Breonna Taylor

Maximilian_Jenius

Super User
As a result of Japan's cowardly sneak attack on Pearl Harbor, Japanese and Japanese-Americans in the U.S. were rounded up and placed in concentration camps for the duration of the war. In the process most lost everything they owned: property, businesses, money, hope... After the war, they continued to suffer intense racial discrimination.
Today, Japanese Americans, and other Asians, are the top earners in American society, outranking whites and all others.

How did they accomplish what so many others cannot?
I guess that you're not counting these black people, huh?

 

A Life Aloft

Well-Known Member
Excuse me? I think the Japanese would consider being rounded up by government authorities as full American citizens, on the sole basis of their race and nothing else, and being placed in internment camps with no charges and no convictions of any crime whatsoever; as probably the largest and most valid example of institutional racism, that there ever has been in this country.
People also forget that Asians. who were brought here, mostly Chinese, helped to build our railroad systems. Hundreds of them died from explosions, landslides, accidents and disease. They were brought here under false pretenses and not treated very well.They were
promised help, places to stay, good pay, medical services, safety issues and equipment, shorter hours,and much better pay with raises. The Managers of course swept all that under the rug when they were brought here. They were incredibly toiling longer hours, often under dangerous conditions, whipped or restrained if they left to seek employment elsewhere. And unlike whites, the Chinese had to foot the bill for their lodging, food, and tools.



This also a very good article: Building the Transcontinental Railroad: How Some 20,000 Chinese Immigrants Made It Happen


"The greatest engineering feat of the 19th century began in 1863, when the Central Pacific and the Union Pacific railroads broke ground. Two years later, contractors began hiring large numbers of Chinese migrants, many from California, to help with the monumental construction project.

In July 1865, the Central Pacific imported the first major group of Chinese workers from China. They were sent to the Sierra Nevadas, where they worked around-the-clock to build 13 tunnels through the mountains. By 1867, 8,000 men were building tunnels and another 3,000 were laying track.

Working conditions were brutal and racism was rampant. In 1867, several thousand Chinese workers went on strike, demanding a pay raise from $35 to $40 a month and an eight-hour work day. The management starved the workers by cutting off food trains, and the strike ended unsuccessfully.

Unsurprisingly, white workers held almost all management positions and made more than their Chinese counterparts. When an Irish railroad worker killed a Chinese man in Texas, his case was dismissed because the judge could find no law that prohibited the killing of Chinese people. According to state law, only killing whites, African Americans and Mexicans was illegal.

Chinese workers were an integral part of the railroad's crowning achievement — laying 10 miles of track in a single day. Between 5 AM and 7 PM, eight Irish rail-handlers and 4,000 mostly Chinese workers laid over 3,500 rails with 25,800 ties, an accomplishment that has never been matched in any era. The Irish workers were given a parade in Sacramento; no one recorded the names of the Chinese contributors.

No one is sure how many Chinese workers died building the railroad because the Central Pacific kept no such records. Estimates range from 600 and up to 1,200 or much more and properly listed. But the remarkable contributions of Chinese migrants is now slowly being uncovered. The Chinese Railroad Workers of North America Project, run by Stanford University, is putting together a more complete history for posterity. Its site includes photographs, archeology and even payroll records, and the project is working to find descendants of migrant laborers who can tell their families' histories."


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KLB

Well-Known Member
People also forget that Asians. who were brought here, mostly Chinese, helped to build our railroad systems. Hundreds of them died from explosions, landslides, accidents and disease. They were brought here under false pretenses and not treated very well.They were
promised help, places to stay, good pay, medical services, safety issues and equipment, shorter hours,and much better pay with raises. The Managers of course swept all that under the rug when they were brought here. They were incredibly toiling longer hours, often under dangerous conditions, whipped or restrained if they left to seek employment elsewhere. And unlike whites, the Chinese had to foot the bill for their lodging, food, and tools.



This also a very good article: Building the Transcontinental Railroad: How Some 20,000 Chinese Immigrants Made It Happen


"The greatest engineering feat of the 19th century began in 1863, when the Central Pacific and the Union Pacific railroads broke ground. Two years later, contractors began hiring large numbers of Chinese migrants, many from California, to help with the monumental construction project.

