EMS helo down west of Ft Rucker/Enterprise, AL

deadstick

Well-Known Member
It was a Metro AStar. No survivors.

http://m.dothaneagle.com/news/local...88e-f351-11e5-827f-1b21cba47c1b.html?mode=jqm

http://www.wtvy.com/content/news/373621031.html

Severe thunderstorms Saturday morning are also plaguing efforts to recover the remains.

Reported missing at 12:17 am.

KEDN 260735Z AUTO 09004KT 3/4SM BR OVC003 17/17 A2994 RMK AO2
KEDN 260715Z AUTO 00000KT 3/4SM BR OVC003 17/17 A2994 RMK AO2
KEDN 260655Z AUTO 12004KT 1SM BR OVC003 17/17 A2996 RMK AO2
KEDN 260635Z AUTO 12004KT 2 1/2SM BR OVC003 17/17 A2996 RMK AO2
KEDN 260615Z AUTO 00000KT 5SM BR OVC003 17/17 A2996 RMK AO2
KEDN 260555Z AUTO 00000KT 4SM -DZ OVC003 17/17 A2996 RMK AO2 P0001
KEDN 260535Z AUTO 12004KT 3SM DZ OVC003 17/17 A2997 RMK AO2 P0001
KEDN 260515Z AUTO 12004KT 3SM DZ OVC003 17/17 A2997 RMK AO2
KEDN 260455Z AUTO 13004KT 5SM BR BKN003 BKN007 OVC014 17/17 A2997 RMK AO2
KEDN 260435Z AUTO 11006KT 7SM SCT003 SCT007 OVC016 17/17 A2997 RMK AO2
KEDN 260415Z AUTO 13003KT 7SM SCT003 OVC018 17/17 A2997 RMK AO2 LTG DSNT N
KEDN 260355Z AUTO 00000KT 10SM SCT003 OVC020 17/17 A2995 RMK AO2
KEDN 260335Z AUTO 00000KT 10SM OVC020 17/17 A2996 RMK AO2
KEDN 260315Z AUTO 00000KT 10SM OVC022 17/17 A2996 RMK AO2
KEDN 260255Z AUTO 00000KT 7SM -DZ OVC024 17/17 A2995 RMK AO2
 
The Dothan Eagle is reporting it went missing at 12:17am and was found at 7:02am. The crash was a 1/2 mile from scene (don't know if the LZ was at the scene or elsewhere).
 
The pilot learned to fly and instructed at the same airport I did, although I didn't really know him but just the usual "Hey man." as we saw each other around the FBO. My rotorcraft friends all know him and are very curious about the details leading up to the accident.

Middle of the night HEMS in poor weather is quite the challenge and often unforgiving.


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Somebody on another site posted that the aircraft had an A/P. If it's the one reported, that was a '98 B2.
 
Somebody on another site posted that the aircraft had an A/P. If it's the one reported, that was a '98 B2.

I could see that being of help. But even with an A/P, the B2 manual still shows for the pilot:
Operating the helicopter is approved, out of icing conditions, for:
- Day VFR flight
- Night VFR flight, when the required equipment items are installed and serviceable, provided such operation is permitted by the flight regulation of the country concerned

While the terrain there certainly isn't mountainous or hilly, there are so many obstructions all over the place, as many of us are familiar with Mother Rucker.
 
I could see that being of help. But even with an A/P, the B2 manual still shows for the pilot:
Operating the helicopter is approved, out of icing conditions, for:
- Day VFR flight
- Night VFR flight, when the required equipment items are installed and serviceable, provided such operation is permitted by the flight regulation of the country concerned

While the terrain there certainly isn't mountainous or hilly, there are so many obstructions all over the place, as many of us are familiar with Mother Rucker.

In all likelihood there is a good chance that the pilot both started and in the most unfortunate way ended his Helicopter flying career in the same place.
 
Oh I know it's not approved for IFR, but when (if) used for IIMC recovery, it could help. I heard AEL is putting it in their 206Ls. Regardless of the equipment, I'm just wondering what time they left Troy because the TAF was ugly.

I remember the master hazard map at LAHP. There are little towers everywhere around there.
 
