Delta wants to be the launch customer for the 797!
- Thread starter Maximilian_Jenius
- Start date
Maximilian_Jenius
Super User
No engineer here either, but the airfoil is a pretty big determiner in terms of range. When the 737 NG was transformed from the Classic, the wing was redesigned to its current iteration. For amongst other things, to eek out more range and performance than the wing on the Classic.
AAPalmTree
Well-Known Member
FlyingAccountant
Well-Known Member
First customer is Hawaiian.
It wouldn't surprise me too much if Delta bought them, I just thought that we were referring to 'launch customer' being the first airline to fly them. I just figured the launch customer would likely be United if it was a domestic one as Delta's been favoring Airbus quite a bit over Boeing and American's been doing the same, but I guess we'll see who puts in the biggest order. I always do wonder what Southwest will ultimately do and how much longer they'll stay committed to flying just the 737 and if a plane like this could tempt them at all.
Ecl!pse
Well-Known Member
Aeronautical engineer by training, aircraft financier/fleet planner by trade here.
The size of a wing is driven by many factors, the most dominant of which is the aircraft's maximum takeoff weight. Maximum takeoff weight is primarily driven by two factors: payload and range. The more payload you want to carry, the higher the MTOW and thus larger the wing will be. If you want to carry that payload over farther distances, you will need higher MTOW to carry more fuel and thus, will need a larger wing. There's a host of other nuances/factors that go into wing sizing, particularly takeoff performance, but MTOW is generally the biggest driver.
This MOM/797/NMA/whathaveyou won't be too far in passenger capacity from a 787-8, but it will be designed/optimized for a much lower range capability. As such, it should have a much smaller wing than the 787-8. The only reason it could creep up toward 787 levels would be for superior takeoff field performance, but remember - this comes at a penalty in cruise fuel burn, which is the 757's fatal flaw. The 757 has great field performance, but 737-900ER's and A321's eat it's lunch in fuel burn.
To answer both of your questions more directly, the wing of the A321neo or A321LR can probably withstand 3-5T more in MTOW before it is fully loaded/tapped out. This would translate into slightly more range capability if they keep adding auxiliary fuel tanks. Above that, it's takeoff field performance and cruise fuel performance will be unacceptable, so it will need either a new wing, new engines, or both.
There are several good blogs out that there explain aircraft performance very well for non-engineers, it's worth reading them if it interests you at all. Feel free to PM me if you're interested, I will send you the link.
ackeight
Well-Known Member
Little more flamboyant of a color too? I always wondered who would cut a hole in a composite first.
Maximilian_Jenius
Super User
Inverted
mmmmmm wine
I don't have a lot of 321 NEO time but our LEAP NEOs seem to do ok in a climb...
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
Same with the PW... when they aren't broken.
Can normally carry just under MTOW up to the mid 30s in 20 minutes or so. We also have derated engines so I'd guess at full power they are a bit better.
The big issue is that at heavy weights you run out of wing in the low 30s.
Maximilian_Jenius
Super User
Why do you have derated engines?
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
Cheaper MX costs. Less fuel burn.
they're paid for, so why not.... ;-). thats the excuse NWA kept the old dc9s around..
bike21
9-5 Ruins Lives
Methinks status quo overall with some advancements akin to the more recent 'easy button' for emergency descents. Way too much R&D/time to invest in that short of a time span to get a potential great selling plane to market.
