NATCA ?

Last time I checked it was the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) not the Future Farmers of America (FFA) but maybe that didnt come up on your spell checker?
 
Booyah!!!

hey ATLTRACON, do you mind if I just follow up your posts like I'm one of your "lackeys"?

Uhh, well I'm not as devoted towards message boards as some people, but when other people go ahead and make a point that I agree with, I would like their approval to just agree in a childish way.

For the record, I'm an "in the process" kid who just wants to join up with the controllers. I've wanted this for a long time, and I think I'm close (I took at-sat march 4 and got a 100. I think I have the skill set, and I'm hard headed in the sense that I won't quit trying until I'm kicked out).
 
Seggy.....I am in this for a career. I will spend the rest of my life in a controller, managerial, and consultant role.I want the experience as a controller for my resume so I can later join the FAA in program management and actually make a change for the better for everyone.
(and yes I know you will all laugh at that, but I DO believe that)

You all dont have to agree with me, as you are controllers and have a very one sided mind, i know alot wont agree with me, but you all bewildering me is not cool, your the ones who give controllers a bad name, not us so called noobies.
 
You kids just don't get it do you?

I love how NATCA is being blamed for the current work conditions.

Point the finger(s) in the direction of your guys' future employer (if you get your way). Why anyone would start taking up a defense of the FAA's hiring, work rules, and occupational practices are beyond me.

What exactly is so damn bad about having a collective bargaining association, that is defending YOU, and protecting YOUR career from an employer who has ZERO regard for your health, or your mental state?

WAKE THE HELL UP.

NATCA is NOT the devil in this situation, they haven't been EVER. The FAA, and the horrible leadership that exists at the top are the ones you need to start questioning. Just because you want to work as a controller, doesn't mean you have to be ignorant to the obvious facts that the FAA does not care about you.
 
dcatcdude said:
1st yes i am in the hiring process, and have never had an issue with NATCA, nor anyone from NATCA

2nd. I understand what NATCA does, but I PERSONALLY think that they take the wrong approach to everything. AS I belive MANAGERS do to. its a product of a system thats has been broken for many many years. If it continues this way it will never be fixed.

NATCA and both managers need to learn to compromise and both be on the same level. THATS WHAT IM GETTING AT!

The reason you guys currently are worked so hard is due to the inability of the controller work force trying to understand why there have not been more hiring in previous years. The FAA would of loved to hire more, but was unable to due to congress and the budget. hence why they outsourced AFSS so that they make more room in the budget for hiring. I can guarentee you that they did not want to end up cutting costs, but they had to to avoid you guys working harder than you already due. If you dont understand that you are just flat out iggnorant.

FAA gets more money------hires more people-------trains more people------less stressed and not overworked the workforce is

how hard is it to understand that?
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Let me get this straight ... you have yet to step inside an FAA facility as an air traffic controller but you have the answers to all the problems with the FAA, NATCA, hiring, and every other problem facing the agency.

It's times like this I wish the FAA did not drug test because whatever you are smoking must be some really good stuff... you are in for such a rude awakening if you get hired. The reality vs the fantasy that you are posting could not be further apart...
 
surreal1221 said:
You kids just don't get it do you?

I love how NATCA is being blamed for the current work conditions.

Point the finger(s) in the direction of your guys' future employer (if you get your way). Why anyone would start taking up a defense of the FAA's hiring, work rules, and occupational practices are beyond me.

What exactly is so damn bad about having a collective bargaining association, that is defending YOU, and protecting YOUR career from an employer who has ZERO regard for your health, or your mental state?

WAKE THE HELL UP.

NATCA is NOT the devil in this situation, they haven't been EVER. The FAA, and the horrible leadership that exists at the top are the ones you need to start questioning. Just because you want to work as a controller, doesn't mean you have to be ignorant to the obvious facts that the FAA does not care about you.
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Most get it Surreal ... my area has been getting new people and the WCG guys up in the training department have sought me out to stop in on them as there first questions had to do with how do I join NATCA ...

