Pilots -- Things Controller's Say That Annoy You.
- Thread starter staplegun
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LawnGnome
Well-Known Member
The only rebuttal I have to re-asking if you have the current information is when I pilot gets all ticked off cause I asked him if he had the information again and he comes back and says in a smart tone, yeah I told you the first time I called.
Well...in the tower, we don't split our duties like most piloted planes do. This increases the workload.
Also, we are not just talking to one plane as the plane is only talking to one controller...we are doing multiple things, scanning the taxiways, helping the tower controller scan the runways, coordinating on inter-intra facility lines to other facilities to coordinate other things for you such as release times. Talking to other vehicles such as airfield ops, airport fuel trucks, and airport firefighters and ambulances on a completely different radio that you don't hear, coordinating with the other controllers in the tower for flow times, runway crossings....and then you have something out of the ordinary happens and you are trying to assist the other controller that is down the "crapper" how to handle the situation so he doesn't have a "deal"....we got phones ringing in the back ground that we don't have enough staffing to answer, weather radios alarming because NATCA makes us have them in the towers now (completely useless), airway facility technicians in the tower trying to fix your equipment and in your way..
or we could just be making coffee on the other side of the tower and you call us up and we aren't paying attention.
Sometimes we don't catch everything, but we would rather be certain that we know you have all the proper information rather than sending you on your way without it and something happening where it would fall back on us.
Well...in the tower, we don't split our duties like most piloted planes do. This increases the workload.
Also, we are not just talking to one plane as the plane is only talking to one controller...we are doing multiple things, scanning the taxiways, helping the tower controller scan the runways, coordinating on inter-intra facility lines to other facilities to coordinate other things for you such as release times. Talking to other vehicles such as airfield ops, airport fuel trucks, and airport firefighters and ambulances on a completely different radio that you don't hear, coordinating with the other controllers in the tower for flow times, runway crossings....and then you have something out of the ordinary happens and you are trying to assist the other controller that is down the "crapper" how to handle the situation so he doesn't have a "deal"....we got phones ringing in the back ground that we don't have enough staffing to answer, weather radios alarming because NATCA makes us have them in the towers now (completely useless), airway facility technicians in the tower trying to fix your equipment and in your way..
or we could just be making coffee on the other side of the tower and you call us up and we aren't paying attention.
Sometimes we don't catch everything, but we would rather be certain that we know you have all the proper information rather than sending you on your way without it and something happening where it would fall back on us.
ppragman
FLIPY FLAPS!
-Controller - "Traffic is a beech 1900 five mile final landing anchorage runway 14."
(This traffic is about 15 miles away from me, totally no factor at all, on my current heading I'll pass well behind and above it).
-Me "Contact."
-Controller-"Maintain visual separation from that traffic, and can you provide your own wake turbulence avoidance?"
-Me- "Affirmative"
Its a beech 1900 not a 747! :banghead::banghead::banghead:
Its gotten to the point where whenever they point out something that I think they may call that on (anything the size of king airs, 1900s, metros, saabs, and up) that I just say (if I have it in sight, naturally):
"I have that traffic, I'll provide visually seperation and wake turbulence avoidance."
That way the freq isn't so dammed cluttered.
(This traffic is about 15 miles away from me, totally no factor at all, on my current heading I'll pass well behind and above it).
-Me "Contact."
-Controller-"Maintain visual separation from that traffic, and can you provide your own wake turbulence avoidance?"
-Me- "Affirmative"
Its a beech 1900 not a 747! :banghead::banghead::banghead:
Its gotten to the point where whenever they point out something that I think they may call that on (anything the size of king airs, 1900s, metros, saabs, and up) that I just say (if I have it in sight, naturally):
"I have that traffic, I'll provide visually seperation and wake turbulence avoidance."
That way the freq isn't so dammed cluttered.
troopernflight
Well-Known Member
Severe cross wind, right at touch down..."N123DC, where are you going to park?" If they could just wait until I'm safely on the ground!
whysoserial
New Member
Not saying you are, but don't feel obligated to try to key up and answer...
JDE
Well-Known Member
I must agree - happens all the time lately. My favorite - when CD and Ground are the same controller and you end up telling them FOUR times that you have the ATIS...and you're the only one they're talking to...:banghead:
KC Jake
Well-Known Member
Or them saying anything unnecessary to you when you're anywhere between short final and touch down.
