Big guns. Little planes.

highspeed

Well-Known Member
Its almost worth busting a TFR if they're going to send out the F-22s to greet ya. F-16s are soooo played. :sarcasm:
 

killbilly

Vocals, Lyrics, Triangle, Washboard, Kittens
Curious. Are they billing the cost of the intercept back to the pilots these days? I know there are some major fees levied if a SAR team goes looking for you because you forgot to close your flight plan.
 

jrwit

Looking to Ride-Along
How serious is this to the pilots? Like lose your license serious or pay the jet fuel bills serious?
 

killbilly

Vocals, Lyrics, Triangle, Washboard, Kittens
I've been told - at least around the DC SFRA - that violations are treated harshly and suspensions were common. This is secondhand information, though. If fines are levied (or if you have to pay for the cost of the intercept) I can see it being mind-blowingly expensive.
 

beasly

Well-Known Member
Say you are intercepted, can you slow-flight the cessna and mess with the jet drivers? I mean, if you are going to pay a fine and lose your license, might as well learn something useful.
 

///AMG

Well-Known Member
Say you are intercepted, can you slow-flight the cessna and mess with the jet drivers? I mean, if you are going to pay a fine and lose your license, might as well learn something useful.
You could do that, but it isn't going to buy you anything. A cessna isn't going to shake an Eagle/Viper/Raptor/etc by going slow.
 

killbilly

Vocals, Lyrics, Triangle, Washboard, Kittens
Slow flight doesn't outsmart a targeting radar. They just don't have to lead you as much. :)

Explained to me by a local CFI - The way the interception works here, (DC SFRA) anyway, is that they'll try and get your attention on guard, plus flying by, up to and including dropping flares.

Once you comply with the intercept and you land, they call in a Coast Guard Dolphin helo to orbit and make sure you don't take off again. This happens until Secret Service and various and sundry other LEOs show up for a little chat. (NOTE - the CG Helo may only be for stuff near and around the FRZ. If you do something stupid like squawk 1200 in the area and you're forced down some place like GAI or HEF, I don't know that they'll do that. Maybe?)

If you do not comply with the intercept, or in any way make them think that you are ignoring them or have no intent of compliance, they are authorized to use deadly force. The training is explicit in this regard, and the procedures both for the area and for intercept are, too.
 

HerrGruyere

Well-Known Member
For something like a little dinky 172, I'm surprised they don't scramble something a little more sensible like a King Air. I figure it's mostly old farts who didn't check the NOTAMs or call a briefer violating the SFRA. Plus, you have to be pretty thick headed not to know you're getting close. They yell at you on the guard frequency.

Also, I don't even want to think about how much it costs to scramble an F-22 to come get me. I'm guessing over 100K.
 

WacoFan

Bigly
My dream job? I'd like for the government to buy a couple of Air Tractor 802U's - the armed ones with rockets and Gatling gun pods. Then, they would let me intercept the violators of TFR's and instead of warning them, they'd just let me shoot them down. Like that video of the South American Tucano (I think it was a Tucano) that shot down the drug smugglers. I think this would be fun. Sure, you're killing people that simply make a mistake, but I would just compartmentalize that aspect of the job. I could become an Ace I think.

EDIT: There is something like 21,000 members on JC. I think that if everyone kicked in $75 I could make a deal with Air Tractor and secure an AT-802U. If I could do this I would market myself as a mercenary - something like "Dependable 42 year old, loves to blow stuff up. For sale to the highest bidder. Will provide my own COIN aircraft. You pay for ammo, fuel. Reasonable rates. Contact me at WacoFan @ Jetcareers."
 

rframe

pǝʇɹǝʌuı
For something like a little dinky 172, I'm surprised they don't scramble something a little more sensible like a King Air. I figure it's mostly old farts who didn't check the NOTAMs or call a briefer violating the SFRA. Plus, you have to be pretty thick headed not to know you're getting close. They yell at you on the guard frequency.

Also, I don't even want to think about how much it costs to scramble an F-22 to come get me. I'm guessing over 100K.
Well it gives the fighter jocks a live target to practice on... so really the pilot should get to charge the US government for the training exercise.

They pay for CAP missions to bust TFR and restricted airspace all the time, just so the fighter jocks can get some practice... think about that...
 

Roger Roger

Paid to sleep, fly for fun
killbilly from what you've learned how easy is it to mess up the SFRA procedures? I mean, it seems like we hear about guys busting it fairly frequently...are they just numbskulls like that senator that landed on the closed runway, or is it pretty easy to miss a step while trying to do your due diligence in the SFRA?
 

rframe

pǝʇɹǝʌuı
You could do that, but it isn't going to buy you anything. A cessna isn't going to shake an Eagle/Viper/Raptor/etc by going slow.
What about something like an Extra or Pitts, that was all out maneuvering down on the deck... I assume you'd just circle them slowly, but how hard would it be to engage something slow and highly maneuverable?
 

Boris Badenov

MAGA! F YOUR FEELINGS!
Like that video of the South American Tucano (I think it was a Tucano) that shot down the drug smugglers.
That F'ing snuff film still makes me mad, just thinking about it. Free Enterprise. Avoid foreign entanglements. Riiiiiiggghhhhtt. Kill a guy in an unarmed airplane and feel like a Big Man.
 
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