In July 1865, the Central Pacific imported the first major group of Chinese workers from China. They were sent to the Sierra Nevadas, where they worked around-the-clock to build 13 tunnels through the mountains. By 1867, 8,000 men were building tunnels and another 3,000 were laying track.

Working conditions were brutal and racism was rampant. In 1867, several thousand Chinese workers went on strike, demanding a pay raise from $35 to $40 a month and an eight-hour work day. The management starved the workers by cutting off food trains, and the strike ended unsuccessfully.

Unsurprisingly, white workers held almost all management positions and made more than their Chinese counterparts. When an Irish railroad worker killed a Chinese man in Texas, his case was dismissed because the judge could find no law that prohibited the killing of Chinese people. According to state law, only killing whites, African Americans and Mexicans was illegal.

Chinese workers were an integral part of the railroad's crowning achievement — laying 10 miles of track in a single day. Between 5 AM and 7 PM, eight Irish rail-handlers and 4,000 mostly Chinese workers laid over 3,500 rails with 25,800 ties, an accomplishment that has never been matched in any era. The Irish workers were given a parade in Sacramento; no one recorded the names of the Chinese contributors.

No one is sure how many Chinese workers died building the railroad because the Central Pacific kept no such records. Estimates range from 600 and up to 1,200 or much more and properly listed. But the remarkable contributions of Chinese migrants is now slowly being uncovered. The Chinese Railroad Workers of North America Project, run by Stanford University, is putting together a more complete history for posterity. Its site includes photographs, archeology and even payroll records, and the project is working to find descendants of migrant laborers who can tell their families' histories."


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View attachment 55765
During Jim Crow in the South, there were no place for Asians under "separate but equal." They were not Black and they were not White. Eventually they were viewed as White and allowed to attend White schools and White Colleges. They were allowed to own businesses without being molested by White people over it. They were given business loans and were able to build their business as a community. In fact, they owned many of the grocery stores in black communities in the Mississippi Delta in the past.

So yes. They had hardships, but the institution ALLOWED them things that the institution did not allow people that look like me.

I'm taken aback by the fact of this whole discussion honestly. I'm sick of reading/hearing other people tell me folks that look like me didn’t do enough and that's why we're in the situation. You illustrate articles of Asian-Americans working on the railroad. Well guess who else worked on the railroads? And picked cotton, and worked in textile meals, and built ships. The list goes on. And they did it all under bondage. They were bred like animals and their families sold as livestock. And then after given "freedom" they suffered oppression and abuse by a system that continues abuse to this day. Then people point fingers at them asking "everything is on equal footing. Why do you think differently? Look at this other race..."
 
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Kimo

Well-Known Member
Deep thought but maybe the state of the countries people hail from has something to do with how we treat people. If you come from Canada where things are somewhat orderly you’re ok. If you come from another country where crime, poverty, and chaos is rampant like _____ then we don’t give you a chance and just assume you are trouble. It’s not about skin color but skin color will tip people off of where you hail from.

Either way I can’t wait to get back to talking about the Kardashians.
 

Minuteman

“Dongola”
I'm going to assume you mean "_____" to be "America."

And before you tut-tut me, we have vigilantes jihading to other cities with firearms to <do what?> (that Rittenhouse •), gangs putting-up armed roadblocks under color of law to protect their territory, despite not being any kind of sworn law enforcement (Corbett, Oregon), or where residents of a neighborhood will take up pursuit and arms to detain & kill an unrecognized black man in their territory (Ahmaud Arbery). And of course the cops delegitimizing their authority with very high-visibility occurrences where overwhelming deadly force is used inappropriately on citizens (Philando Castile, George Breonna Taylor, Jacob Blake).

People are using the term "failed state," but I seek some comfort in "failing, but can be fixed."
 