NJA_Capt
Well-Known Member
Gee. This is an easy one:
Anything that includes "descend" prior to my TOD point.
Anything that includes "slow to ...."
Anything that includes "traffic you are following is an RJ ..."
Step climbs/descents in 1000' increments.
Any radio calls/questions during rollout prior to slowing to taxi speed.
After receiving PDC you are instructed to call CD to "verify the route." Wouldn't it be easier to verify it before sending the PDC?
30 mile finals when its VMC
170kt traffic patterns (Class B).
Calling up a Class D tower who is having an air-air dialog with a local pilot. After 5 attempts at a hand off from ZMA, the controller says "your not the only one in the air ya know!" Gee, sorry I interrupted your personal conversation with work.
Funniest thing:
ZDC: Execjet xxx we need you to pick your speed up!
EJAxxx: We're doing Mach .915 Ma'am, what would you like?
ZDC: (long silence) Disregard
I hear you staple. I love it when we call up: xxx gnd, eja123 at Signature with "alpha" ready to taxi. Roger, say location and advise when you have alpha.
Anything that includes "descend" prior to my TOD point.
Anything that includes "slow to ...."
Anything that includes "traffic you are following is an RJ ..."
Step climbs/descents in 1000' increments.
Any radio calls/questions during rollout prior to slowing to taxi speed.
After receiving PDC you are instructed to call CD to "verify the route." Wouldn't it be easier to verify it before sending the PDC?
30 mile finals when its VMC
170kt traffic patterns (Class B).
Calling up a Class D tower who is having an air-air dialog with a local pilot. After 5 attempts at a hand off from ZMA, the controller says "your not the only one in the air ya know!" Gee, sorry I interrupted your personal conversation with work.
Funniest thing:
ZDC: Execjet xxx we need you to pick your speed up!
EJAxxx: We're doing Mach .915 Ma'am, what would you like?
ZDC: (long silence) Disregard
I hear you staple. I love it when we call up: xxx gnd, eja123 at Signature with "alpha" ready to taxi. Roger, say location and advise when you have alpha.
frog_flyer
FredFlyer
"Do not enter the Class Bravo"
LawnGnome
Well-Known Member
Here is the reason you got that traffic call...it is an ATC requirement:
5-1-8. MERGING TARGET PROCEDURES
a. Except while they are established in a holding pattern, apply merging target procedures to all radar identified:
1. Aircraft at 10,000 feet and above.
2. Turbojet aircraft regardless of altitude.
[SIZE=-2]REFERENCE-
P/CG Term- Turbojet Aircraft.[/SIZE]
3. Presidential aircraft regardless of altitude.
b. Issue traffic information to those aircraft listed in subpara a whose targets appear likely to merge unless the aircraft are separated by more than the appropriate vertical separation minima.
EXAMPLE-
"Traffic twelve o'clock, seven miles, eastbound, MD-80, at one seven thousand."
"United Sixteen and American Twenty-five, traffic twelve o'clock, one zero miles, opposite direction, eastbound seven twenty seven at flight level three three zero, westbound MD-Eighty at flight level three one zero."
c. When both aircraft in subpara b are in RVSM airspace, and vertically separated by 1,000 feet, if either pilot reports they are unable to maintain RVSM due to turbulence or mountain wave, vector either aircraft to avoid merging with the target of the other aircraft.
EXAMPLE-
"Delta One Twenty Three, fly heading two niner zero, vector for traffic. Traffic twelve o'clock, one zero miles, opposite direction, MD-80 eastbound at flight level three two zero."
d. If the pilot requests, vector his/her aircraft to avoid merging with the target of previously issued traffic.
NOTE-
Aircraft closure rates are so rapid that when applying merging target procedures, controller issuance of traffic must be commenced in ample time for the pilot to decide if a vector is necessary.
e. If unable to provide vector service, inform the pilot.
NOTE-
The phraseology "Unable RVSM due turbulence (or mountain wave)" is only intended for severe turbulence or other weather encounters with altitude deviations of approximately 200 feet or more.
