CRM Question

BobDDuck

BobDDuck

Island Bus Driver
A while back in the "you're the captain" section John Tenney posted a procedure for dealing with captain/FO disagrements. It was a 5 or 6 step outline starting with something like "I don't feel comfortable with this" ending with "I don't feel safe with this". I can't find it for the life of me. Anybody know what I am talking about?

Ethan
 
I know United has something called "CUS Words" which was brought up in CRM classes at both airlines I've worked for. It basically is a hierarchy of statements to show your uneasiness with a situation. United thought that if everyone knew these words, then the person being challenged should easily recognized that when they were used something was amiss.

C: Concerned. "I'm concerned what the ramifications would be from doing this."
U: Uncomfortable. "I'm getting uncomfortable with this. Let's decide a different course of action."
S: Safety of Flight. "This is becoming a safety issue. We need to stop this now."

I've adopted this myself.
 
I start with saying, in an unsure tone, "I'm not sure that's right". About the strongest I've ever had to get was in a very sure tone "That's not right". A lot is in they way you say it and not so much what you say....
 
Thanks for the response guys. That's pretty much what I was looking for. It mostly IS how you say it. But what you are saying matters a whole bunch.

Ethan
 
Very similar to what FlyChicaga said is what I am learning in a course in CRM. Referring to the state of the cockpit, the levels go from 0 to 3:

+3 Confusion, so take IMMEDIATE action to recover.

+2 Discomfort, maybe the crewmembers do not have the same idea of what is happening.

+1 Concern -- protect this status and don't let it progress higher up on the scale.

0 The optimum state. Attentive, comfortable, and alert.

-1 Boredom -- protect this status so it doesn't slip down a step.

-2 Inattention -- recover because the job is not getting done. Maybe some missing communications. Possibly add some stress or look at a potential problem.

-3 Inattention in a critical phase of flight -- IMMEDIATE recovery is required. Just like the inattention in "-2" above but in a critical phase of flight.
 
Let me do you a big favor in reference to CRM.

Do what you have to do to pass the test, but after the course, shred that handout with all of the phases of CRM!
smile.gif


It's basically like a game of tee-ball. The non-flying pilot sets the ball on the tee and the flying pilot takes a swing at the ball and runs the bases.

The non flying pilot sets up the aircraft so basically all the flying pilot has to do is concentrate on aircraft control and the non-flying pilot monitors and provides information.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Let me do you a big favor in reference to CRM.

Do what you have to do to pass the test, but after the course, shred that handout with all of the phases of CRM!
smile.gif


It's basically like a game of tee-ball. The non-flying pilot sets the ball on the tee and the flying pilot takes a swing at the ball and runs the bases.

The non flying pilot sets up the aircraft so basically all the flying pilot has to do is concentrate on aircraft control and the non-flying pilot monitors and provides information.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well said....

My one big thing with CRM is communication. I absoulutely hate when people are worried to speak up in the cockpit because they are new, etc.

Case in point, about 3 weeks ago we were getting ready to taxi out and there were some pretty wicked lines of storms in the area. We had taken extra contingency fuel and I had included my FO in the preflight breifing I got from FSS. We get out to the airplane and as we get ready to start, I ask my first officer (very new to the company) if he is okay with us launching. He nods yes, so we get out to the runway and it's my leg, in my brief I asked if he had any questions and he says "I wish I got one more shot to look at the radar" WTF??? Now I'm stuck in a bad spot of feeling like I'm forcing him into a situation now because he neglected to speak up when he had a concern about the flight. We ended up agreeing on taking a minute in postion and taking a look at our aircraft radar as well as asking ATC if they had a good idea on a routing. It ended up working out just fine, but it was something to be said for speaking up.
 
I always add "Well Captain, if something makes you nervous, it makes me nervous too so do what you've got to do".

Kind of my way of saying "Hey, my 'ego' line and my 'job performance' line don't intersect so don't be shy about speaking up."
 
Maybe I was using the wrong words. It was more about conflict resolution. The way I understand CRM is the basic division of tasks in such a way that everything gets done well. (ie, one person puts the ball on the tee and the other guy hits it). CRM in this sense I think is more of a set of procedures then a philosophy of communication. What I was asking about was a way of dealing with resolving a conflict that arises when CRM breaks down. Take for example the interview favorite, "your captain goes below MDA before sighting the airport, what do you do". From what I understand they don't want you to grab control of the plane, so you need to (thanks Matt) express Concern, followed by Uncertainty followed by raising a Safety of Flight issue. I'm I thinking about this the right way?

Ethan
 
Yeah, you are on the right track. But, remember that you need to assess the situation and decide whether the first one, or even two stages are applicable. In your example (descending below MDA), that situation would probably warrant "safety of flight" since there is limited time, and a high amount of risk.
 
Maybe, I dunno!

I think the thread is an example of where academia meets the real world -- trying to describe the weird synergies of what happens in the cockpit in textbook-friendly verbage.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Let me do you a big favor in reference to CRM.

Do what you have to do to pass the test, but after the course, shred that handout with all of the phases of CRM!
smile.gif


[/ QUOTE ]

The sad thing is that the first CRM class I had was very straight forward and helpful. Basic concepts. Good stuff to know. Worked in practice.

Then every year they paid a new psychologist to come up with a new psycho-babble angle. "Let's see last year we went clock-wise around the triangle, so this year we'll go counter-clockwise." Now it is just one very confused mess.

It's as if you had to change the way you fly an ILS every year. CRM is just as basic. Teach it once, review it occasionally, and otherwise LEAVE IT THE HELL ALONE!!!!!!!!
bandit.gif
 
[ QUOTE ]
I think the thread is an example of where academia meets the real world -- trying to describe the weird synergies of what happens in the cockpit in textbook-friendly verbage.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's like trying to tell someone how to land an airplane. You can describe how to do it, give some techniques on ways to do it smoothly, and go in depth into the physics of it... but you can't teach the finess needed to really grease one in, on speed, in the touchdown zone. That takes practice and experience to get "the feel" of it.

The same applies to CRM. You can study the textbooks night and day to learn proven CRM techniques, and some building blocks to develop effective communication skills... but you won't learn to truly become effective as a crewmember in the cockpit using these principles until you are faced with situations where you need to apply them.

Over time, you won't need the building blocks anymore. Just like shedding your training wheels. You can just get in there and do it, without conscious thought.
 
Thanks for the analogy!

I think the thread is an example of where academia meets the real world -- trying to describe the weird synergies of what happens in the cockpit in textbook-friendly verbage.

Spot on. Like the example I used, I can picture some people clipping that list to the yoke...seems a bit too literal. Just so that the crew recognizes that the cockpit can get to a bad state is what I take from it. It's easy to get so caught up in it that it becomes unable to be understood.

I flew into BOS last night, the first time I'd flown into something larger than Class C. The advantages of a two pilot operation really become apparent when the workload goes up at a place like that. I am looking forward to visiting a few more Class B hub-size airports.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top