest in a whole bunch of unbrellas in case it rains.
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Several years ago when the double bridge idea first came out the company said it would be a time saver on quick turns. Kinda like BUR and their double end airstair operation. The winglets are a quandry they hadn't thought of when the jetway went into service because SWA didn't have them at the time. I wonder if these 'test' jetway projects have really proved themselves that much faster than doing it the old fashioned way. Nowadays days getting 137 off and on with all their rollerbags can be quite time consuming (no 10 minute turn there), but AUS has so many business travellers with out all the pesky carry ons maybe it was worth it.
USAFplt
Well-Known Member
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I see a HUGE accident (well, actually an incident) waiting to happen.
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No, you're right. It would be an accident because it is sure to be more than 25K. The wingtip on a CX is about 64K. I imagine a "winglet" on a 737 is a bit more.
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Sure is..SWA is paying 1 million per pair of winglets for their 700s.
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I see a HUGE accident (well, actually an incident) waiting to happen.
[/ QUOTE ]
No, you're right. It would be an accident because it is sure to be more than 25K. The wingtip on a CX is about 64K. I imagine a "winglet" on a 737 is a bit more.
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Sure is..SWA is paying 1 million per pair of winglets for their 700s.
mtsu_av8er
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
What rocket scientist came up with the double jetway idea for a guppy (737)? And out of two high density airports like AUS and SAT no less. (sarcasm). Back in the good old days we had these strange and exotic things called S-T-A-I-R-S.
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Well, when you're the only major airline making money, you can afford to splurge on things like efficiency instead of new paint schemes....
Ok, ok...one day, I'll quit!!!!
What rocket scientist came up with the double jetway idea for a guppy (737)? And out of two high density airports like AUS and SAT no less. (sarcasm). Back in the good old days we had these strange and exotic things called S-T-A-I-R-S.
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Well, when you're the only major airline making money, you can afford to splurge on things like efficiency instead of new paint schemes....
Ok, ok...one day, I'll quit!!!!