Score - Left Traffic 1 / Right Traffic 0

Acadia

Acadia

Well-Known Member
The FAA & the airport manager at my home field were at last issuing citations to pilots flying right traffic here today (all runways are left traffic at BHB). I was quite amazed how defiant some of these pilots were even when their actions were witnessed my multiple people. A number of pilots seemed to think traffic direction at uncontrolled fields is optional or only a suggestion. I am betting that when the faxes and letters from the FAA start hitting the desks of various chief pilots and boss’s these pilots will have a slight attitude change. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
 
Re: Score - Left Traffic 1 & Right Traffic 0

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The FAA & the airport manager at my home field were at last issuing citations to pilots flying right traffic here today (all runways are left traffic at BHB). I was quite amazed how defiant some of these pilots were even when their actions were witnessed my multiple people. A number of pilots seemed to think traffic direction at uncontrolled fields is optional or only a suggestion. I am betting that when the faxes and letters from the FAA start hitting the desks of various chief pilots and boss’s these pilots will have a slight attitude change. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

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Well, pilots going into a field should know the traffic pattern directions/restrictions for every runway. Only time traffic pattern doesn't matter, is when flying an instrument approach and circling, consistent with any circling restrictions noted on the IAP plate. Some uncontrolled airports take "pattern" to also mean "no straight ins", which is also wrong, unless an actual stated restriction in the VFR Supp or A/FD.

Generally speaking, it's wise to know the patterns of the field you're going in to and "keep the flow going", both for smoother ops and overall safety.
 
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You would think pilots would take the time to know these things but frequently that is not the case. I’m often a little embarrassed for some of these people.
 
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You would think pilots would take the time to know these things but frequently that is not the case. I’m often a little embarrassed for some of these people.

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I wonder if some of the pilots even care. I was flying into a rather busy uncontrolled airport this afternoon. I dialed in the CTAF, and everyone was landing and departing on 13. A twin engine (a Mooney I believe) called for straight in on 31. The four other aircraft in the area had to wait for this fool to land and taxi clear.
 
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That is another item the airport manager was on the lookout for. We have a calm wind runway for noise abatement (runway 22). Frequently it is either calm or there can even be 10-15kts of wind right down 22 with traffic in the pattern and in comes traffic for runway 04. Even if you let them know traffic is using 22 and the airport rules require it they continue for 04 anyway. Even worse they are pretty arrogant about doing so and it is a fairly common event.
 
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Sounds exactly like Newport. We had 3 airplanes within 1 1/2 miles all on final, two of them were within 500'. I was the third, and helped my student stay clear of the accident waiting to happen.
 
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A twin engine (a Mooney I believe) called for straight in on 31

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A Mooney would only be a single but it does not surprise me in the least that a Mooney called a straight in. What is it with Mooney pilots?

I have seen one go as far as to call a 12 mile final with 4 other A/C in pattern.

The best is when they get on the ground and act as if a line guy has never seen a Mooney and the rest of the world is all morons.

Didn't Eagle have a Mooney.......................
 
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A Mooney would only be a single but it does not surprise me in the least that a Mooney called a straight in. What is it with Mooney pilots?

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They don't slow down and go down at the same time very well. The earlier models didn't have spoilers either. Someone with poor planning abilities would probably find shooting a straight-in to be easier.
 
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Some uncontrolled airports take "pattern" to also mean "no straight ins", which is also wrong, unless an actual stated restriction in the VFR Supp or A/FD.

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So this came up yesterday in a flight for me. I was telling a stud that patterns were regulatory in nature and needed to be aheared to when in the same breath I was telling him to set up for a straight-in. He queried this thinking and said it was a good question but I believe the thinking is that when others are reported in the traffic pattern it is expected you will enter the pattern appropriately and give way to the lowest plane (insert rule about not taking advantage of that).

But why is it that straight-in approaches are ok in to uncontrolled fields where no one has to have a radio???
 
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So this came up yesterday in a flight for me. I was telling a stud that patterns were regulatory in nature and needed to be aheared to when in the same breath I was telling him to set up for a straight-in. He queried this thinking and said it was a good question but I believe the thinking is that when others are reported in the traffic pattern it is expected you will enter the pattern appropriately and give way to the lowest plane (insert rule about not taking advantage of that).

But why is it that straight-in approaches are ok in to uncontrolled fields where no one has to have a radio???

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It's the old see and avoid. I know, seems like a simplistic answer, and truthfully I don't know the exact reasoning why it's allowed vs not allowed. I know there's not much of a safety problem with it if people turning base final are checking extended final while in the turn. Personally, if I were flying NORDO (in VFR/VMC) I'd enter the normal pattern and "flow" into the field for landing. But that's just me. At any other time, I'd do a straight-in (if no restrictions) if it's convenient, while keeping CTAF well-informed of my position and intentions, and making all my position calls "miles" from the runway or known VFR landmarks, versus intersection or point names on an IAP or DME, just so everyone can be on the same page. That being said, unlike the aforementioned Mooney pilot, I'd NEVER make a straight-in opposite the active-runway traffic flow, when there's other traffic only because it's convenient for me; unless there's some greater emergency at that time.
 
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Yeah, that parallels my thinking too. If anyone is in the pattern I acquiesce to the pattern with the normal 45 degree entry.