Boris Badenov

Just running in to a burning house...
Edit: who are these “others”?
Well, they're not delineated by skin color, surely? It's the 21st century, and the notion of Race has been dead and buried to any even slightly serious *amateur* student of genetics (let alone a pro) for at least 100 years. I guess if you want to find a Villain in all of this nonsense, look to the people who perpetuate a frankly farsical (and poisonous) 19th century, pseudo-scientific explication of the variety of the human genome. Sorry to keep howling at the heavens about this, but it's true. "Race" is stupid. Like eating-paste, licking-windows stupid. We aren't all the same, and wouldn't it be boring if we were, but continuing to assent to being categorized in ways that were obviously and hilariously incorrect to even mildly educated people in the 19th century...why are we even wasting our time doing this, let alone allowing it to be some significant agent in our national dialectic? I just don't know what you do about that. I throw up my hands.
 

NickH

Uber Driver
Also you can buy a $100 challenge coin to commemorate "Trump beating Covid-19" (just for himself, not anyone else).

The White House Gift Shop hit the news cycle months ago when they were selling Covid commemorative coins. Turns out they weren't affiliated with the actual White House or the Orange Man in any way...

Now they expect people to fall for the same manufactured rage again... People are too smart for that... Right?
 

SlumTodd_Millionaire

Evil Landlord Capitalist
Well, they're not delineated by skin color, surely? It's the 21st century, and the notion of Race has been dead and buried to any even slightly serious *amateur* student of genetics (let alone a pro) for at least 100 years. I guess if you want to find a Villain in all of this nonsense, look to the people who perpetuate a frankly farsical (and poisonous) 19th century, pseudo-scientific explication of the variety of the human genome. Sorry to keep howling at the heavens about this, but it's true. "Race" is stupid. Like eating-paste, licking-windows stupid. We aren't all the same, and wouldn't it be boring if we were, but continuing to assent to being categorized in ways that were obviously and hilariously incorrect to even mildly educated people in the 19th century...why are we even wasting our time doing this, let alone allowing it to be some significant agent in our national dialectic? I just don't know what you do about that. I throw up my hands.
I used to think this, too. Then I listened to some actual geneticists, such as Siddhartha Mukherjee, and realized I was dead wrong.
 

Boris Badenov

Just running in to a burning house...
I used to think this, too. Then I listened to some actual geneticists, such as Siddhartha Mukherjee, and realized I was dead wrong.
Do you listen to The Insight podcast? If you don't, you should, I think you'd dig it. Genetics are real, and they inform way more than we'd like to admit about our behaviors, etc. But the big-picture takeaway from it is that we're still all worried about this stuff WAY out of proportion to what it really signifies. It's a deep-dive (if you'll pardon the millenial expression) in to human populations, how they evolved, etc. Recommended.
 

srn121

Well-Known Member
I guess that you're not counting these black people, huh?

And their most successful minority is still discriminated these days. Nigeria genocided more than 3 million of them and that was after Nigeria was independent. The Igbo people are extremely impressive business folks and the most successful of any ethnic group in Nigeria.

Benjamin Adekunle was one of the Nigerian commanders engineering the genocides of the Igbo minority. He was quite brazen about it, but he insists he wasn't a racist because his argument was that only Europeans can be.

This is him.


“I have to kill the Ibos—sorry”
STERN: What are your troops doing when they march into a town around Port Harcourt, an area where most of the farmers are not Ibos?

ADEKUNLE: We aim at everything that moves.

STERN: Small children tend not to stay put for very long.

ADEKUNLE: I know. I have two myself.

STERN: What will your troops do when you get to the Ibo heartland, that is, to the place populated by Ibos only?

ADEKUNLE: There we will aim at everything even if it is not moving.
He also said he wasn't racist even though he was ethnically cleansing a different ethnic group.

STERN: Are you racist?

ADEKUNLE: You should know exactly where racists are. There is no such thing as racism in Nigeria.

How it ties into aviation is that an incredible freedom fighter who fought across the world tried to help the Biafrans. He later died flying aid to famine struck Ethiopia.

