SpiraMirabilis
Possible Subversive
Theres no probably about it kell.
ALPA at Colgan
- Thread starter Seggy
- Start date
surreal1221
Well-Known Member
Yes. . .it is illegal. But, the IBT hasn't been known for their acknowledgement of such things as laws and legislation.
Flamebait? No, not so much. "wake up and get a clue"? look who's clueless- you thought I was saying the 450 pilots at cjc would offset- ha- at least kellwolf from pinnacle can read and knows about alpa trying to increase dues.
If they want to take more from the pilots, then why don't they take paycuts as well from their 200K+ salaries?
Cruise
Well-Known Member
Fine, so you didn't mean what you said. It doesn't change the fact that you need a clue. You get what you pay for. If you're worried about $200 over the course of a year......well, then there really isn't much anyone can tell you.
Remember, we want to present a unified front against management, not a divided pilot group. Allowing IBT into CJC will play directly into management's hands. Stop listening to the fear-mongering and get informed. Feel free to PM me if you need any information. Better yet, I know for a fact you've got several ALPA OC'ers in HPN, I'm certain they'd be happy to inform you of the facts.
Airdale
Well-Known Member
Ok...LISTEN LISTEN HERE YOU IBT supporters.
I am currently represented by the oh so great IBT, as a lot of others on here. Let me tell you a story. We had a crew FIRED for being accused of drinking within 12hrs of their report time by 3 dumb HOTEL employees. There is no evidence against this crew that they in fact WERE drinking within the 12hr window, just the word of the crew against the hotel employees.
Crew is offered a deal. Admit to drinking within the 12hrs or be fired. No way will crew admit to something they didn't do. Crew gets fired, what does the union do? Oh yeah, the Union thinks the crew should have taken the companies deal because there really isn't anything the Union can do to help them keep their jobs. Classic IBT guys. There was never an alcohol test involved, and the company AND the UNION (TEAMSTERS) took the side of HOTEL EMPLOYEES OVER THEIR OWN.
I've never been represented by ALPA, but I tried to help bring them in to Colgan during my time there. I've talked to ALPA guys, I've read up on the material and Seggy answered a lot of my questions.
For the LOVE of GOD, do not vote in the Teamsters. They are a USELESS union for airline employees. USELESS. I'm getting furloughed, or so I've been told by my company. In less than 3 weeks I'm supposedly on the street, and the only thing the TEAMSTERS has informed me of is my dues through a certified letter. If you vote for the IBT, you truely are an IDIOT and I hope someone pimp smacks you across your stupid face. Print this out and post it in your crew rooms. The only thing TEAMSTERS will get you is stapled to the bottom of PCL's list faster than you can throw down those big Q blades into BETA. And after your stapled, you know what IBT's response will be? "It was the best we could do, now we're still missing half of the initiation dues of the pilot group."
I am currently represented by the oh so great IBT, as a lot of others on here. Let me tell you a story. We had a crew FIRED for being accused of drinking within 12hrs of their report time by 3 dumb HOTEL employees. There is no evidence against this crew that they in fact WERE drinking within the 12hr window, just the word of the crew against the hotel employees.
Crew is offered a deal. Admit to drinking within the 12hrs or be fired. No way will crew admit to something they didn't do. Crew gets fired, what does the union do? Oh yeah, the Union thinks the crew should have taken the companies deal because there really isn't anything the Union can do to help them keep their jobs. Classic IBT guys. There was never an alcohol test involved, and the company AND the UNION (TEAMSTERS) took the side of HOTEL EMPLOYEES OVER THEIR OWN.
I've never been represented by ALPA, but I tried to help bring them in to Colgan during my time there. I've talked to ALPA guys, I've read up on the material and Seggy answered a lot of my questions.
For the LOVE of GOD, do not vote in the Teamsters. They are a USELESS union for airline employees. USELESS. I'm getting furloughed, or so I've been told by my company. In less than 3 weeks I'm supposedly on the street, and the only thing the TEAMSTERS has informed me of is my dues through a certified letter. If you vote for the IBT, you truely are an IDIOT and I hope someone pimp smacks you across your stupid face. Print this out and post it in your crew rooms. The only thing TEAMSTERS will get you is stapled to the bottom of PCL's list faster than you can throw down those big Q blades into BETA. And after your stapled, you know what IBT's response will be? "It was the best we could do, now we're still missing half of the initiation dues of the pilot group."
CAPIP1998
Well-Known Member
Ok...LISTEN LISTEN HERE YOU IBT supporters.
