Have you ever...?
- Thread starter adreamer
- Start date
I am wondering if you don't write something up and FAA is riding on your flight. What are the consequences?
C150J
Well-Known Member
121.563
Thus far, we have had several crews get full FAA violations in 2009 for "pocketing" an MEL. Don't let it happen to you. I'm not trying to monger fear, and we all know how to play the game, but we still need to be VERY, VERY careful when doing so. Don't let on-time performance or a commute ruin your career.
Thus far, we have had several crews get full FAA violations in 2009 for "pocketing" an MEL. Don't let it happen to you. I'm not trying to monger fear, and we all know how to play the game, but we still need to be VERY, VERY careful when doing so. Don't let on-time performance or a commute ruin your career.
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
Or a short night at the hotel. Had one the other day that I could have let slide, but I wouldn't have been able to sleep well that night. Temp controller was acting wonky on the way in, and it had JUST been signed off with the standard "ops check good, okay for service" right before we left. They just deferred it again, so all I really had to do was the paper work. 'Course the FAA isn't fond of multiple write ups of the same thing, so I kinda liked that fact.
Copperhed51
Well-Known Member
This is why I think cancellation pay is a very big safety issue and every airline should be required to have cancellation pay/line guarantee. At my company, you write something up, you most likely lost at least half your day's flying, sometimes all of it and you get paid nothing. It creates a huge conflict of interest for pilots that are already strapped for cash.
SpiraMirabilis
Possible Subversive
If its broke write it up. Period. Don't try to help operations by flying with a broken airplane, even if it is something "trivial."
Not saying I agree with this but what most of our captains do is tell the next captain about the discrepancy if it is minor and then ask him/her if he/she wants it to be written up.
The only flexibility I'd have in this issue is perhaps if it is extremely minor (broken plate clip, broken map light, reading light out in PSU, etc) is to wait until you get back to the hub, but if I saw anyone that looked like a fed on board if it was up to me (and it isn't) I'd write it up at the outstation.
Remember, if something is a little wonky -- write it up. They'll ops check it good, but multiple write ups require certain action. They can't just keep ops checking the same write up good.
Not saying I agree with this but what most of our captains do is tell the next captain about the discrepancy if it is minor and then ask him/her if he/she wants it to be written up.
The only flexibility I'd have in this issue is perhaps if it is extremely minor (broken plate clip, broken map light, reading light out in PSU, etc) is to wait until you get back to the hub, but if I saw anyone that looked like a fed on board if it was up to me (and it isn't) I'd write it up at the outstation.
Remember, if something is a little wonky -- write it up. They'll ops check it good, but multiple write ups require certain action. They can't just keep ops checking the same write up good.
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
Contact negotiations plus the screwing we're getting on benefits means I'm writing up broken map lights now. And none of this "Write it up when we get back to the hub." If I notice broken on the first flight of the day in an outstation, it's getting written up then. They'll just defer it, but hey. It might take us just long enough to get the deferral done that we're out late by a minute or 2. No D0 bonus for Phil & Co for that flight.
falconvalley
Absentee Dad of the OOTSK, Runner, Cat Frustrator
Don't pocket write ups. Also, don't write up 10 cockpit lights being burnt out at 8am. Call maintenance.
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
Not now. I'm writing that stuff up, then they HAVE to come out and sign it off. Before, I might have just called them.
SpiraMirabilis
Possible Subversive
I hear you. Taxi at American Airlines speed too.
TUCKnTRUCK
That guy
Or replace them from the kit... so they have to come replace the kit. spare bulbs are required for us, and can not be deferred.
PeanuckleCRJ
Poodle Wrangler
kell-
FYI the feds like to listen in on 9E's mx radios. If you make a call for anything, put it in the book. If the wrench gets pissed about you putting it in the book, make sure he knows you're justifying his job and making sure they keep proper staffing.
If i just needed something "looked at" I would be completely non-specific and just say that we needed a wrench to come look at something. That was about the only way I wouldn't put something in the book. Always assume a fed is listening in at 9E!
We are actually getting toward that at the big D as well. Used to be alot more laid back and only safety related items had to go in the book.
FYI the feds like to listen in on 9E's mx radios. If you make a call for anything, put it in the book. If the wrench gets pissed about you putting it in the book, make sure he knows you're justifying his job and making sure they keep proper staffing.
If i just needed something "looked at" I would be completely non-specific and just say that we needed a wrench to come look at something. That was about the only way I wouldn't put something in the book. Always assume a fed is listening in at 9E!
We are actually getting toward that at the big D as well. Used to be alot more laid back and only safety related items had to go in the book.
United won a MAJOR illegal job action fight against several of it's pilots recently (who are totally gone, no alpa grienvences left) for doing certain things brought up in this thread. One of the things United's lawyers were allowed to do was seize laptops and personal computers. (deleted does not mean deleted on any computer) One item specifically looked at was an increase in MX write ups from other times in the pilots carreer (I know how insanse this sounds but it is true, I forget the wording the ALPA lawyers used). And specific catch phrases that I will not repeat via written word. This was a major victory for airline management.
PeanuckleCRJ
Poodle Wrangler
Matt-
The biggest thing I can emphasize in regards to that is to always write something up when there is an issue.
Do not compromise safety just because youre afraid of what management may do. If something happens, it's your ticket.
The biggest thing I can emphasize in regards to that is to always write something up when there is an issue.
Do not compromise safety just because youre afraid of what management may do. If something happens, it's your ticket.
We have a winner!
I completely agree. Makes no sense to not write up any issue that your ops manual and mel book says needs a write up. sorry if it delays the flight 5 minutes but I won't put my certificate on the line. I think that the point of my post is not to put yourself in a position where a pattern becomes visible
C150J
Well-Known Member
I want to add that certain FSDOs within our route structure have decided that even resolvable items - such as a de-power/re-power or series of circuit breaker resets need to be handled by the INBOUND crew and not "handed off." For those of you who operate the CRJ, I'm sure you're familiar with items that resolve themselves after a reset... just be sure to complete them yourself (with Mx on the line if your Opspecs say so) before telling the next guy to "do the usual."
C150J
Well-Known Member
All most employers want out of these scenarios is to see if the applicant would take all steps necessary to launch the flight before making the arduous decision to cancel. Spare planes, contract Mx, alternatives, etc. They don't want a guy who immediately says, "Screw Santa," OR "We're goin' becud I didn't done see it ya hear?" Both ends of the spectrum exhibit unattractive traits.
Call maintenece. They will direct you to flip the stby switch behind the captain's seat and boom! You have nav lights. The real question is what if it's the last leg of a 4-day and you're tight on your commute, which is the last flight of the day to where you live. Decisions, Decisions!!!!!!!
Write it up!
sopdan
Well-Known Member
Write it up! At least here, most minor things can be deferred over the phone/radio. For major things, you'd better be writing it up regardless of anything else.
As for the nav light question, before I was at an airline, I would've given the standard "write it up because it's the right thing to do blah blah blah" answer. Now, I'd give the "write it up, defer it over the phone, and get the hell out of Dodge!" answer.
As for the nav light question, before I was at an airline, I would've given the standard "write it up because it's the right thing to do blah blah blah" answer. Now, I'd give the "write it up, defer it over the phone, and get the hell out of Dodge!" answer.