Comair

[B767Driver]

There was an article in the Cincinnati paper this morning that said Comair almost shutdown the day after Delta filed for bankruptcy because 5/3 Bank froze $40 million in their accounts, even though prior arrangements had been made prior to the filing for access to the money.

They could not buy fuel or make good on payroll checks...(this was Sept 15 and payday).

It also stated that the normal $20 million deposit made by Delta to Comair was not made available for withdrawal. It highlights some interesting items...if there is any doubt that the connection carriers are propped up by their parent...this article should be eye opening.

It shows how cash dependant an airline is and how the mailine carriers prop up the connection partners.

Comair cancelled the 5/3 accounts and moved to a new bank. The article said that Comair even told them to come and remove the 5/3 ATM machine that apparently occupied space at CMR HQ.

 

[sopdan]

Gee, Comair and I have something in common... I hate Fifth Turd Bank.

 

[Goldmember]

seconded...

 

[flyover]

if there is any doubt that the connection carriers are propped up by their parent...this article should be eye opening.

There was doubt?

 

[B767Driver]

There was doubt?

You should hear them talk around here...all I've heard for the last 4 years is how Comair is saving Delta's bacon.

 

[derg]

There was doubt?

It was always fun hearing how a CMR CRJ at $0.30+ CASM was saving the industries tail back in the day. Whuteva.

 

[flyover]

You should hear them talk around here...all I've heard for the last 4 years is how Comair is saving Delta's bacon.

You are unusual in that you talk to Comair pilots. Most Delta pilots don't.

Without Delta's anoitment Comair doesn't even exist. And I've been saying the regionals are going to start feeling the pain of their creators. Like Dough said, highest seat mile costs and you're feeling invincible?

 

[BobDDuck]

The Delta system may no be the best example as ASA and CMR always had higher cost structures, but there was a time in the Airways system when the WOs (and the Shuttle) were the only thing making money.

 

[B767Driver]

You are unusual in that you talk to Comair pilots. Most Delta pilots don't.

Without Delta's anoitment Comair doesn't even exist. And I've been saying the regionals are going to start feeling the pain of their creators. Like Dough said, highest seat mile costs and you're feeling invincible?

Actually, I don't have to talk to them...just work out at the local YMCA and you'll be amazed at the conversations you hear. Even though my blood pressure starts to rise...I don't engage.

Lately, though, things have started to change. Everyone is undercutting CMR for business...and I think they realize they did the same thing to the DL pilots. I don't believe they ever thought it would happen to them.

 

[derg]

That's why I'm a firm believer in "one airline, one pilot group". Allowing airlines to outsource their work only provides the airline with rope to hang themselves, grab a retention bonus and eventually destroy the company.

Just a few days ago, a lady was flying to Nashville and I didn't recognize the flight number or even the airline but it was Delta ticket stock. I didn't know the terminal, who operated the flight or anything beyond "Umm, let me take you to a gate agent that isn't busy so she could sort this out for you."

So a passenger can buy a ticket on ArizonaAir, have to hop on the flight at FlyColorado's terminal, but they're on a Scottsdale Airlines airline flown by Tempezona Airways which is a wholly owned subsidiary of Air Fresno to get around the scope clause of ArizonaAir.

So if anyone along the line drops the ball and gives ****ty customer service, the passenger won't book on ArizonaAir again and the problem never gets identified and/or rectified.

 

[H46Bubba]

Sounds like the m.o. of a certain regional airline based in Phoenix! I'm not not gonna name names though! They've underbid Comair on those JFK routes and will compete in the market against operators that have been flying rj's on these routes. We'll see how that goes. I wonder how the customers will like going from flying a Comair CRJ to a Freedom Dash-8.

 

[BobDDuck]

So a passenger can buy a ticket on ArizonaAir, have to hop on the flight at FlyColorado's terminal, but they're on a Scottsdale Airlines airline flown by Tempezona Airways which is a wholly owned subsidiary of Air Fresno to get around the scope clause of ArizonaAir.

So if anyone along the line drops the ball and gives ****ty customer service, the passenger won't book on ArizonaAir again and the problem never gets identified and/or rectified.

