Deployment/Seniority

Toonces

Well-Known Member
Let's say someone were offered a job at an airline and then they were given activation orders from the military. Would that individual retain their seniority/longevity if they deployed before they started training? I would think you would, but I could see an airline put you on day 1 F.O pay up your return from deployment.
 

MQAAord

Scheherazade
Staff member
Generally speaking, a pilot retains his/her position on the senority list when on military LOA. Of course individual company's contracts may vary, but I'm pretty sure most airlines leave the pilot in his original "spot" on the list.
 

Toonces

Well-Known Member
At my airline, your longevity date and date of hire are not the same. They go by the day you start training. I wonder if the military prevented you from beginning training if they would still honor the day you were supposed to begin as your longevity date.
 

BobDDuck

Island Bus Driver
Most places your "date of hire" isn't actually the day they sent you the acceptance letter but rather the day you start training or complete your PC. My guess is if you deploy before you start training you won't ever have a date of hire at the company and certainly not a spot on the seniority list. At least that's how it works here.
 

Firebird2XC

Well-Known Member
At my airline, your longevity date and date of hire are not the same. They go by the day you start training. I wonder if the military prevented you from beginning training if they would still honor the day you were supposed to begin as your longevity date.

There might be a slight confusion of terms here.

Most places, "Date of Hire" refers to the first day you report to work, ie, report to training. Therefore it's the same as your longevity date.

The day you got the phone call, letter, etc.. doesn't really factor in.

As far as retaining position, pay, and seniority, etc... I believe there are laws protecting servicemembers if they are activated or deployed.

If you're thinking about getting in, ask your recruiter. Odds are they have the scoop on the resources so you can check this out yourself. If you're already in, contact your JAG office. They'll know.
 

v1valarob

Well-Known Member
My buddy who was in an AWAC class before this summer had a guy in there who was deployed during, or just after his initial training and had been gone for 2 - 3 years. I want to say that the guy hadnt even flown the plane yet, but was almost at the top of the FO seniority list when he returned for this class.
 

Toonces

Well-Known Member
I'll give you a scenario.

You get hired by an airline and they give you a start date to show up for ground school. You get deployed prior to starting ground school at said airline. When you come back from your deployment let's say 1 1/2 years later are you A:a day one F.O or B: on second year pay eligible to upgrade at the same time other people hired the same time you were. (assuming those people were going to be in your new hire class.)
 

BajtheJino

I'm looking at you.
If you never start training why would you be entitled to come back? You're not really an employee then are you? My guess would be that you start over with an interview.
 

surreal1221

Well-Known Member
Have you been awarded a seniority #?

Have you even been issued an employee #?

Until you get either one of those two things, I wouldn't even start questioning at what scale you would return to the company as technically, if you're never issued an employee number (much less a seniority #) you're going to be SOL if you come back and think you have a job. Just the way it is.

Perhaps you could convince the company to place you into an earlier class on the grounds that you will be deploying and would love the opportunity to come back to them when you return but only on the grounds that you are actually provided an employee number and seniority #.
 

Kristie

Mama Bear....
Staff member
Perhaps you could convince the company to place you into an earlier class on the grounds that you will be deploying and would love the opportunity to come back to them when you return but only on the grounds that you are actually provided an employee number and seniority #.
This would be my suggestion too!
 

SoCalAprch

Well-Known Member
If you never start work you aren't an employee. Until he/she starts getting time on the book or paid no matter what career you have you haven't become an employee. You can hire anyone you want but if they never show up for their first day then they aren't considered an employee and therefore do not fall under the military deal.
 

SoCalAprch

Well-Known Member
Perhaps you could convince the company to place you into an earlier class on the grounds that you will be deploying and would love the opportunity to come back to them when you return but only on the grounds that you are actually provided an employee number and seniority #.
HAHAHAHA right come on Surreal I thought you were smarter than that :)

Pay for your training knowing that you are going to leave and when you come back in a couple years be on a higher pay scale all while giving the company/management nothing in return? last time I checked that isn't how management thinks...
 

SpiraMirabilis

Possible Subversive
Wouldn't be on a higher payscale -- you do not gain longevity on military leave at any airline (that I know of.) In fact, even if you were able to hold CA now as far as the company is concerned you would be less expensive than someone of slightly less seniority but more longevity -- IE upgrade for a 2 year captain or a 1 year captain.
 

SoCalAprch

Well-Known Member
Wouldn't be on a higher payscale -- you do not gain longevity on military leave at any airline (that I know of.) In fact, even if you were able to hold CA now as far as the company is concerned you would be less expensive than someone of slightly less seniority but more longevity -- IE upgrade for a 2 year captain or a 1 year captain.
Thats not the case here. This directly from our contract...

D. Military Leave
1. General
A pilot will be granted military leave for military service or reserve
duty in accordance with applicable federal law. Military leave must
be requested by submitting a Request for Leave of Absence form to
the Director of Human Resources as soon as practicable after the
pilot becomes aware of the military duty for which the leave is
requested.
2. Eligibility
Return from military leave of absence shall be in accordance with
applicable law.
3. Seniority and Longevity
A pilot's seniority and longevity will continue to accrue during
military leave.
 

MQAAord

Scheherazade
Staff member
I'd have to check but I think DL guys keep & accrue all senority while on military leave.
 

Minnesota_Flyer

New Member
Federal law (USERRA) generally requires that employees who take a leave for military service be returned to work following the leave into the position which they would have obtained if they hadn't been gone. In other words, employees are legally entitled to accrue seniority/longevity for the period of the military leave.

Now, if you haven't started working yet, but just have a date to start, I don't think you would be considered an "employee" under USERRA and therefore would not be entitled to return to work and accrued seniority. But I'm not quite sure about that.
 
Top