ATC Climb rate / gradient

BravoHotel

BravoHotel

Well-Known Member
I basically know what it is, on a SID or ODP there are rates of which ATC can assign greater than the standard 200F/NM etc. I find on a DP minimum criteria for a certain runway if it is greater than standard e.g. Runway 03 370F/NM to 5000. But how do you find the "ATC" climb rate?

Thanks.
 
Hawks said:
I basically know what it is, on a SID or ODP there are rates of which ATC can assign greater than the standard 200F/NM etc. I find on a DP minimum criteria for a certain runway if it is greater than standard e.g. Runway 03 370F/NM to 5000. But how do you find the "ATC" climb rate?

Thanks.
Click to expand...

You mean, like, what they want out of you? Or do you mean for like a radar vector departure?
 
Are you asking where you can find the definitions of the TERPS obstacle clearance plane at 152'/NM and the standard climb gradient of 200'/NM?
 
I should ask do some DPs state the ATC climb gradient in addition to the standard (200F/NM) or a non standard climb (>200F/NM) ?
 
Hawks said:
I basically know what it is, on a SID or ODP there are rates of which ATC can assign greater than the standard 200F/NM etc. I find on a DP minimum criteria for a certain runway if it is greater than standard e.g. Runway 03 370F/NM to 5000. But how do you find the "ATC" climb rate?

Thanks.
Click to expand...

If I'm understanding the question properly, the DP will require the said climb gradient say 700'/NM. Then consult the chart on the DP for the required rate of climb for that obstacle. That chart will have ROC for a range of airspeeds say - 90/120/150/180.
 
SIDs at times have an "ATC required climb gradient" that you are required to meet. This gradient will be equal to or greater than the gradient required to clear obstacles. It is designed to have you cross a restriction (or airspace boundary) at/above ATCs desired altitude. That said, you advise ATC that you will be unable to meet the gradient and they can still clear you for the procedure assuming that you will meet the obstacle gradient.

IIRC, Phoenix used to have one on several of their SIDs. However, I can not seem to find one anymore, so perhaps they changed SIDs and only publish the obstacle gradient now to prevent confusion. The FAA has modified the format of SIDs quite a bit in the past, so it is possible this just faded into obscurity.
 
686a4c28f60483300bc4b80fd08bf970.jpg

ATC climb gradients definitely still exist on military SIDS, example being this one from Nellis. The dagger symbol represents the ATC climb rate and if you simply use the 60 column it translates directly into a Ft/NM.

Sorry for the crappy pic.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
z987k said:
Everyone is having a hard time with this, because that's not a thing.
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It sure is where I work! But the my organization likes to take some obscure topic and turn it into a mountain.

@The G-Man thanks for digging that up. I also found a few others from a discussion I had with one of the instructors. AERO APP!

@flyboy6585 Thanks for definition. I thought I had heard that somewhere along the way, but couldn't remember exactly where.

How we gather our material for TOLD calculations is what brought this topic up.
 
Hawks said:
It sure is where I work! But the my organization likes to take some obscure topic and turn it into a mountain.

@The G-Man thanks for digging that up. I also found a few others from a discussion I had with one of the instructors. AERO APP!
Click to expand...

If I had a choice I probably wouldn't use aero app


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
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