I am currently represented by the oh so great IBT, as a lot of others on here. Let me tell you a story. We had a crew FIRED for being accused of drinking within 12hrs of their report time by 3 dumb HOTEL employees. There is no evidence against this crew that they in fact WERE drinking within the 12hr window, just the word of the crew against the hotel employees.
Crew is offered a deal. Admit to drinking within the 12hrs or be fired. No way will crew admit to something they didn't do. Crew gets fired, what does the union do? Oh yeah, the Union thinks the crew should have taken the companies deal because there really isn't anything the Union can do to help them keep their jobs. Classic IBT guys. There was never an alcohol test involved, and the company AND the UNION (TEAMSTERS) took the side of HOTEL EMPLOYEES OVER THEIR OWN.
I've never been represented by ALPA, but I tried to help bring them in to Colgan during my time there. I've talked to ALPA guys, I've read up on the material and Seggy answered a lot of my questions.
For the LOVE of GOD, do not vote in the Teamsters. They are a USELESS union for airline employees. USELESS. I'm getting furloughed, or so I've been told by my company. In less than 3 weeks I'm supposedly on the street, and the only thing the TEAMSTERS has informed me of is my dues through a certified letter. If you vote for the IBT, you truely are an IDIOT and I hope someone pimp smacks you across your stupid face. Print this out and post it in your crew rooms. The only thing TEAMSTERS will get you is stapled to the bottom of PCL's list faster than you can throw down those big Q blades into BETA. And after your stapled, you know what IBT's response will be? "It was the best we could do, now we're still missing half of the initiation dues of the pilot group."
Alright Buddy, you need to count to ten and remember your "happy place", just like they taught you in your anger management course.
I realize that you think that this is an acceptable forum with which to vent, but in reality, your just preaching to the choir. I truly doubt any of the Teamster's supporters actually read this forum, and after reading your post I THANK GOD for that fact. This is exactly why people who fear ALPA, keep fearing ALPA. While you have a good story to tell, I for got all about your persuasive argument after I was threatened with being B!T(# slapped!
We here at Colgan need a unified pilot group, and we need calm rational people at the helm to lead the effort. Yelling and name calling will NOT win over supporters to ALPA, in fact it generally has the opposite effect. Does this sound familiar? It should, you learned it in Kindergarten.
inside0ut
Well-Known Member
We here at Colgan need a unified pilot group, and we need calm rational people at the helm to lead the effort. Yelling and name calling will NOT win over supporters to ALPA, in fact it generally has the opposite effect. Does this sound familiar? It should, you learned it in Kindergarten.
Maybe you missed the point of his post.
It means: Don't vote Teamsters. You will be sorry. Want a unified pilot group? The only thing the pilot group would be unified with in regards to the Teamsters is the fact that everyone will want to decertify them.
I even said it all nice and pretty so as not to hurt anyones feelings.
Airdale
Well-Known Member
Alright Buddy, you need to count to ten and remember your "happy place", just like they taught you in your anger management course.
I realize that you think that this is an acceptable forum with which to vent, but in reality, your just preaching to the choir. I truly doubt any of the Teamster's supporters actually read this forum, and after reading your post I THANK GOD for that fact. This is exactly why people who fear ALPA, keep fearing ALPA. While you have a good story to tell, I for got all about your persuasive argument after I was threatened with being B!T(# slapped!
We here at Colgan need a unified pilot group, and we need calm rational people at the helm to lead the effort. Yelling and name calling will NOT win over supporters to ALPA, in fact it generally has the opposite effect. Does this sound familiar? It should, you learned it in Kindergarten.
Haha...you think my post was great, you should see the stuff on our pilot UNION website. Its no secret the Teamsters are not well liked. After all, what makes a TRUCKERS union think they can represent the complex industry of commercial pilots? Its more like, they saw an opportunity to cash in on money.
Unions in this industry are weak. Simply put, they are weak. I don't care if its IBT, ALPA or USAPA. They are weak. Why are they weak? Two reasons. First and foremost, the US Government has taken any and all wind from the sail of pilot unions. The RLA plays in the favor of management and congress will not give the Union's the power they need to be strong, ie. STRIKE. Unions aren't even allowed to put out official memos on not picking up OT during a furlough. The second reason, pilots. Pilots are living way over their head. They can't afford to take some time off without pay because the big house and big car payments are too high. Pilots are too weak to stand strong and be willing to put it ALL on the line for the sake of bettering the profession. Thats why guys will always cross a strike line (if/when there is ever a strike).
