CFI or Timebuild?

PLANECOOK

PLANECOOK

Well-Known Member
With the airlines hiring with as little as 300TT, what are your view of paying for all the instructor rating instead of sharing time in an airplane and timebuilding to meet the mins? I mean I rent a PA-28-161 shared with another IR rated student and we fly approach and IFR cross countries at the rate of $45 bucks a person per flight hour. I was quoted 7k to get all the instructor rating and figured thats 155hr Pic I could build myself and get hired faster. Any advise or maybe a perspective on someone who did either track to getting hired?
 
Re: CFI or Timebuild????????

Do you whatever you need to in order to gain valuable experience.

You learn plenty while working on the CFI (and hopefully CFII and MEI), and the experience you gain teaching is huge. You'll spend a few months making all the decisions before you settle in the right seat for a few years.
 
Re: CFI or Timebuild????????

PLANECOOK said:
With the airlines hiring with as little as 300TT, what are your view of paying for all the instructor rating instead of sharing time in an airplane and timebuilding to meet the mins? I mean I rent a PA-28-161 shared with another IR rated student and we fly approach and IFR cross countries at the rate of $45 bucks a person per flight hour. I was quoted 7k to get all the instructor rating and figured thats 155hr Pic I could build myself and get hired faster. Any advise or maybe a perspective on someone who did either track to getting hired?
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Let me just tell you what everyone is going to tell you...

Get the CFI tickets because it makes you a better pilot, and you have something to fall back on in case airlines dont work out. Also you can start making money as a CFI vs. paying for hours.


I'm kinda partial on just doing the time building just because i've had this dream of flying across the country in a single piston.
I doubt you'll get anyone on here who will say build time. However, it's your career. Do what you think is best.
 
Re: CFI or Timebuild????????

I am doing the same thing, skipping the CFI. I have a PA-28-160 if you want to split some time doing the safety pilot thing.... will make it really cheap for both of us, I am not trying to make money just want the hours and with the safety pilot seems like a 2 for one...... JOE
 
Re: CFI or Timebuild????????

Quick way\perhaps most fun-time build, but only on extensive cross country trips. Practice all kinds of approaches and other IFR skills. Be prepared to deal with a furlough.

Safe way-cfi, cfii, if you have 25-50 ME you might be able to skip MEI. Instruct 500-1000 hrs (otherwise it might not be worth it). Then you are already prepared for a furlough.

I know what I would choose, but the choice is yours.

P.S. Personally I would go quick way. I have heard of people having the time of their life on x-country "adventures" while learning all kinds of new airspace and airports. The market is probably OK to go this way for the time being.
 
Re: CFI or Timebuild????????

If you are going to blow the money anyway, why not get your CFI tickets and get something out of it? Don't shoot for the minimum times for airlines because you will either end up somewhere you don't want to be or you will be told to go blow your load on an RJ course (which you definately DONT want to do). Never mind the fact that it will make you a better pilot/give you something to fall back on, but after you have a commercial splitting time is just money down the drain.
 
Re: CFI or Timebuild????????

here's an idea..if you 'don't want to teach' - don't. you'll wind up doing something you don't enjoy, it reflects onto the student,and the rest of us cfi's have to un-jumble the mess when you leave for the airlines. not pointed at the original poster, btw..just a thought..
 
Re: CFI or Timebuild????????

Bigey said:
Get the CFI tickets because it makes you a better pilot,
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Depends on your definition of "better pilot" is. Seems to me most CFIs' stick-and-rudder skills would tend to atrophy somewhat since they're rarely actually manipulating the controls themselves.
 
Look at the CFI like buying a business. With a CFI you can mint money. When you spend the $$ to time build all you have is a logbook that is filled with a couple hundred hours of time - which might be good time, but it's still just time. The places that are hiring with low, low time are places that require an RJ course, to the tune of about $6k, be done as well, so now you're up to $13k and still haven't gotten that job.

There are numerous things having a CFI will help you with down the road. It could be a job (corporate), it could be a fall back, it could be what sets your apart from the other people interviewing. It could be the networking aspect of it, it could mean getting a check airman gig, heck these days (and I saw it at Riddle in 2000-2001) it even means colleges will give you free tuition.
 
Re: CFI or Timebuild????????

exleardriver said:
here's an idea..if you 'don't want to teach' - don't. you'll wind up doing something you don't enjoy, it reflects onto the student,and the rest of us cfi's have to un-jumble the mess when you leave for the airlines. not pointed at the original poster, btw..just a thought..
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I agree...Honestly, if you have to ask the question, you are most likely trying to rationalize your decision, and don't really want to teach to begin with....If you don't want to teach, then don't do it...very simple.
 