That's been a common thread of discussion amoung wholly owned regional pilots. For the most part we (PDT, PSA, CMR, AE, 9E, XJ and XJet even though they aren't WO anymore) have a vested interest in how our mainline airline does. We do our best to save gas. We try to portray a good image of the company etc etc. Some times I wonder if some of the contract regionals don't make quite as much effort to provide top quality service. As long as the level is satisfactory they will keep the contract. If the major makes money or not is not really a concern for them.

 

[B767Driver]

That's why I'm a firm believer in "one airline, one pilot group". Allowing airlines to outsource their work only provides the airline with rope to hang themselves, grab a retention bonus and eventually destroy the company.

Just a few days ago, a lady was flying to Nashville and I didn't recognize the flight number or even the airline but it was Delta ticket stock. I didn't know the terminal, who operated the flight or anything beyond "Umm, let me take you to a gate agent that isn't busy so she could sort this out for you."

So a passenger can buy a ticket on ArizonaAir, have to hop on the flight at FlyColorado's terminal, but they're on a Scottsdale Airlines airline flown by Tempezona Airways which is a wholly owned subsidiary of Air Fresno to get around the scope clause of ArizonaAir.

So if anyone along the line drops the ball and gives ****ty customer service, the passenger won't book on ArizonaAir again and the problem never gets identified and/or rectified.

I agree Doug. A year or so ago a group of business people were talking about bringing a lawsuit together claiming false advertising in the whole shell game. I don't think it ever came to fruition.

 

[derg]

We're using reduced cost indices, trying to fly as efficiently as possible, but some other airlines which do contract work do two-engine taxis, running the APU until takeoff, fly barberpole in cruise, and taxi into the gate using both engines and the APU.... Grr...

 

[FlyChicaga]

We're using reduced cost indices, trying to fly as efficiently as possible, but some other airlines which do contract work do two-engine taxis, running the APU until takeoff, fly barberpole in cruise, and taxi into the gate using both engines and the APU.... Grr...

Funny, because our contract company had instituted fuel cost savings measures that will bring in about a 3% fuel savings per year to the mainline partner, yet they still want to give 25% of our airplanes away.

I can't wait to get out of the regionals.

 

[pilot602]

Sounds like the m.o. of a certain regional airline based in Phoenix! I'm not not gonna name names though! They've underbid Comair on those JFK routes and will compete in the market against operators that have been flying rj's on these routes. We'll see how that goes. I wonder how the customers will like going from flying a Comair CRJ to a Freedom Dash-8.

They're somehow underbidding us on a few of our 1900 runs. Explain how a gigantic company (in relation to us) can somehow operate larger aircraft more cheaply to a barely sustainable route. Oh, yeah, they can't. They just underbid to get the contract then run amok with costs which is why the get kung-fu-booted-to-tha-arse out of contracts in the first place.

 

[pilot602]

Funny, because our contract company had instituted fuel cost savings measures that will bring in about a 3% fuel savings per year to the mainline partner, yet they still want to give 25% of our airplanes away.

I can't wait to get out of the regionals.

No offense Chicaga, but regionals who have their gas bill (not to be taken too literally) scare the hell out of me. Hence no big rush to leave where I am ...

 

[derg]

Funny, because our contract company had instituted fuel cost savings measures that will bring in about a 3% fuel savings per year to the mainline partner, yet they still want to give 25% of our airplanes away.

That's when you REALLY start burning gas to prove a point!

Reminds me of the old days of "A Trio For Leo!"

 

[alphaone]

How did Comair Pilots undercut you guys?

 

[alphaone]

Actually, I don't have to talk to them...just work out at the local YMCA and you'll be amazed at the conversations you hear. Even though my blood pressure starts to rise...I don't engage.

Lately, though, things have started to change. Everyone is undercutting CMR for business...and I think they realize they did the same thing to the DL pilots. I don't believe they ever thought it would happen to them.

So wait, there seriously is that much hatred between the two pilot groups here in town? And what local YMCA do such a large ammount of Comair and Delta pilots work out at?