Definition of Solo
- Thread starter ZUM
- Start date
mtsu_av8er
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Would a cross country count as a "solo cross country" when carrying a non-pilot passenger?
[/ QUOTE ]
Nope!
Would a cross country count as a "solo cross country" when carrying a non-pilot passenger?
[/ QUOTE ]
Nope!
GregCollins2
Well-Known Member
One DPE told me you can't even have your dog in the airplane!
Sole occupant=solo.
Sole occupant=solo.
Is having a passenger supposed to make the flight easier? Every passenger I've ever flown with has added to the workload and distractions with all the questions and such. Especially my wife -- she has a tendency to get nervous about landings and is VERY vocal on final, praying out loud.
C150J
Well-Known Member
Sometimes I will have passengers that aren't talkative at all until some near-critical moment in flight (entering clouds, getting cleared for an approach, etc.). I always let people know that if I "shh" them it's nothing personal, but I always think it's funny that someone won't talk during straight and level, yet will ask some deep, introspective question when my workload is high!
J.
J.
You are never allowed to carry a passenger while exercising the privileges of student pilot.
§ 61.87 Solo requirements for student pilots.
(a) General. A student pilot may not operate an aircraft in solo flight unless that student has met the requirements of this section. The term “solo flight” as used in this subpart means that flight time during which a student pilot is the sole occupant of the aircraft.
you see, the term solo ONLY refers to student pilots.
Once you hold a PPL or higher you don't log solo anymore. Only to satisfy the requirements of the PPL.
§ 61.87 Solo requirements for student pilots.
(a) General. A student pilot may not operate an aircraft in solo flight unless that student has met the requirements of this section. The term “solo flight” as used in this subpart means that flight time during which a student pilot is the sole occupant of the aircraft.
you see, the term solo ONLY refers to student pilots.
Once you hold a PPL or higher you don't log solo anymore. Only to satisfy the requirements of the PPL.
SUSPilot
Well-Known Member
Mot so fast MAS read about pilot logbooks:
14CFR61.51(C)(2)(d) Logging of solo flight time. Except for a student pilot performing the duties of pilot in command of an airship requiring more than one pilot flight crewmember, a pilot may log as solo flight time only that flight time when the pilot is the sole occupant of the aircraft.
and the requirements for the Commercial Rating Aeronautical Experience:
14CFR61.129(A)(4) 10 hours of solo flight in a single-engine airplane on the areas of operation listed in Sec. 61.127(b)(1) of this part, which includes at least--
(i) One cross-country flight of not less than 300 nautical miles total distance, with landings at a minimum of three points, one of which is a straight-line distance of at least 250 nautical miles from the original departure point. However, if this requirement is being met in Hawaii, the longest segment need only have a straight-line distance of at least 150 nautical miles; and
(ii) 5 hours in night VFR conditions with 10 takeoffs and 10 landings (with each landing involving a flight in the traffic pattern) at an airport with an operating control tower.
Although when you get your private pilot certificate, you can you can carry passengers, there still are times you can log solo time and times when you MUST log solo time
14CFR61.51(C)(2)(d) Logging of solo flight time. Except for a student pilot performing the duties of pilot in command of an airship requiring more than one pilot flight crewmember, a pilot may log as solo flight time only that flight time when the pilot is the sole occupant of the aircraft.
and the requirements for the Commercial Rating Aeronautical Experience:
14CFR61.129(A)(4) 10 hours of solo flight in a single-engine airplane on the areas of operation listed in Sec. 61.127(b)(1) of this part, which includes at least--
(i) One cross-country flight of not less than 300 nautical miles total distance, with landings at a minimum of three points, one of which is a straight-line distance of at least 250 nautical miles from the original departure point. However, if this requirement is being met in Hawaii, the longest segment need only have a straight-line distance of at least 150 nautical miles; and
(ii) 5 hours in night VFR conditions with 10 takeoffs and 10 landings (with each landing involving a flight in the traffic pattern) at an airport with an operating control tower.
Although when you get your private pilot certificate, you can you can carry passengers, there still are times you can log solo time and times when you MUST log solo time
GregCollins2
Well-Known Member
The rationale I have heard is that as the sole occupant, you truly have to rely on your skills to complete a flight. Non-pilot passengers can help out by holding controls, opening maps, getting things out of the flight bag in the back seat, even the simple psychological support of having a companion.