You bring up another beef I have though. I can't stand it when pilots, especially the new instrument students, give calls out to the pattern in VFR conditions from intersections. What really gets me is if CFI's to this acting as the safety pilot. They of all people should know that most people flying VFR will not be familar with the IAP intersections and even if they were, who has memoried all the DME and visual points of the intersections. Physical landmarks are the best.
 
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Yeah, that parallels my thinking too. If anyone is in the pattern I acquiesce to the pattern with the normal 45 degree entry.

You bring up another beef I have though. I can't stand it when pilots, especially the new instrument students, give calls out to the pattern in VFR conditions from intersections. What really gets me is if CFI's to this acting as the safety pilot. They of all people should know that most people flying VFR will not be familar with the IAP intersections and even if they were, who has memoried all the DME and visual points of the intersections. Physical landmarks are the best.

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Fully agree. I'm glad the IR studs or IR pilots know where they are on the plate and can odentify that, but when making the calls to an uncontrolled field pattern, like you said, there's likely many on the CTAF freq that don't know what that means, so that was, in essence, a wasted position call, if you will. Agree, physical landmarks are best, and the CFI or safety pilot could either make the call, or inform the pilot under the hood what landmark is near them (or miles) if he wishes to make the call. To me, that would be good training (adapting to your environment) as well as safe. And I, like you, believe that CFIs should be teaching this way.
 
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Yeah, that parallels my thinking too. If anyone is in the pattern I acquiesce to the pattern with the normal 45 degree entry.

You bring up another beef I have though. I can't stand it when pilots, especially the new instrument students, give calls out to the pattern in VFR conditions from intersections. What really gets me is if CFI's to this acting as the safety pilot. They of all people should know that most people flying VFR will not be familar with the IAP intersections and even if they were, who has memoried all the DME and visual points of the intersections. Physical landmarks are the best.

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I agree with one small caveat: Direction and distance from the field mean a lot more to me as a pilot unfamiliar to the area. Local landmarks can be as useless to me as intersections are to a VFR only pilot.

Even controllers can fall prey to this. I was flying into VRB one time and was told to "expect the Flying J approach". <WTF me thinks to meself> "Unfamiliar"

I'll also agree on straight-ins at an uncontrolled field. I will only fly a straight-in, or sometimes enter on a base leg, if I have not heard any traffic reporting in the pattern. If I have been unable to monitor the CTAF from about 10 miles out, I will plan on flying the full pattern, assuming that I may have missed calls of someone in the pattern. Head on a swivel, always.

There have been some exceptions to this, but all have been in very specific circumstances. For example, when returning to the home field from a 135 trip, I will make an initial position call on CTAF 10 miles east of the field, without stating intentions (rwy 26 is typically favored). Occasionally there will be someone in the pattern, but it will be one of the local instructors that I know personally. In that case we may work together to confirm if a straight-in will work without hindering their pattern work. They are usually very accomodating, and I am very careful to determine that I will not cause them to extend a downwind, or otherwise interfere with them. If they offer to extend, I will usually decline because I want them on my side in the future, not begrudging. I will usually not do this at an unfamiliar field, or with someone I do not know and trust. Those three extra minutes are just not worth the risk.
 
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I agree with one small caveat: Direction and distance from the field mean a lot more to me as a pilot unfamiliar to the area. Local landmarks can be as useless to me as intersections are to a VFR only pilot.



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I was sort of assuming that in my post. Stuff like "XX, 7 mile final for 23 stop and go" or on initial call "XX, 6 miles southwest for downwind". And I agree they're all good calls for letting people now who you are, where you are, and what your intentions are. If others in the pattern seem to all be using landmarks, then in that case, I'll do my best to fit in, anytime else, agree that distance direction is the best fallback.
 
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The flying J approach wpuld be to Ft. Pierce. I did all of my training at VRB and even I didn't know what the Flying J approach was there!
 
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The flying J approach wpuld be to Ft. Pierce. I did all of my training at VRB and even I didn't know what the Flying J approach was there!

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Yeah, yeah,....Ft. Pierce.....yeah, that's what I meant.

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
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I was telling a stud that patterns were regulatory in nature and needed to be aheared to when in the same breath I was telling him to set up for a straight-in.

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Well, you could always say that a straight in is a pattern -- but it's only to be done when there is no other traffic in the pattern unless there's an emergency.
 
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Anyone ever fly into SCE/UNV in PA? That airport is a pain in the rear with the GA and Glider traffic. The airport manger even gets to play ATC by assigning runways. I'm flying 121 and we have been issued a memo by our company that if the runway assigned is not acceptable we must call the manager and request a runway change and wait for it. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif

Another question...why does State College have two Identifies in the US Air system?
 
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My FBO has both right and left-hand patterns depending on which runway you are using.

That said, we frequently get straight-in-ers (mainly to RWY 21). For the most part, it's been a non-issue. Everyone is pretty good about staying on the radios and reporting positions frequently.
 
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A twin engine (a Mooney I believe) called for straight in on 31

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A Mooney would only be a single but it does not surprise me in the least that a Mooney called a straight in. What is it with Mooney pilots?

I have seen one go as far as to call a 12 mile final with 4 other A/C in pattern.



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FLYMcDoofer,
I could have written this post myself. I am happy to see that there is someone that feels the same as me.

Oh... and I finally gave some dual IN a Mooney. It was cramped and felt anemic on takeoff... what's the love affair with this make anyways???
 
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