5-1-8. MERGING TARGET PROCEDURES
a. Except while they are established in a holding pattern, apply merging target procedures to all radar identified:
1. Aircraft at 10,000 feet and above.
2. Turbojet aircraft regardless of altitude.
[SIZE=-2]REFERENCE-
P/CG Term- Turbojet Aircraft.[/SIZE]
3. Presidential aircraft regardless of altitude.
b. Issue traffic information to those aircraft listed in subpara a whose targets appear likely to merge unless the aircraft are separated by more than the appropriate vertical separation minima.
EXAMPLE-
"Traffic twelve o'clock, seven miles, eastbound, MD-80, at one seven thousand."
"United Sixteen and American Twenty-five, traffic twelve o'clock, one zero miles, opposite direction, eastbound seven twenty seven at flight level three three zero, westbound MD-Eighty at flight level three one zero."
c. When both aircraft in subpara b are in RVSM airspace, and vertically separated by 1,000 feet, if either pilot reports they are unable to maintain RVSM due to turbulence or mountain wave, vector either aircraft to avoid merging with the target of the other aircraft.
EXAMPLE-
"Delta One Twenty Three, fly heading two niner zero, vector for traffic. Traffic twelve o'clock, one zero miles, opposite direction, MD-80 eastbound at flight level three two zero."
d. If the pilot requests, vector his/her aircraft to avoid merging with the target of previously issued traffic.
NOTE-
Aircraft closure rates are so rapid that when applying merging target procedures, controller issuance of traffic must be commenced in ample time for the pilot to decide if a vector is necessary.
e. If unable to provide vector service, inform the pilot.
NOTE-
The phraseology "Unable RVSM due turbulence (or mountain wave)" is only intended for severe turbulence or other weather encounters with altitude deviations of approximately 200 feet or more.
charlie1017
Well-Known Member
Having some fun at Kennedy huh? How about that dude who works in the afternoon at JFK ground who seems to be upset all the time!
"Southernjets 16 EVERYONE IS WAITING FOR YOU!!!"
AEX Tower: Mesaba XXXX exit A3 ground point 7
Me: A3 over to ground Mesaba XXXX
Me: Ground Mesaba XXXX clear of 14 at A3
AEX Ground (same damn controller!): Taxi to the ramp
If you're wondering why I was pissed its because A3 runs directly into the ramp....the lady couldn't have said "taxi to the ramp with me" on tower freq?!?!?!? Oh yeah at 9:30 at night too! Adult beverages keep us sane....
Me: A3 over to ground Mesaba XXXX
Me: Ground Mesaba XXXX clear of 14 at A3
AEX Ground (same damn controller!): Taxi to the ramp
If you're wondering why I was pissed its because A3 runs directly into the ramp....the lady couldn't have said "taxi to the ramp with me" on tower freq?!?!?!? Oh yeah at 9:30 at night too! Adult beverages keep us sane....
beechpilot
Well-Known Member
"Say again, I was on the landline."
PilotBeckfizzle
Well-Known Member
We have a tower controller where I fly out of that asks us to verify everything.
Example;
"N1234 at area november with information foxtrot request taxi for southwest departure"
Controller- "1234 taxi to 17 left via alpha and verify you have foxtrot".
Have foxtrot taxi 17 left via aplha, 1234"
Controller 2 minutes later while planes are still in non movement area - "verify taxiing to 17 left via alpha"
"Rog, taxiing 17 left via Alpha 1234"
It just goes on and on with every plane. I'm just waiting for him to ask me to verify that I verified.
Another one and not that its an annoyance but at one of the other local airports we've got a controller who we've affectionately named sing song because she straight up sings the ATIS...and not well but she tries.
Example;
"N1234 at area november with information foxtrot request taxi for southwest departure"
Controller- "1234 taxi to 17 left via alpha and verify you have foxtrot".
Have foxtrot taxi 17 left via aplha, 1234"
Controller 2 minutes later while planes are still in non movement area - "verify taxiing to 17 left via alpha"
"Rog, taxiing 17 left via Alpha 1234"
It just goes on and on with every plane. I'm just waiting for him to ask me to verify that I verified.
Another one and not that its an annoyance but at one of the other local airports we've got a controller who we've affectionately named sing song because she straight up sings the ATIS...and not well but she tries.
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