Disgusted at the suffering the Nigerian government inflicted on the Biafrans and the continuous harassment of international relief flights by the Nigerian Air Force, he hatched a plan in collaboration with the French secret service to strike back at Nigerian air power. He imported five small civilian single engine MFI-9 planes produced by Malmö Flygindustri, at that time owned by SAAB, which he knew could also be used for a ground attack role in warfare. He had the planes painted in camouflage colours and fitted with license manufactured 68 mm SNEB type rockets, and proceeded with a crew of two Swedes and two Biafrans to form a squadron called 'Biafra Babies' to strike the air fields from which the federal Nigerian Air Force launched their attacks against the civilian population in Biafra. On 22 May 1969, and over the next few days, von Rosen and his five aircraft launched attacks against Nigerian air fields at Port Harcourt, Enugu, Benin and other small airports. The Nigerians were taken by surprise and a number of expensive jets, including a few MiG-17 fighters and three out of Nigeria's six Ilyushin Il-28 bombers, were destroyed on the ground.[7] The Igbo intellectual Fola Oyewole who fought for Biafra recalled of all the Westerners who served with the Biafrans that Rosen was the most idealistic and the one who cared about the Igbos as a people the most.[8]

Despite his controversial methods, Count von Rosen would later be remembered for his efforts to modernize relief efforts to remote conflict zones. One of the notable figures assisting Count Carl Gustav von Rosen was Lynn Garrison, an ex-RCAF fighter pilot. He introduced the Count to a Canadian method of dropping bagged supplies to remote areas in Canada without losing the contents: a sack of food was placed inside a larger sack before the supply drop. When the package hit the ground, the inner sack would rupture, but the outer one kept the contents intact. With this method many tons of food were dropped to many Biafrans who would otherwise have died of starvation. Later models of the Malmö Flygindustri MFI-9 became the SAAB MFI-15 Safari, with official modifications, developed from the Biafran concept, to facilitate the dropping of food supplies from underwing hard points. Von Rosen was utilizing this type in Ogaden when he was killed during a rebel ground assault.

The guy took the Swedish equivalent of a 152 and blew up Migs and Ilyushin bombers with them in a very desperate and hopeless struggle.

Unfortunately rather than leverage and learn from their business acumen they're still discriminated to this day in Nigeria.

There's an old Latin quote "Man is a wolf to man".
 
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Maximilian_Jenius

Super User
And their most successful minority is still discriminated these days. Nigeria genocided more than 3 million of them and that was after Nigeria was independent. The Igbo people are extremely impressive business folks and the most successful of any ethnic group in Nigeria.

Benjamin Adekunle was one of the Nigerian commanders engineering the genocides of the Igbo minority. He was quite brazen about it, but he insists he wasn't a racist because his argument was that only Europeans can be.

This is him.






He also said he wasn't racist even though he was ethnically cleansing a different ethnic group.




How it ties into aviation is that an incredible freedom fighter who fought across the world tried to help the Biafrans. He later died flying aid to famine struck Ethiopia.




The guy took the Swedish equivalent of a 152 and blew up Migs and Ilyushin bombers with them in a very desperate and hopeless struggle.

Unfortunately rather than leverage and learn from their business acumen they're still discriminated to this day in Nigeria.

There's an old Latin quote "Man is a wolf to man".
WTF is your point???
 

srn121

Well-Known Member
WTF is your point???
Sorry I brought up a genocide you find very inconvenient. You were the one mentioning the Nigerians and a recurring theme in this thread is racial injustice and the very successful ethnic group, the Igbo, were ethnically mass murdered and seeing as how you wanted to talk about the success of Nigerians then the Igbo people are extremely relevant as is their reoccurring discrimination. Maybe you'd prefer folks be silent about that genocide and their discrimination to this day, but I strongly disagree I also find the Swedish Count Rosen's to be an incredible pilot and hero. His aviation accomplishments in humanitarian aid and assisting numerous small groups in life and death struggles are incredible and should be repeated. The guy was an aviation legend and sincerely cared, putting his life to save desperate Africans from famine and genocide so you should want to know the guy.
 

