cessna 340A pay

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kh2gr

New Member
I work as a flight instructor and was recently giving a BFR and ICC for the CEO of a company nearby. He asked if I had my multi and how many hours and then asked if I would want to fly with him in a cessna 340A. I have 10 hours multi and almost 1000 PIC, and apparently this is good enough to fly in the right seat (the plane is certified single pilot anyways). He has 600 hours total and 50 hours multi going down for simulator training in the 340 next month. He said he would fly some flights but would probably need someone to fly a few flights later on because he wouldnt be able to do them all...
In a job like this how does one usually pay? I am assuming this is considered contract flying? part 91... etc.
 
Are you gonna be flying it or him? Does he just want you along for insurance reasons? Sounds to me more like a MEI gig than a contract pilot, especially since it's certified single pilot and part 91.
 
No it could not be a MEI gig because I am not an MEI. he bought a cirrus SR22 and the company a Cessna 340A, so I am assuming I would be the one to fly it primarily, however to fly PIC the insurance said 50 hours minimum. He is getting the 50 hours training and sim training at simcom... however he said that he would not be able to fly it all the time for business so he asked me to fly with him... not positive if I can legally fly and log SIC and be payed for it, or if I can log SIC to build experience and meet insurance requirements... please feel free to comment ( I appologize for the lack in knowledge of this type of operation, if someone can link me to the regs it would probably help.)
 
I also never asked him about part 135 certification... he may be applying for part 135... if so would this change anything?
 
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I also never asked him about part 135 certification... he may be applying for part 135... if so would this change anything?

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You would probably have to meet the 135 mins then. If he stays 91, you could fly with him and log it PIC as long as he doesn't log it. As long as he is in the plane and is at the controls..........I think that you are fine. Just fly with him until you meet the insurance minimums.
 
Certified for one pilot, under Part 91, sounds like it might be questionable time at best. There's not really a way to log it SIC, which is why I said it sounded like an MEI gig. The insurance saying that someone else must be on board does not create a SIC position, however. I'd be really wary of logging any of the time unless I knew a) he wasn't going to log any of it (which would defeat the whole purpose from the insurance standpoint) and b) you were the "sole manipulator." If you're required to be there by insurance, he should be paying you, however I'm not sure if you could log it legally without an MEI.
 
To answer your pay questions....I have a number of friends flying smaller King Airs making from $200-$275 a day. I also have a friend under a 1 year contract to fly a Navajo and he gets around $35k plus benefits.
 
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I also never asked him about part 135 certification... he may be applying for part 135... if so would this change anything?

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Not really, other than you'd have to have 135 PIC mins. and go through the training process. A 135 certificate isn't something you just arbitrarily send in an application for, though.

If he is applying for a 135 certificate other than single airplane, single pilot, he is in for a long road if he's never done it before, and also if the airplane has never been on a certificate before.
 
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A 135 certificate isn't something you just arbitrarily send in an application for, though.

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Ho no!
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Giving yourself a root canal is probably easier than getting all of the crap together to become part-135 certified.
 
Yeah I have heard about that. I think probably what it will come down to is I will get the training in the plane and then log PIC when he is in the plane until I get the 50 Hours... from the sounds of things he doesnt want to fly the plane all the time. During those flights he does not fly he needs someone to fly, so I think he will probably take the penalty of not logging the flight time so that he can have a pilot to fly the plane when he cannot. If this seems unreasonable please feel free to post, Im learning
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Also remember since the 340 is pressurized you need a high altitude endorsement before you can log PIC time...I have been told that you can log SIC if you are safety pilot without a h/a endorsement in your logbook.
 
CracktheVSI,


Not true. You need a high altitude endorsement if the aircraft you are flying is certified to fly above FL250 (or 240, can't remember exactly which altitude it is). If the pressurization system is not certified up to this altitude, no high altitude endorsement is required.

Now let's look at something like a King Air. Because it is CERTIFIED up to and above that altitude, you are required to have a high altitude endorsement. Even if you never make it up that high, you are required to have the endorsement.
 
340s are certified to 30,000 John. They require a High Altitude endorsement to act as PIC.

I don't think it applies to SIC.
 
Well sh*t, I didn't think they were certified that high. It still stands that it's not the pressurization, it's the certified ceiling of the aircraft that determines whether it requires a high altitude endorsement.
 
Ok, now I met a young kid in here flying a cessna 421 in the right seat... said he was the co-pilot... he said he flew in the right seat for part 135 ops and 91 ops.. when a person flies for a company like this, do they log the flight time SIC??? or do they just log PIC when they are flying and nothing else?? This aircraft is certified single pilot am I correct??

I have not heard about logging the time as a safety pilot... I dont want to go into an interview for a job later on and find out that I am incorrectly logging the time. I have not heard of this, nor have I seen it in the regs.

ALSO, I understand that I will need a high altitude endorsement.. The owner of the plane is looking for a local instructor to sign him, and hopefully myself off.
 
Part 135 charter regulations require two pilots for IFR flights, thus the SIC can legitimately log the time. Even if the plane is single pilot approved, and even if the charter operator has the single-pilot-with-autopilot authorization, if two pilots are assigned to the flight by the operator than both can log time. That is for the Part 135 flights.

During Part 91 flights the person handling the controls can log PIC. No SIC time (in a 421) unless they are doing the hood / safety pilot thing. I'll let someone else provide the references for the legality of safety pilot time. Basically, though, safety pilot time is loggable time, typically used during IFR training towards attaining the rating. For the purpose of the 421 pilot above, though, any more than just an occasional bit of logging this time (even though *legal*) might be undesirable from an employer's viewpoint.

Slightly oversimplified, but that's the jist. Part 135 SIC time is O.K., Part 91 SIC time is mostly not quite so O.K.
 
:yeahthat:

And this may be stating the obvious, but the SIC has to be current/qualified with that operator, meaning they have to have received all of the required training and taken a checkride with the FAA or a company check airman. The operator can't just arbitrarily throw one of their CFI's in the right seat and designate them an SIC.
 
OK!! makes a ton more sense to me now... as I said my knowledge of part 135 is limited... looking for these answers in the regs lead me to more confusion and question. But it does make sense now.. thanks all.
 
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