I think the DPE's opinion is based on how strictly he defines occupant (to include dogs?), and I'm sure that could be argued succesfully with the FAA.
Just to further complicate things,when I was at AriBen Aviators, the commercial solo requirements were completed with an instructor on board due to multiengine insurance restrictions. The examiners were aware of this and had no problem with it. I believe ATP does it the same way.
I think the DPE's opinion is based on how strictly he defines occupant (to include dogs?), and I'm sure that could be argued succesfully with the FAA.
Just to further complicate things,when I was at AriBen Aviators, the commercial solo requirements were completed with an instructor on board due to multiengine insurance restrictions. The examiners were aware of this and had no problem with it. I believe ATP does it the same way.
MidlifeFlyer
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
But what is the rationale?
[/ QUOTE ]ICAO has some minimum standards for commercial pilots. Before 1997, the FAA private pilot certificate met the requirement with a 300 NM solo cross country. When the FAA did that big Part 61 revision 1997, it reduced the student solo burden and added it for commercial pilots who made the decision to meet the higher standards.
Here's what the FAA said about it when publishing the changes:
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In addition, the FAA has added language to the existing solo cross-country requirements to ensure pilots meet minimum standards specified under Annex 1 to the Convention on International Civil Aviation. The additional language requires that an applicant for a commercial pilot certificate complete a solo cross-country flight of a total of not less than 300 nautical miles. The existing rule states that a cross-country flight must have landings at a minimum of three points, one of which is at least a straight line distance of 250 nautical miles from the original point of departure. All commercial pilot applicants with a private pilot certificate currently meet the total 300-nautical-mile requirement; however, private pilots certificated after the effective date of this rule will not, due to the decrease in the solo cross-country flight requirements for private pilots set forth in this rule. The FAA wants to ensure that the requirements under Annex 1 to the Convention on International Civil Aviation are specifically met, to facilitate the acceptance of U.S. pilot certificates internationally.
==============================
But what is the rationale?
[/ QUOTE ]ICAO has some minimum standards for commercial pilots. Before 1997, the FAA private pilot certificate met the requirement with a 300 NM solo cross country. When the FAA did that big Part 61 revision 1997, it reduced the student solo burden and added it for commercial pilots who made the decision to meet the higher standards.
Here's what the FAA said about it when publishing the changes:
==============================
In addition, the FAA has added language to the existing solo cross-country requirements to ensure pilots meet minimum standards specified under Annex 1 to the Convention on International Civil Aviation. The additional language requires that an applicant for a commercial pilot certificate complete a solo cross-country flight of a total of not less than 300 nautical miles. The existing rule states that a cross-country flight must have landings at a minimum of three points, one of which is at least a straight line distance of 250 nautical miles from the original point of departure. All commercial pilot applicants with a private pilot certificate currently meet the total 300-nautical-mile requirement; however, private pilots certificated after the effective date of this rule will not, due to the decrease in the solo cross-country flight requirements for private pilots set forth in this rule. The FAA wants to ensure that the requirements under Annex 1 to the Convention on International Civil Aviation are specifically met, to facilitate the acceptance of U.S. pilot certificates internationally.
==============================
MidlifeFlyer
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
There's a small catch in some cases. Since I'm doing my comm intial in a multi, my solos are "supervised" solos. Insurance doesn't feel comfortable handing a Seneca over to me without having my MEI in the plane I guess.
[/ QUOTE ]Yeah. Turns out the FAA isn't =completely= blind to reality and came up with the special "10 hours of flight time performing the duties of pilot in command in a multiengine airplane with an authorized instructor" instead of requiring solo time.
There's a small catch in some cases. Since I'm doing my comm intial in a multi, my solos are "supervised" solos. Insurance doesn't feel comfortable handing a Seneca over to me without having my MEI in the plane I guess.
[/ QUOTE ]Yeah. Turns out the FAA isn't =completely= blind to reality and came up with the special "10 hours of flight time performing the duties of pilot in command in a multiengine airplane with an authorized instructor" instead of requiring solo time.