Business Jet Direct

DeuceOfAces

DeuceOfAces

Well-Known Member
Hey ya'll,

Do any of you have any experiance with this program?

So, turns out than I'm really interested in it because I've decided that if I pursue the professional pilot route, I'd like to fly biz jets and not at the airlines (it used to be the other way around but thank goodness I found jetcareers, phew...) Teaching at a Flight Safety Center should be awesome for networking and that's basically how you get your foot in the door in the biz av industry, right? I've realized that getting that first job in the Part 135 world is the hardest part, but after that, experience should carry my career forward.

I'm 18 right now and a college sophomore I'm thinking of doing this program after I graduate and seeing how the economy is then. Hopefully, I can knock out at least my PPL and maybe instrument before I graduate if I pay as I go. That's outrageously expensive here in the NYC metro area though...

All comments and advice welcome.
 
Get at least ATP minimums before even thinking about going to a center. FSI will not let anyone instruct in a jet simulator with less than that. Working for FSA (Academy) is a good way to get a foot in the door at a sim center. Otherwise, you will be competing with retired airline captains and those with tens of thousands of hours of jet time for a sim instructor job.

Craig....care to shed some light on this?
 
soonerpilot06 said:
Get at least ATP minimums before even thinking about going to a center. FSI will not let anyone instruct in a jet simulator with less than that. Working for FSA (Academy) is a good way to get a foot in the door at a sim center. Otherwise, you will be competing with retired airline captains and those with tens of thousands of hours of jet time for a sim instructor job.

Craig....care to shed some light on this?
Click to expand...


Oops, I meant to say that I intend to hopefully get my private and instrument on my own up here, then heading down to vero beach once I graduate from college.
 
DeuceOfAces said:
Oops, I meant to say that I intend to hopefully get my private and instrument on my own up here, then heading down to vero beach once I graduate from college.
Click to expand...

You wont qualify if you don't go down to the Academy wth any licenses. To do that program you have to start with your private pilot's license there. But, once you work for them as an instructor, you could apply for a transfer to a center.. The only thing is you may not get the same pay as if you did the full BJD program.. Still a way to fly the sims though and make some good connections!
 
brandyn said:
You wont qualify if you don't go down to the Academy wth any licenses. To do that program you have to start with your private pilot's license there. But, once you work for them as an instructor, you could apply for a transfer to a center.. The only thing is you may not get the same pay as if you did the full BJD program.. Still a way to fly the sims though and make some good connections!
Click to expand...

I love quick replies

So, if I start from scratch at FSA Academy (PPL to CFI/CFII/MEI) I should earn more as a CFI and eventually as a sim instructor?
 
It is all economy dependent.

Both of you guys are correct in your assesment.

There are really two ways to go about looking at this.

To be an INSTRUCTOR at a Center on whatever equipment if it requires a TYPE rating than you FSI will require you to be ATP rated and TYPED in that Series.

If you are teaching on something lesser like a King Air 200, then I believe they will let you teach without the ATP.

Call the center and find out, I honestly can only speak from an SIC standpoint here.

Brandy is correct, however, I believe it is more of a person to person basis and it is up to that center to what they are going to pay you.

Play your cards right and you can come out making mid 40's and have a pretty cushy schedule.

Generally the FSI BJD program is more of an SIC position for networking but there is the possibility of becoming an INstructor at a Center. Now, Sooner is correct in stating that having at LEAST 1500 would behoove you in the idea that you can just get a type and ATP and then possibly start on a program, depending on if the center needed Instructors.

Btw, I am an SIC up at the Toledo center.

I currently work with the Citation II, V, V Ultra, III, XL.

I have met alot of good clients through the Sims and am looking forward to hopping into a Citation VII for some contract work in the very near future.

Craig
 
Sweeeet!

Yeah, I think I confused sim instructor with the SIC program. If I'm reading this right, as a SIC I'd fly in the right seat while Flight Safety clients conduct recurrents, type rating training, etc, right?
And CrockRocket, how long did it take to get your certs and make it to St. Louis? I'm assuming you went to FSA without a PPL?

