KAL 007

MikeD

Administrator
Staff member
shot down in 1983, there's many that don't really believe the "party line" the government had for the public:

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The simplistic notion that the Russians would cold-bloodedly shoot down an airliner because it was said to have entered its airspace has always been too preposterous for me to believe, regardless of the circumstances.At the time of this incident in 1983, I didn't pay as much attention to it as I normally would have, due to other personal commitments. I followed the story only casually, but nevertheless came to the fairly quick conclusion that in all probability this was just another CIA adventure gone haywire, as others had before it. I suspected a good number of people in this world probably thought the same.Specifically, while I was gradually and only very grudgingly willing to entertain the notion that Russia perhaps did shoot down the airliner, I believed they probably would have only done so after extreme and deliberate provocation. Exactly what may have occurred with the airliner to cause such an extreme provocation I was never able to discern, but realized that most of the truth was obviously being hidden once again, so eventually I put the matter out of my mind.My CIA-provocation conclusion stuck with me for years - until I discovered Michel Brun's book. Upon reading this book, the various pieces of the evidence I had hitherto been aware of finally fell into place and made some sense, and I realized that the apparent truth was far worse than I had previously thought. Here is a synopsis of the author's conclusions, reached after more than ten years of research, most of it done by him in person in Japan:* that KAL 007's flightplan close to Soviet airspace was planned and not accidental* that a number of U.S. military aircraft, which had overflown Soviet airspace at Kamchatka earlier that night, approached Sakhalin island just as KAL 007 was also flying nearby* that when these U.S. military aircraft again entered Soviet airspace over Sakhalin, an air battle ensued, resulting in the loss of about ten U.S. military aircraft, along with about thirty crewmembers* that KAL 007 never entered Soviet airspace at any time, but instead flew in international or Japanese airspace to the east and south of Sakhalin and continued on for about another 45 minutes after having passed to the south of Sakhalin* at which point it was destroyed off the western coast of the main Japanese island of Honshu by means and for reasons still unknownA few years ago I tried reading Seymour Hersh's _The Target Is Destroyed_, but was only able to labor my way through various parts, totaling about a third of the book. The stuff just didn't make any sense. In order to accept any of these earlier so-called conclusions proposed by various authors, one has to believe that the KAL pilots were nothing more than imbeciles, incapable of performing even the most basic and routinenavigational duties - duties in which they previously had repeatedly demonstrated expertise. These kind of superficial and facetious explanations are hardly worth considering._Incident At Sakhalin_ presents the most thorough explanation of what happened to KAL007, and to the best of my knowledge has yet to be challenged in any of it's premises, let alone discounted. It is the only explanation I've come across in which all of the evidence finally appears to fit.
Only a year ago, I watched a History Channel presentation of the "official" story of KAL 007, whose flight-number designation seemed so cruelly appropriate. Shortly thereafter I was recommended "Incident at Sakhalin" by a person who had been heavily involved in US Cold War strategies of the eighties. "Read this," he insisted, "if you want to know how close to the brink of nuclear war we came." He refused to say more, but the book is an eye-opener. On 1-Sept. 1983, Korean Air Lines Flight 007, enroute to Seoul from New York via Anchorage, disappeared over the Sea of Japan. An extraordinary propaganda campaign and coverup ensued immediately following the events surrounding this incident -- on both sides of the Cold War Iron Curtain. In that perilous and paranoid time, the disaster nearly precipitated World War lll. To this day, the four governments involved in the Sakhalin Incident would prefer that the "official" conclusion remain in effect: that is, the passenger jet had innocently strayed off-course and was mistaken for the Cobra Ball spy plane which was detected at the same time in violation of Soviet airspace. That story generated much suspicion, which resulted in numerous Congressional investigations and accusations regarding CIA use of foreign civilian airliners for its surveillance missions over the USSR. Passengers were routinely and unwittingly used as pawns, a chilling revelation in itself. But Brun's book goes way beyond that. The author has impressive credentials; he is a French aviation expert and aircraft accident investigator, fluent in five languages. Moreover, his political neutrality ensures an unbiased presentation of the facts he had spent some ten years gathering. Several mysteries of the Sakhalin incident are widely known. For example, neither the wreck of the plane nor the remains of the 269 passengers has ever been found in the shallow area of the Sea of Japan over which KAL 007 was allegedly shot down. Meticulous research, aided by post-Cold War release of previously classified materials, reveals more of the disturbing story. In fact, Flight 007 was not lost over Sakhalin, but continued to fly and transmit messages for nearly an hour after other intruding aircraft were intercepted there by Soviet MiGs. The evidence shows that a poorly-conceived US intelligence and provocation operation launched a two-hour-long air battle with Soviet fighters over Sakhalin. In this battle, US Air Force and Navy aircraft and personnel were lost, and KAL 007 disappeared some 435 miles from where it was "officially" claimed to have crashed -- by means and reasons after all these years still unexplained. Boris Yeltsin, in his 17-June, 1992 speech to a joint session of the US Congress, mentioned Soviet-held American POWs in conjunction with the KAL 007 incident. This was interpreted by the American press as reference to the Korean and Vietnam eras; and the Reagan Administration offered no enlightenment to the public. We Americans have become accustomed to some misinformation and coverup on the part of the government, some of which is conducted in the name of national security. It appears that the Incident at Sakhalin was the result of a massive blunder with tragic, embarrassing, and nearly devastating ramifications. Get the book! Loaded with technical facts and stats, it is a fascinating read.
As one who's not prone to buy "coverups" and "cospiracy" theories I was skeptical when I bought the book about what would be inside. To my surprise I found Brun didn't wildly speculate but rather offered ideas based on hard factual data. His research was impressive and his style of presentation was very well thought out. The idea that this could have occured is believable for the height of the coldwar. Reagan did some very foolish things to "push the buttons" of the soviets and this scheme is entirely plausible. As a relative of someone who was in a special forces unit in the army. It's quite plausible that many service man did infact die in this operation and their poor families are none the wiser.
 
