Er...ATP Signoff!?

Boris Badenov

Boris Badenov

Fortis Leader
My boss seems to be convinced that there either now or at some point in the past was a requirement to have an FAA inspector review and sign off on your logbooks in order to take either the ATP Written or Practical.

It has always been my impression that for the written you need to show up with an ID and a lot of memorization done, and that or the practical you need a logbook that the examiner can look through, but no special signoff.

So, do you need a John Hancock from the Feds (or anyone, for that matter) take the ATP written or practical?
 
no. if you fail and are taking a re-check, you need a CFI endorsement. first time around, no endorsement needed
 
Hacker15e said:
Do you not need an 8710 signed on the back by a CFI for the ATP checkride?
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Nope. Look at the regs.


61.153

To be eligible for an airline transport pilot certificate, a person must:
(a) Be at least 23 years of age;
(b) Be able to read, speak, write, and understand the English language. If the applicant is unable to meet one of these requirements due to medical reasons, then the Administrator may place such operating limitations on that applicant's pilot certificate as are necessary for the safe operation of the aircraft;
(c) Be of good moral character;
(d) Meet at least one of the following requirements:
(1) Holds a commercial pilot certificate with an instrument rating issued under this part;
(2) Meet the military experience requirements under §61.73 of this part to qualify for a commercial pilot certificate, and an instrument rating if the person is a rated military pilot or former rated military pilot of an Armed Force of the United States; or
(3) Holds either a foreign airline transport pilot license with instrument privileges, or a foreign commercial pilot license with an instrument rating, that—
(i) Was issued by a contracting State to the Convention on International Civil Aviation; and
(ii) Contains no geographical limitations.
(e) Meet the aeronautical experience requirements of this subpart that apply to the aircraft category and class rating sought before applying for the practical test;
(f) Pass a knowledge test on the aeronautical knowledge areas of §61.155(c) of this part that apply to the aircraft category and class rating sought;
(g) Pass the practical test on the areas of operation listed in §61.157(e) of this part that apply to the aircraft category and class rating sought; and
(h) Comply with the sections of this subpart that apply to the aircraft category and class rating sought.
 
I did my ATP through 135, so I'll answer as best as I can.
Iacra has a few different types of eligibility. 135/121 training, part 61 school, Mil etc...

I didn't have the 8710 signed by anyone, and I took it with the Feds, but I did have my company training records signed by the check airmen, so it's equivalent to CFI.
 
No, you don't need a sign off for the written or the checkride. You will, however, need to take your logbook to the checkride so the examiner can look at it and check off that you meet the time requirements.
 
dc3flyer said:
No, you don't need a sign off for the written or the checkride. You will, however, need to take your logbook to the checkride so the examiner can look at it and check off that you meet the time requirements.
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Hate to nit pick here, but you need them for every checkride. How else are they going to determine that you have the required training/time for any ride?
 
You used to have to get a sign off for the written by taking your logbooks to the feds and having them paw through them. At least that was my memory, and not a particularly good one.
 
Even though the feds don't comb through the logbooks anymore, the DE I used went through them to some extent. Not super thoroughly, but enough to make sure I met the ATP requirements and didn't have anything super shady going on.
 
Itchy said:
You used to have to get a sign off for the written by taking your logbooks to the feds and having them paw through them. At least that was my memory, and not a particularly good one.
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Ah. Well, that makes sense. I think the Head Man got his ATP when God was knee high to a grasshopper. Thanks. I didn't think even I could be so spectacularly ill-informed, but I've been known to surprise myself.
 
mshunter said:
Hate to nit pick here, but you need them for every checkride. How else are they going to determine that you have the required training/time for any ride?
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I figured he knew he would need his logbook for the ride, just adding to make sure that no one translates "no endorsement needed" as "no logbook needed to be presented."
 
I just did an ATP checkride. The DE said that I had to have an endorsement, I argued with him for a bit, then finally got an endorsement from another Instructor, however, according to the PTS, no endorsement is required.
 
Fly_Unity said:
I just did an ATP checkride. The DE said that I had to have an endorsement, I argued with him for a bit, then finally got an endorsement from another Instructor, however, according to the PTS, no endorsement is required.
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Yeah, I'd let the FSDO know about that one. The last thing I want is a DE that doesn't know what the heck the PTS AND the FAR's say.
 
SIUav8er said:
There are quite a few misinformed DPE's out there unfortunately.
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And a big part of the problem is even when you call them out, and show them they are wrong, they still refuse to accept it and usually hand you a pink slip to assert their authority.
 
mshunter said:
And a big part of the problem is even when you call them out, and show them they are wrong, they still refuse to accept it and usually hand you a pink slip to assert their authority.
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Arguing with dpe's a perk of not having to take anymore silly part 61 checkrides!
 
there's no requirement for a signoff, but the DPE that did my ATP did ask me to put a statement in the front of the logbook stating that the times were correct and true.....

I think there was probably a requirement for a sign off/audit of logbook times back in the 30's, and some of the DPE's out there haven't received the memo yet.
 
I signed off an applicant for an ATP but it was because of the removal of his centerline thrust restriction he had flying F18s and the examiner added the Vmc demo to the checkride, other than that no signoff required.
 
mshunter said:
Hate to nit pick here, but you need them for every checkride. How else are they going to determine that you have the required training/time for any ride?
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The only 121 checkride where I needed my log was my 727 type ride and that was so the examiner could sign it.
 
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