Oh, and do instructors at the academy (before they head to a Flight Safety center) get bennies (401k, health care)? I think I read that SIC employees at the sim centers get benefits.

This info is really, really helpful. :rawk:
 
soonerpilot06 said:
Get at least ATP minimums before even thinking about going to a center. FSI will not let anyone instruct in a jet simulator with less than that. Working for FSA (Academy) is a good way to get a foot in the door at a sim center. Otherwise, you will be competing with retired airline captains and those with tens of thousands of hours of jet time for a sim instructor job.

Craig....care to shed some light on this?
Click to expand...

I know two FSA 2008 grads, one CFI (never worked as one) and the other just Comm multi instrument, both working at FSI centers, one In Savannah the other in Tucson, both with less then 400 hours when hired. last time I talked to them they where flying for clients too.

I think what matters is if they are hiring or not, then for sure with ATPL mins you can get hired easier..

I was at FSI in Paris (world main center for EMB), where my gf's dad works, over there SIC are actual sim instructors, nobody around there had less then 5 type ratings and 15k hours....
 
swisspilot said:
I know two FSA 2008 grads, one CFI (never worked as one) and the other just Comm multi instrument, both working at FSI centers, one In Savannah the other in Tucson, both with less then 400 hours when hired. last time I talked to them they where flying for clients too.

I think what matters is if they are hiring or not, then for sure with ATPL mins you can get hired easier..

I was at FSI in Paris (world main center for EMB), where my gf's dad works, over there SIC are actual sim instructors, nobody around there had less then 5 type ratings and 15k hours....
Click to expand...


Alex who went to Sav and TUS?


Btw, the mindset is differet for FO's and SIC's over there than it is here in the states.

And alot of people who seat fill around here are IPs for FSI. Having 15k hours and multiple types doesnt mean you are a good right seat guy. There is alot more to being a good SIC for FSI then just having experience. Being too good a co-pilot can really hurt the learning ability of the client. It's like instructing, you have to let the student make the mistake for them to learn.
 
Crockrocket94 said:
Alex who went to Sav and TUS?


Btw, the mindset is differet for FO's and SIC's over there than it is here in the states.

And alot of people who seat fill around here are IPs for FSI. Having 15k hours and multiple types doesnt mean you are a good right seat guy. There is alot more to being a good SIC for FSI then just having experience. Being too good a co-pilot can really hurt the learning ability of the client. It's like instructing, you have to let the student make the mistake for them to learn.
Click to expand...

KSAV: Satoshi
KTUS: Lory Wood

There is an other guy I remember that grad in 2008, he is also in TUS, he was in the AATP with eagle before
 
DeuceOfAces said:
Sweeeet!

Yeah, I think I confused sim instructor with the SIC program. If I'm reading this right, as a SIC I'd fly in the right seat while Flight Safety clients conduct recurrents, type rating training, etc, right?
And CrockRocket, how long did it take to get your certs and make it to St. Louis? I'm assuming you went to FSA without a PPL?

Oh, and do instructors at the academy (before they head to a Flight Safety center) get bennies (401k, health care)? I think I read that SIC employees at the sim centers get benefits.

This info is really, really helpful. :rawk:
Click to expand...

Duece, AFAIK IPs at the Academy receive full benefits (something like 20 a month for health coverage, with selectable plans). I am a full time Employee of FSI at the Toledo location so I receive said bennies.

Part time workers do not receive benefits. Which isnt bad if you have alternative means for healthcare be it through a university or sig. other.

Alex- Cool, thanks for the info.

I think alot of people get a misconception about what it is people are expected to do at a center if they choose that route.

I know of MANY people who have gotten jobs out of FSA's BJD track, and other who have gotten jobs without ever working a day at FSA Vero. Like I said, it is all up to the center, just go talk to the Center Manager or Director of Training and if they are looking for part time help or full time help they are the ones that would know about it.
 
