Commercial pilot and Intro flights

C

cypilot77

Well-Known Member
Hello,
I was wondering if a commercial pilot working for a flight school (without a flight instructor certificate) can do discovery-introductory/sightseeing flights less than 25 miles from his/her home airport. I cant find anything in the FARs about that. Any ideas where i can find out more info about this? Thank you.
 
In a glider or balloon, you can go more than 25 miles...

Insurance company may well be more stringent than the FAA, I would be more worried about that.
 
You as a commercial pilot can conduct the flight but not just under the umbrella of a flight school (either 141 or 61). It's a passenger carrying operation and therefore the commercial operator must be authorized by the administrator.. see the reference to 119.1 mentioned above and 91.147. In other words, not just any commercial pilot can take someone for a scenic ride in the local Skyhawk (well not legally).
 
if the passenger isn't paying and the pilot isn't being paid, any pilot can do a scenic/sightseeing/introductory flight.

however, unless the pilot is a CFI, the intro flight cannot be called- or be logged as- dual instruction
 
Mike H said:
if the passenger isn't paying and the pilot isn't being paid, any pilot can do a scenic/sightseeing/introductory flight.

however, unless the pilot is a CFI, the intro flight cannot be called- or be logged as- dual instruction
Click to expand...

I think unless the pilot is paying for at least part of the flight, the FAA considers that compensation.
 
Lets say George goes to ABC flight school and buys one of those discovery flights. He is not interested about getting a licence but wants to enjoy the sunset, take some pictures and maybe learn something about flying from the pilot. In this case a logbook signature is not an issue. Based on this scenario, lets say Nick who happened to have a commercial license and he is a good friend of the owner of the school, can he legally fly George for this flight?
 
cypilot77 said:
Based on this scenario, lets say Nick who happened to have a commercial license and he is a good friend of the owner of the school, can he legally fly George for this flight?
Click to expand...

Short answer: no.

Long answer: maybe, but only if the school also has a Letter of Authorization per 91.147 to conduct scenic tours

A "discovery" flight has no definition with the FAA... it's either a flying lesson or it's a passenger flight. Since the scenario is that any random person off the street comes in and purchases the "discovery" flight, that makes the ride common carriage...therefore, there are only two options:
1. The "discovery" flight is a flying lesson, and the pilot needs to be a CFI to log it
2. It's a scenic ride and that requires a Commercial pilot AND the school/operator must also have an LoA per 91.147

Lots of people just use option 1 regardless of the customer's intention...but imagine the scenario where an accident occurs and the FAA questions the customer and they state they bought a scenic ride and had no intentions of taking a flying lesson.... there's a very significant difference as far as the FAA is concerned and both the pilot and operator could be in hot water.

If the flight school is active, already has a good maintenance plan, and has a drug testing policy, then it's probably going to be a pretty simple process to get a Letter of Authorization and be in compliance for those scenic rides...then you'd be legal to give the rides with just a Commercial certificate. So, talk to the operator and see if they already have the Letter, and if not then recommend they get one if they are doing many "rides".
 
rframe said:
Short answer: no.

Long answer: maybe, but only if the school also has a Letter of Authorization per 91.147 to conduct scenic tours

A "discovery" flight has no definition with the FAA... it's either a flying lesson or it's a passenger flight. Since the scenario is that any random person off the street comes in and purchases the "discovery" flight, that makes the ride common carriage...therefore, there are only two options:
1. The "discovery" flight is a flying lesson, and the pilot needs to be a CFI to log it
2. It's a scenic ride and that requires a Commercial pilot AND the school/operator must also have an LoA per 91.147

Lots of people just use option 1 regardless of the customer's intention...but imagine the scenario where an accident occurs and the FAA questions the customer and they state they bought a scenic ride and had no intentions of taking a flying lesson.... there's a very significant difference as far as the FAA is concerned and both the pilot and operator could be in hot water.

If the flight school is active, already has a good maintenance plan, and has a drug testing policy, then it's probably going to be a pretty simple process to get a Letter of Authorization and be in compliance for those scenic rides...then you'd be legal to give the rides with just a Commercial certificate. So, talk to the operator and see if they already have the Letter, and if not then recommend they get one if they are doing many "rides".
Click to expand...

Well said.
 
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