Maximilian_Jenius

Super User
Sorry I brought up a genocide you find very inconvenient. You were the one mentioning the Nigerians and a recurring theme in this thread is racial injustice and the very successful ethnic group, the Igbo, were ethnically mass murdered and seeing as how you wanted to talk about the success of Nigerians then the Igbo people are extremely relevant as is their reoccurring discrimination. Maybe you'd prefer folks be silent about that genocide and their discrimination to this day, but I strongly disagree I also find the Swedish Count Rosen's to be an incredible pilot and hero. His aviation accomplishments in humanitarian aid and assisting numerous small groups in life and death struggles are incredible and should be repeated. The guy was an aviation legend and sincerely cared, putting his life to save desperate Africans from famine and genocide so you should want to know the guy.
Bro, I'm Yoruba.

You're not telling me anything that I didn't already know. I know tons of successful Igbo's. The Igbo and Yoruba people are both pretty successful peoples.

But failing to understand how genocide at all relates to the topic. @gliderboy pointed out how Asians pulled themselves up by the "bootstraps" are top earners in our society. I pulled his collar and said not really bro. Take a seat.

Furthermore like Rwanda, the genocide was caused by white people, in this case the English choosing to elevate one tribe above all others. In this case the Hausa, because they were lighter complected. As a result of that favoritism most of the leadership in Nigeria even today is still controlled by the Hausa tribes.

I know my history.
 

srn121

Well-Known Member
Bro, I'm Yoruba.

You're not telling me anything that I didn't already know. I know tons of successful Igbo's. The Igbo and Yoruba people are both pretty successful peoples.

But failing to understand how genocide at all relates to the topic. @gliderboy pointed out how Asians pulled themselves up by the "bootstraps" are top earners in our society. I pulled his collar and said not really bro. Take a seat.

Furthermore like Rwanda, the genocide was caused by white people, in this case the English choosing to elevate one tribe above all others. In this case the Hausa, because they were lighter complected. As a result of that favoritism most of the leadership in Nigeria even today is still controlled by the Hausa tribes.

I know my history.
Then you know that Benjamin Adekunle, the mass murderer I quoted, was Yoruba on his father side and he happily murdered countless Igbo several years after Nigeria won its Independence. In fact in spite of his role in the genocide in Biafra he was fondly remembered by the Nigerian government when he passed 6 years ago. He also insisted there was no racism in Nigeria, especially while he was mass murdering Igbo, and in spite of numerous examples of ethnic discrimination that persist to this day in Nigeria.

Here are some Hausa.
 

Maximilian_Jenius

Super User
Then you know that Benjamin Adekunle, the mass murderer I quoted, was Yoruba on his father side and he happily murdered countless Igbo several years after Nigeria won its Independence. In fact in spite of his role in the genocide in Biafra he was fondly remembered by the Nigerian government when he passed 6 years ago. He also insisted there was no racism in Nigeria, especially while he was mass murdering Igbo, and in spite of numerous examples of ethnic discrimination that persist to this day in Nigeria.

Here are some Hausa.
Bro, we doin' this? I knew that Adekunle was Yoruba. My middle name is Adetokunbo. I know the difference between Yoruba and Igbo. Seriously, wtf is your point here? What're you trying to argue/prove? But also like seriously, how is this even relevant to the topic?
 

SlumTodd_Millionaire

Evil Landlord Capitalist
Do you listen to The Insight podcast? If you don't, you should, I think you'd dig it. Genetics are real, and they inform way more than we'd like to admit about our behaviors, etc. But the big-picture takeaway from it is that we're still all worried about this stuff WAY out of proportion to what it really signifies. It's a deep-dive (if you'll pardon the millenial expression) in to human populations, how they evolved, etc. Recommended.
I’ll check it out! But I think I disagree with your conclusion. Some of this stuff is extremely significant, to the point where we need public policy involved to attempt to deal with it. For example, racial differences in IQ. Or racial differences in risk of disease. Hell, right now we’re seeing an enormous difference in Covid fatality between white and black citizens. Is that purely a socioeconomic factor, or is there a genetic component? That seems important to know. But people are always afraid to even research this stuff, because there’s a stigma around acknowledging the genetic differences between racial groups.
 
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