OK, I've got one (wait.. its two) more questions. How's the debt load? Since I go to a state school, I expect to graduate from college with 0 student loan debt so that should really help. I expect the price of attending FSA to increase over the next 2 years but can anyone give a ballpark figure?

And, what time frame should I be looking at to get from PPL to CFI. It depends on how much I apply myself unlike ATP where they've got people on a set schedule (90 days), right?
 
DeuceOfAces said:
OK, I've got one (wait.. its two) more questions. How's the debt load? Since I go to a state school, I expect to graduate from college with 0 student loan debt so that should really help. I expect the price of attending FSA to increase over the next 2 years but can anyone give a ballpark figure?

And, what time frame should I be looking at to get from PPL to CFI. It depends on how much I apply myself unlike ATP where they've got people on a set schedule (90 days), right?
Click to expand...

Get your PPL before you go to FSA.
 
DeuceOfAces said:
OK, I've got one (wait.. its two) more questions. How's the debt load? Since I go to a state school, I expect to graduate from college with 0 student loan debt so that should really help. I expect the price of attending FSA to increase over the next 2 years but can anyone give a ballpark figure?

And, what time frame should I be looking at to get from PPL to CFI. It depends on how much I apply myself unlike ATP where they've got people on a set schedule (90 days), right?
Click to expand...

If you get your private before coming here, I recommend you don't build too much time afterward. In the part 141 world, if you enter a program with a private, you have to complete the Step II time building phase. That's even if you have 100 hours already. It will seem like a waste of money to have to go back and fly more cross countries just to meet the requirements of the 141 program. Part 61, of course, would be different. From Step II through Step V (CIME) you can plan on spending around $50K. Step I through CFI would cost around $65 - 70K. With a private already in hand, you can complete this in about 4 to 6 months if you are dedicated. CFI will likely take you 2 to 3 months. PPL to CFI is possible in about 10 to 12 months. Just don't take long leaves of absence.
 
DeuceOfAces said:
Yeah, I've been hearing that. Why is it better to go to FSA with a ppl already in hand?
Click to expand...

Mainly because it is much cheaper to get a ppl from an FBO part 61. From an FBO, you will likely spend $5K to $8K getting a private. At FSA, the cost is somewhere near $12K just for the ppl portion of the 141 program.
 
Well, I guess it depends on the person. However, if you go by the MIN numbers (40 hrs 61 vs the 141 FSA Syllabus) it is cheaper. But it has to do with the groundschool as well.
 
Thanks guys for all the responses so far :)

Now, after a bit of research of my own I've discovered that FSA is the most expensive academy-type flight school out there. Even showing up with a PPL already in hand, FSA will run me about 55K - 65K. That's a big investment since I'll be borrowing all that money. IS IT WORTH IT? I would like you all to give me your coldest, most brutally honest, un-sugarcoated assessment. Did FSA work for you or other people you know and would you recommend it?

BTW, I'm deciding from among academy (FlightSafety, ATP, PanAm, DeltaConnection) schools that have housing options since I'll be living away from home wherever I train at. The fbo's around where I'm at (FRG, ISP, HWV) aren't great for training career pilots. Barely anybody has multi-engine planes (and they're $260 an hour, ouch...)!
 
DeuceOfAces said:
Thanks guys for all the responses so far :)

Now, after a bit of research of my own I've discovered that FSA is the most expensive academy-type flight school out there. Even showing up with a PPL already in hand, FSA will run me about 55K - 65K. That's a big investment since I'll be borrowing all that money. IS IT WORTH IT? I would like you all to give me your coldest, most brutally honest, un-sugarcoated assessment. Did FSA work for you or other people you know and would you recommend it?

BTW, I'm deciding from among academy (FlightSafety, ATP, PanAm, DeltaConnection) schools that have housing options since I'll be living away from home wherever I train at. The fbo's around where I'm at (FRG, ISP, HWV) aren't great for training career pilots. Barely anybody has multi-engine planes (and they're $260 an hour, ouch...)!
Click to expand...

I don't think FSA is the most expensive, out of the schools you named I would go FSA with no doubt
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top