The all hands meetings have also had a nice showing of new faces as well.
 
well clearly i guess im wrong according to you guys. mabye one day you will prove me wrong, but i will standby what I say and that it should be a team effort, not FAA vs NATCA. the seperation that exists today will never do anygood for anyone.

that is all I will say on this subject, but I really hope one day I am right and everyone is a team and everyone makes many many strides foward to the same goal.
 
dcatcdude said:
well clearly i guess im wrong according to you guys. mabye one day you will prove me wrong, but i will standby what I say and that it should be a team effort, not FAA vs NATCA. the seperation that exists today will never do anygood for anyone.

that is all I will say on this subject, but I really hope one day I am right and everyone is a team and everyone makes many many strides foward to the same goal.
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I don't want to come across as mean but you have no facts or first hand experience to back up your claims and hence your argument is flawed. At first your post seemed like troll bait but the more I reflect on your posts you just seem young and not experienced in the world of labor and government employment... while that in itself is not a bad thing not listening to what those with experience tell you is.

When you report to duty your first day with preconceived opinions about the union and the job you are going to have a hard time. I can respect someone who joins the union and 12-16 months later leaves and says it's not for them and states the reasons why. Someone with no facts or experience but already have their mind made up just comes across as plain ignorant and closed minded.

Joining NATCA is more then just being part of a labor group ... you are going to be brought into a group of very experienced people that will be putting their livelihood's on the line to train you, they will share with you the wisdom they have amassed over their long careers both in working traffic and surviving the pit falls of the job of a controller.

Remember one fact... NATCA did NOT draw the line in the sand... the Bush / Blakey FAA did.
 
Fox Xray said:
Most get it Surreal ... my area has been getting new people and the WCG guys up in the training department have sought me out to stop in on them as there first questions had to do with how do I join NATCA ...

The all hands meetings have also had a nice showing of new faces as well.
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That is refreshing to know. Are any NATCA reps allowed to inform the trainees out in OKC?

Essentially, does the FAA allocate any time for the association to do any sort of introduction / indoctrination of the workforce out in OKC?

I recall reading a clause in the previous contract that said the FAA would provide a period of time allocated for the association to speak to new hires, etc.

Fox Xray said:
When you report to duty your first day with preconceived opinions about the union and the job you are going to have a hard time.
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Let's also remind this young one, or whoever he is, that along with the fact that he very well may not be successful in getting checked out because of his attitude toward the union - no one will want to help save his job should he (heaven forbid) cause damage.

Turning your back on the association before you're even in the door. Don't ask, or expect anything back.

He must really think that management will take to him well if he continues to say he wants to move into management.

Even the ones who do move into management have been checked out SOMEWHERE, for more than 6 months as well.

This guy knows all though.
 
surreal1221 said:
That is refreshing to know. Are any NATCA reps allowed to inform the trainees out in OKC?

Essentially, does the FAA allocate any time for the association to do any sort of introduction / indoctrination of the workforce out in OKC?

I recall reading a clause in the previous contract that said the FAA would provide a period of time allocated for the association to speak to new hires, etc.

Yes... both the NATCA President and VP along with regional VP's go out to OKC to talk to the new hires there. Through the grape vine the info spreads and they do a nice setup with free food and drinks for the OKC people... no business casual attire allowed :p It's held close to the academy so the evening students can leave on their meal break and attend for the food. The FAA was so pissed that when they got wind of the day they started offering free pizza for dinner that night hoping to keep the students away.



Let's also remind this young one, or whoever he is, that along with the fact that he very well may not be successful in getting checked out because of his attitude toward the union - no one will want to help save his job should he (heaven forbid) cause damage.

That is exactly where the lack of experience of his comments surface. He does not understand that management would cut him loose in a second and send him packing back to the street. It's his rep (NATCA) who works the back channels via anything from old management connections that owe favors to other reps to find a place for him to land on his feet. Not a member ? I'm not doing squat... face the review board solo...