Oh I know it's not approved for IFR, but when (if) used for IIMC recovery, it could help. I heard AEL is putting it in their 206Ls. Regardless of the equipment, I'm just wondering what time they left Troy because the TAF was ugly..

Of course, most definitely it would help, I agree. And I was saying that too above.

My concern......and I can't prove or disprove it, it's merely a general concern.........is whether the presence of something like an A/P may in some way "embolden" a pilot to accept a higher WX risk than he may normally otherwise. Not saying that applies or doesn't apply to this accident, it's just a sidebar thought.

I remember the master hazard map at LAHP. There are little towers everywhere around there

Heck, remember that huge....I'm talking 2000AGL high....radio tower up northwest of there between Troy and Montgomery?
 
Balls.

Whatever the particular case, and in case anyone forgot, that's a cool job. And enormous respect goes with it, at least from me.

About as close as you can get to this, in the real world we have to suffer through.

royal-tenenbaum-gravestone.jpg
 
Of course, most definitely it would help, I agree. And I was saying that too above.

My concern......and I can't prove or disprove it, it's merely a general concern.........is whether the presence of something like an A/P may in some way "embolden" a pilot to accept a higher WX risk than he may normally otherwise. Not saying that applies or doesn't apply to this accident, it's just a sidebar thought.



Heck, remember that huge....I'm talking 2000AGL high....radio tower up northwest of there between Troy and Montgomery?
Yes that one is just south of MGM,if you look at the ILS the MSA is based on it. There is another massive one almost 10miles due north of EDN. And as mentioned several everywhere else.

My IP and I (really him) found an unmarked tower somewhere south of Troy while playing around in BWS.

Weather is certainly a factor and I can only speculate that spatial D is a major factor.
 
Yes that one is just south of MGM,if you look at the ILS the MSA is based on it. There is another massive one almost 10miles due north of EDN. And as mentioned several everywhere else.

My IP and I (really him) found an unmarked tower somewhere south of Troy while playing around in BWS.

Weather is certainly a factor and I can only speculate that spatial D is a major factor.

All kinds of unmarked surveillance and commo towers around here in my AO, many belonging to my own agency. Go figure.
 
My concern......and I can't prove or disprove it, it's merely a general concern.........is whether the presence of something like an A/P may in some way "embolden" a pilot to accept a higher WX risk than he may normally otherwise. Not saying that applies or doesn't apply to this accident, it's just a sidebar thought.

I see what you're saying and really hope that won't be the case. However, I've been making an argument like that for years about the chute on the Cirrus. That company pedaled the technology over pilot skill and good ol' ADM. It has some legit saves, but there are also those who launch when they have no business flying.

One thing wondering about is that I read there are two OCC following this base. Who the heck was tracking this flight? "Gee the two closest fields just went low IFR...what to do what to do...?" The most recent (hate that I have to qualify that) EagleMed crash had weather changing quickly after they launched. These OCCs need to do more.


Heck, remember that huge....I'm talking 2000AGL high....radio tower up northwest of there between Troy and Montgomery?

image.jpeg
 
One thing wondering about is that I read there are two OCC following this base. Who the heck was tracking this flight? "Gee the two closest fields just went low IFR...what to do what to do...?" The most recent (hate that I have to qualify that) EagleMed crash had weather changing quickly after they launched. These OCCs need to do more.




View attachment 34720
The dispatchers when I flew medevac would call and ask us to go to fields that had no approaches that were up a fjord in the middle of the night with just VFR or MVFR ceilings. And how do you suppose I get there? In medevac it's almost 100% on the pilot to keep the operation safe IMO.
 
The dispatchers when I flew medevac would call and ask us to go to fields that had no approaches that were up a fjord in the middle of the night with just VFR or MVFR ceilings. And how do you suppose I get there? In medevac it's almost 100% on the pilot to keep the operation safe IMO.


It's always on the PIC, but in an operation like EMS (r/w more than f/w) where they're going to scenes, etc., that OCC can see big picture WX trends a lot easier than a pilot who is sitting in BFE waiting for the FD to extract somebody from a balled-up car.
 
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