In a sea of weak unions, ALPA stands the strongest. Why? Because they've been representing Airline pilots and Airline pilots only. Sure, they may be a little more expensive, but look at what you get. Job protection thats actually worth a damn! You get legal counsel, you get medical certificate protection! The list goes on and on.
You Colgan guys (not all) are so oblivious to the *real* benefits of ALPA and so caught up in this ALPA vs. Colgan pilots ridiculous petty argument. You're worried about sending your money to the big monster that is ALPA, well try sending your money to a Union that doesn't even support its pilots during a wrongful termination. Try sending your money to a Truckers union that you rarely ever hear from.
I'm not threatening you guys at Colgan, I'm promising you. That if you vote in the IBT, you will get slapped in the face. Not by me, but by the very Union you voted in. Just wait until you have an incident or an issue. The Union won't be there for you. We have an 8 year Captain who is obtaining private LEGAL counsel to defend his case for wrongful termination, defamation of character and obviously, trying to save his career. Where is his union? The union he's paid dues to for 8 years?
What complaints have you heard from ALPA pilots? "Oh the merger didn't go well!" If thats it, then you are seriously being short sighted. Some things are out of your control. Some things are out of the Unions control thanks to our system. Do not confuse what the Union can NOT do for you with what the Union WON'T do for you.
ALPA is the best thing pilots have going when it comes to representation. If you think the Teamsters can do better, than I dare you. There are a vast majority of us that feel like our Union dues get paid to people who stand more by the company than they do they very ones who pay their salary. Just think about it....go talk to any pilot represented by IBT and see how they feel.
SIUAv8r
RJ Commander
I'll second everything Airdale has posted. The treatment some of our pilots are getting at the moment is unbelievably unacceptable. The IBT is doing NOTHING about any of this stuff right now, except sending letters to pilots who are getting furloughed saying they haven't paid their dues.
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
Just as long as you know there's more to it than what you were told. From what I understand, it's not an increase in dues, it's making 401K contributions count towards the percentage used to calculate dues. So, if you don't contribute to a 401K plan, guess what? Dues won't increase for you. Like I said, though. It's still gotta pass a vote from the status reps, which it likely won't.
greaper007
Well-Known Member
Row9, who are you? I'm another FO in HPN.
Cruise
Well-Known Member
We become eligible to vote again sometime after Aug. 21 (23?). Does not mean the vote will occur on that day, however.
pilotlight
Well-Known Member
Good luck, tell these people this: Why in gods name would a person flying a jet want to move to a saab, unless maybe they live in that base. We can all bid on new aircraft together as one seniority list in the future but we both need to be alpa, it would put PNCL corp behind the 8 ball and force them to treat us all like adults.
Cruise
Well-Known Member
Hello!!?? That's exactly right. Not to mention taking a pay cut in the process. There are countless reasons why we need ALPA on property....sooner rather than later. Unfortunately, logic and reason just don't seem to work with some of these knuckleheads over here. In fact, I just talked a Beech Captain (these guys have been taking it in the a** regularly from the company) today. When I asked him about the upcoming ALPA vote, he said he wasn't interested and didn't think we needed a union. I asked him who would be there to protect him if he bent metal or did something dumb.....his response: I'm not planning on doing that. Great, neither am I....but I sure would like someone to defend me if it happens. :banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead: I just don't get it.
Another guy I talked to today was a Saab check airman. When I questioned him on ALPA. His response: I'm not making Colgan my career and I don't want to make a decision for others. OMFG! Wake up, who knows when you'll be leaving here and regardless, that should have nothing to do w/ it. We need to make the industry better for EVERYONE!
The good news is, I did manage to get a couple people to sign representation cards! There is still hope!
jynxyjoe
Queso King
Not holding my breath, but I'm hoping I get proved wrong. Keep working hard. Hopefully this year it will pay off.
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
I don't plan on getting into a car accident, but that doesn't mean I don't have car insurance.....
A year ago, this argument might have made sense. But with so many major guys hitting the streets due to furlough, I'm anticipating being at Pinnacle at LEAST another 2-3 years. I'd like it to be as painless as possible, and ALPA helps alleviate some of the pain.
As for guys from here bidding to the Saab or Q, the only reason that would happen (and be logical) would be for commuting reasons. Most of the guys based in MEM wouldn't even think about it except for the very few that live in Texas bidding to IAH. Even if the Q was a pay raise for me, I wouldn't give up my in-base commute for it.
v1valarob
Well-Known Member
Yea, yesterdays sit in Morgantown for 9 hours waiting for the mechanics was painful. Pretty bad when you have to use the FBOs recliners to get some rest.