Turning your back on the association before you're even in the door. Don't ask, or expect anything back.

He must really think that management will take to him well if he continues to say he wants to move into management.

Even the ones who do move into management have been checked out SOMEWHERE, for more than 6 months as well.

This guy knows all though.
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dcatcdude said:
I can guarentee you that they did not want to end up cutting costs, but they had to to avoid you guys working harder than you already due.
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that makes NO sense. ATC controllers have to work harder because they're understaffed and they need more bodies....and how can you possibly "guarantee" what you're saying? you have some sort of inner scoop no one else has?
 
dcatcdude said:
well clearly i guess im wrong according to you guys. mabye one day you will prove me wrong, but i will standby what I say and that it should be a team effort, not FAA vs NATCA. the seperation that exists today will never do anygood for anyone.

that is all I will say on this subject, but I really hope one day I am right and everyone is a team and everyone makes many many strides foward to the same goal.
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And why shouldn't you stand by what you said with all of the experience you have in the Agency. Typical know-it-all punk who cannot be told anything. Your 0 days experience certainly outweighs my 22+ years experience.
 
WOW, all i can say is send this kid to chicago tracon we are looking for some good managers and he seems to have all the answers with out ever controlling airplane one.
 
I've done extensive reading online and I've talked to numerous current controllers and I'm definetly joining NATCA when I get hired.

The fact that the FAA is doing nothing more than just imposing their will on the controllers really bothers me. Not to mention the fact they are quick to fire someone for making a little mistake that they spent so much time and money to train, but then are pushing controllers through that shouldn't be controllers.

Some of those imposed work rules are nothing more than a show of force. Who cares what controllers dress like? Virtually no one ever sees the controllers.

Mandatory overtime, working controllers like dogs, 8 hours in between shifts. That's crazy. They should work those schedules and see how fast they get burnt out. And they don't have the lives of hundreds of people in their hands.

One thing I have learned is that just about every controller LOVES their jobs. The pay cut is not the biggest problem they have. It's the other things. The way they are treated, the way their bosses aren't even controllers. If you have never been a controller, then you will never know what all this job really entails.

I haven't even started working for the FAA yet, but I'm not afraid of starting to because of the hope that things will improve, NATCA's voice will finally be heard by the FAA, Congress, and the general public one day. Until then, I'll suck it up and pay my dues.
 
<P>
I've done extensive reading online and I've talked to numerous current controllers and I'm definetly joining NATCA when I get hired. <BR><BR>The fact that the FAA is doing nothing more than just imposing their will on the controllers really bothers me. Not to mention the fact they are quick to fire someone for making a little mistake that they spent so much time and money to train, but then are pushing controllers through that shouldn't be controllers. <BR><BR>Some of those imposed work rules are nothing more than a show of force. Who cares what controllers dress like? Virtually no one ever sees the controllers. <BR><BR>Mandatory overtime, working controllers like dogs, 8 hours in between shifts. That's crazy. They should work those schedules and see how fast they get burnt out. And they don't have the lives of hundreds of people in their hands. <BR><BR>One thing I have learned is that just about every controller LOVES their jobs. The pay cut is not the biggest problem they have. It's the other things. The way they are treated, the way their bosses aren't even controllers. If you have never been a controller, then you will never know what all this job really entails. <BR><BR>I haven't even started working for the FAA yet, but I'm not afraid of starting to because of the hope that things will improve, NATCA's voice will finally be heard by the FAA, Congress, and the general public one day. Until then, I'll suck it up and pay my dues.
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Amen Brother!! I agree completely.
 
Best of luck to your JT, and to those who share that view.

They need more just like you, and less of the weak minded robots that they are getting.
 
queeno said:
WOW, all i can say is send this kid to chicago tracon we are looking for some good managers and he seems to have all the answers with out ever controlling airplane one.
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:laff: Off subject- I've heard this is how a typical manager acts.

I come here for the information and stay for the entertainment!
 
I wonder if an OJTI will go out of their way to get you checked out if you're not a union member........hmmmm
 
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