Re: CFI or Timebuild????????

aloft said:
Depends on your definition of "better pilot" is. Seems to me most CFIs' stick-and-rudder skills would tend to atrophy somewhat since they're rarely actually manipulating the controls themselves.
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With fresh Private students that is not really true, even with some instrument students that just finished Private I get to save my ass occasionally. Though it is true if all you do is work with more experienced pilots.

But you know as well as I do that there is a lot more to it than just stick and rudder skills.

Examples:

How to not spill my Coffee
How to curse at the student if he does spill my Coffee
How to bill a student that no-shows
How to Bitch and moan about how much instructing paychecks suck
How to do 80 laps in the pattern at U77 in one day
How to handle phone calls from parents of students that don't understand that flying is expensive
How to politely tell those parents that their kid is too stupid to pass a checkride anyway
How to self affirm that you like your job
 
Bingo. The main benefit to CFI is that you make the calls in the airplane for a couple hundred hours (ADM).......let's face it NONE of us can put a hard line value to that. But if the market will let you build 50-100 hrs and deem you "safe enough to hire right seat", and there is even a little doubt about instructing, for heavens sake go for the time build. Life is full of decisions, and this is just another yes\no, go\no go, dem\republ, name brand\generic brand.....grab your balls (or equivalent female organ)and pick cause nobody's gonna give you your right answer.

I really hope I don't sound like an ass I just have a headache.
 
Re: CFI or Timebuild????????

aloft said:
Depends on your definition of "better pilot" is. Seems to me most CFIs' stick-and-rudder skills would tend to atrophy somewhat since they're rarely actually manipulating the controls themselves.
Click to expand...

this is a huge misnomer. i was an instructor from 10-15 years ago. in my initial class hire of 20 at my first freight outfit, only two of us were former instructors, the others all came from other part 135 ops moving up into mu-2's, twin turbine beech-18's and learjets. based upon your performance as an f.o. in the turboprops dictated how soon you began the transition to the lear. they pick two at a time. guess who the first two were? me and the gal who also had been a flight instructor. her steep turns in the lear for her initial sic checkride were reportedly within 25'....that's tight.

and i didn't later become a training captain and check airman just because nobody else was available. you sit in the right seat and watch others fly..doing things right..making mistakes..for hundreds or thousands of hours and you really learn what flying is all about.

don't knock instructors.....not in this house! :bandit:

:D
 
An exact quote from my CP at a medium sized 135 freight operation,

"It's mainly the guys who weren't CFIs who give me problems, or don't make it throught initial in the first place."



In the short time I've been here, I've run into several scenerios where I knew exactly what to do because of stuff I learned while a CFI.
 
Re: CFI or Timebuild????????

bdhill1979 said:
But you know as well as I do that there is a lot more to it than just stick and rudder skills.

Examples:

How to not spill my Coffee
How to curse at the student if he does spill my Coffee
How to bill a student that no-shows
How to Bitch and moan about how much instructing paychecks suck
How to do 80 laps in the pattern at U77 in one day
How to handle phone calls from parents of students that don't understand that flying is expensive
How to politely tell those parents that their kid is too stupid to pass a checkride anyway
How to self affirm that you like your job
Click to expand...

Tru' Dat. :)
 
Re: CFI or Timebuild????????

exleardriver said:
here's an idea..if you 'don't want to teach' - don't. you'll wind up doing something you don't enjoy, it reflects onto the student,and the rest of us cfi's have to un-jumble the mess when you leave for the airlines. not pointed at the original poster, btw..just a thought..
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word.

people who don't enjoy teaching, don't put themselves into it, and just end up screwing the pooch on the students training. don't ruin their training, just because you 'don't want to teach'
 
PLANECOOK said:
With the airlines hiring with as little as 300TT, what are your view of paying for all the instructor rating instead of sharing time in an airplane and timebuilding to meet the mins? I mean I rent a PA-28-161 shared with another IR rated student and we fly approach and IFR cross countries at the rate of $45 bucks a person per flight hour. I was quoted 7k to get all the instructor rating and figured thats 155hr Pic I could build myself and get hired faster. Any advise or maybe a perspective on someone who did either track to getting hired?
Click to expand...

This is purely an opinion... I went to the airlines and hated it! I'm a GA guy from head to toe. I'm currently trying to find a full-time 135 gig, but for once it's harder to find a job in 135 than 121. Go figure! As far as teaching goes; sitting right seat and teaching someone how to fly lets you look at an airplane from a whole different perspective. It makes you better, it really does.
 
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