ADF or Radar Required

Maddog1974

Maddog1974

Well-Known Member
Need some help finding a reference here! I am posting a link to the approach plate for the ILS or LOC RWY 16 for Asheville, NC. It says that ADF is required but the 172 we have does not have one, INOP, and we have no GPS. We do have DME and I was told you could sub the DME and fly the approach but I am just can't find the info. Any help in finding the reference would be great as I need to brief and teach this and several others in the next few days.

Is this info correct? Or do I absolutley need the ADF or GPS to fly the approach?

Thanks

http://204.108.4.16/d-tpp/0905/05061IL16.PDF
 
i would say since the MAP hold is NDB you would need a ADF. if you have radar, who cares? If radar service drops, then i don't think you can do it since it says ADF
 
I am by far anything but a TERPS expert, but I believe the ADF is required for FAF identification (maybe even for the missed hold, but you can always ask for alternate missed instructions).

You could argue that you can use the feeder fix off of SUG, but the approach wasn't designed (or probably even flight tested) with that in mind, IDing the FAF off of SUG.
 
400A said:
I am by far anything but a TERPS expert, but I believe the ADF is required for FAF identification (maybe even for the missed hold, but you can always ask for alternate missed instructions).

You could argue that you can use the feeder fix off of SUG, but the approach wasn't designed (or probably even flight tested) with that in mind, IDing the FAF off of SUG.
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but if you are doing the ILS that won't apply, and it is a OM so you should get the Blue light or Sound
 
BuickCFI said:
but if you are doing the ILS that won't apply, and it is a OM so you should get the Blue light or Sound
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For timing, and altitude/position cross check it does. The OM light doesn't come on directly overhead the OM, it is fan shaped.

Picking nits, I realize, but for being technical, just sayin.
 
400A said:
For timing, and altitude/position cross check it does. The OM light doesn't come on directly overhead the OM, it is fan shaped.

Picking nits, I realize, but for being technical, just sayin.
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right and if you are just a little off course the ADF won't flip very quickly either.

i understand your point though
 
The outermarker does have a compass locator associated with it. However, the reason ADF is requred on this approach is becuase it is part of the missed approach procedure. So if ADF is INOP in the plane then legally you cannot shoot the approach.

As a side not GPS is a subsitute for ADF. However to my understanding the plane must have ADF in the airplane and be in working order to be able to substitute the GPS.
 
I stand corrected. That part never made much sense to me. As far as I could see in the regs and what books I have you just have to have the equipment installed. Nothing states it must be in working order.
 
jake.durham said:
I stand corrected. That part never made much sense to me. As far as I could see in the regs and what books I have you just have to have the equipment installed. Nothing states it must be in working order.
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doesnt have to be installed. nearly the entire fleet up here has dual GPS and VOR's but that is about it.
 
That's interesting. I have never had to teach GPS to my students and I only used it for my instrument years ago. At least back then my CFI always taught me it had to be in the plane otherwise it could not be used. That's how I also thought I was reading some of these AOPA articles I have. I know GPS can be a confusing topic too.
 
jake.durham said:
That's interesting. I have never had to teach GPS to my students and I only used it for my instrument years ago. At least back then my CFI always taught me it had to be in the plane otherwise it could not be used. That's how I also thought I was reading some of these AOPA articles I have. I know GPS can be a confusing topic too.
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only time you need equipment installed is for a backup, i.e. enroute you would need some sort of backup installed like a VOR
 
OK, so got a bunch of great replies but it still begs the question on the ADF requirement in that box.

Another point, usually if an approach requires a particular item of equipment then it will aither be included in the title or in the plan view it will say..."ADF Required". This only says it in the box where the info for takeoff and alternate mins are listed.

So, maybe the ADF requirement is for filing KAVL as an alternate? How does that sound??:(

Still trying to figure it out...
 
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