Sheesh Mike.

You're Area 51 bosses are going to be P.O.'ed if you keep it up.
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Well, since you opened Pandora's box, below is some additional information about what happened to the survivors (yes, survivors) of KAL007. It turns out that the plane was damaged, not destroyed in the attack.

Rescue007.org
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You need to read "By Any Means Necessary" by Burrows. It's an account of cold war aerial reconniassance from WW-II through the shootdown of Gary Powers' U-2. It will give you the background of just how tense the USSR was about overflights.

I would counter a couple of points:

First, the KAL crew could easily have made the mistakes that lead to the overflight. KAL has been known for decades as an unsafe operation with serious cultural problems in the cockpit. Such as inability for SIC to question PIC, lost of face over admitting mistakes, etc. This is why a senior Delta flight operations person went to KAL years ago, to try to right their ship, safety and procedure wise. They were, at the time, considered one of the least safe airlines in the world. KAL 007 was navigating using INS. Many airliners have gone well off course using this method of naviagation.

Second: The soviets had a lot of problems with air intercept. The day they shot Gary Powers down they also managed to shoot down a few of their own airplanes. It was like a keystone cops incident. Until Powers shootdown the US had routinely overflown the USSR for years. Eisenhower admitted that if a single soviet airplane had ever tried the same thing against the US it would have been grounds for war. After the U-2 shootdown we stopped overflying (the satellites were up by then anyway). Yet 007 was not far enough removed from those times that the officers involved would have been too charitable about airspace penetrations. And while we no longer overflew, we did continue to probe the fringes of their ADIZ forcing them to constantly be on alert. We often flew the 707 against them, which on a dark night from behind, could definitely resemble a 747.

I've read a lot about this incident. I think it is what it is. A chain of screw-ups. BTW, like the Koreans the Soviets aren't known for admitting mistakes either.

One of the reasons Burrows wrote his book was to make people aware of the high numbers of Americans taken as POWs during the cold-war. These were denied by the US government since their missions never happened. Of course the airmen knew going in that if they were captured that no one would be coming for them. Took lots of guts.

But anything is possible. I'm definitely into conspiracies. The truth is out there, somewhere.
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And I will get the book. It soulnds like my type of light reading.

Dave
 
So the U2 guys weren't actually doing "atmospheric research" in the early 80's?
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A few years ago I tried reading Seymour Hersh's _The Target Is Destroyed_, but was only able to labor my way through various parts, totaling about a third of the book. The stuff just didn't make any sense. In order to accept any of these earlier so-called conclusions proposed by various authors, one has to believe that the KAL pilots were nothing more than imbeciles, incapable of performing even the most basic and routinenavigational duties - duties in which they previously had repeatedly demonstrated expertise. These kind of superficial and facetious explanations are hardly worth considering

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Sheesh, Mike. A little time on your hands???
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Check Seymour's track record. The guy's just about right on everything he's ever written. Navigational errors by otherwise competant crews happen all the time. In the the 1980's, a Continental 747 missed a mid-air with a Delta Tri-Star by less than fifty feet over the North Atlantic. The Continental crew had misentered coordinates into their INS in almost exactly the same manner that Hersch speculates happened to KAL 007. In the 1970s, a Varig 737 ran out of fuel in Brazil because the crew headed south after takeoff instead of north! Look at how many US jetliners have landed at the wrong airport over the years.

As for KAL007 continuing on for hours, I've heard tapes of the Mayday call they made to Tokyo. They reported explosive decompression and an emergency descent. Very chilling tape to listen to. All contact was lost shortly after that. Why would they continue on for an hour and not report back in after declaring an emergency? Doesn't make any sense.
 
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You really think Im gonna read all that?
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Hmmm...........wait until you get to college.
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MikeD cool post. And I'm even more impressed with the intelligent and well informed replies. Wow there are some smart people on jetcareers after all
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As for KAL007 continuing on for hours, I've heard tapes of the Mayday call they made to Tokyo. They reported explosive decompression and an emergency descent. Very chilling tape to listen to. All contact was lost shortly after that. Why would they continue on for an hour and not report back in after declaring an emergency? Doesn't make any sense.

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Because KAL was on a surveillance mission......or so it's thought. Some claim the Mayday call was a ruse.
 
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