Delta flight attendant falsely “accused” frequent flier of trafficking in special needs daughter

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

I have chosen to believe in the reality of free will (pretty cool I can do that without actually using free will!).

You can't, actually. Your "decision" was preceded by things beyond your control that caused you to "decide" it. But you won't believe that, because you aren't able to.

 

[Maximilian_Jenius]

Most people working in the world's oldest profession are not doing so against their own agency.

Not sure, I haven't polled the 300 mil. citizens of the country. But what I do know first hand is that at least when it comes to sex workers. Most are trans, because employers won't always hire them and they face housing discrimination. So they are forced into sex work to survive. Hell, even you recently, here in fact said that you either wouldn't hire a trans person. Or you would fire them when they started to transition. Because it would/could make employees and customers uncomfortable. This was around the time those specific cases went to the SCOTUS. Those individuals won, so not sure now if you're woke on the topic now. Or if you are just complying with the law now.

As for other LGBT workers here is a quick vid on why they "chose" or are forced into sex work.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Not sure, I haven't polled the 300 mil. citizens of the country. But what I do know first hand is that at least when it comes to sex workers. Most are trans, because employers won't always hire them and they face housing discrimination. So they are forced into sex work to survive. Hell, even you recently, here in fact said that you either wouldn't hire a trans person. Or you would fire them when they started to transition. Because it would/could make employees and customers uncomfortable. This was around the time those specific cases went to the SCOTUS. Those individuals won, so not sure now if you're woke on the topic now. Or if you are just complying with the law now.

As for other LGBT workers here is a quick vid on why they "chose" or are forced into sex work.

I don't think there's any evidence to support your claim that most sex workers are trans, and I seriously doubt that's the case, seeing as how the demand is likely not there, and it is, after all, a business. A quick Google search didn't pull up any results with statistics to support your claim. I'd be interested to see anything you have on it, though.

I also don't believe I've ever said that I would fire a trans person. In fact, we include gender identity in our non-discrimination policy, and have since 2013. Perhaps you're thinking of our dress code policy on visible tattoos or unnatural hair colors?

 

[SteveC]

You can't, actually. Your "decision" was preceded by things beyond your control that caused you to "decide" it. But you won't believe that, because you aren't able to.

The perfect conundrum! I’m in!

 

[Pilot Fighter]

I don't think you understand how this works. Nobody works out a deal to come to the US by working in a massage parlor.

I'm sure there are scenarios that look like slavery but I'm guessing most are like the one example in which I'm privy to the details.

A buddy of mine is dating a Chinese woman that paid off her "relocation contract" by working in a massage parlor in Paducah. She didn't offer extended services so it took her more than a year. It sounded like she could have worked anywhere but was somewhat limited by her visa status. I'm not sure what the repercussions were if she defaulted on the "loan", probably some draconian measure impacting her family back in China. He met her on Tinder and offered to pay off her debt. Apparently, she didn't hate the work, she worked another six months at the parlor. For every woman like this there might be twenty selling sex in the parlors, I don't know.

I'm betting you have more cases of aboriginal Mexicans selling their 15 year old daughters to Americans, a la Fancy, than the type of trafficking portrayed in the media. This is not a dishonorable practice in quite a number of cultures.

 

[Maximilian_Jenius]

I don't think there's any evidence to support your claim that most sex workers are trans, and I seriously doubt that's the case, seeing as how the demand is likely not there, and it is, after all, a business. A quick Google search didn't pull up any results with statistics to support your claim. I'd be interested to see anything you have on it, though.

I also don't believe I've ever said that I would fire a trans person. In fact, we include gender identity in our non-discrimination policy, and have since 2013. Perhaps you're thinking of our dress code policy on visible tattoos or unnatural hair colors?

OMG, I'm going to take my own advice now said to Bob the duck. Be happy, safe and secure in heterosexualness. And yes, YOU did say all that I believe. In relation to the case about the transgender employee at the funeral home, I believe in GA. that began to transition to female and got fired and sued. The case eventually going to SCOTUS. I believe that you agreed and even doubled down on it. I believe that our transgender members might remember that. I won't trigger them by tagging them though. Good day sir. I said good day.

'No wonder many transsexual people end up in sex work'

Despite the Sex Discrimination Act, transgender people often face unfair treatment in the workplace. Juliet Jacques has been luckier than most

www.theguardian.com

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

OMG, I'm going to take my own advice now said to Bob the duck. Be happy, safe and secure in heterosexualness. And yes, YOU did say all that I believe. In relation to the case about the transgender employee at the funeral home, I believe in GA. that began to transition to female and got fired and sued. The case eventually going to SCOTUS. I believe that you agreed and even doubled down on it. I believe that our transgender members might remember that. I won't trigger them by tagging them though. Good day sir. I said good day.

No, if you're going to make that kind of allegation, you're going to show your f***ing work and not just engage in a drive-by character attack. I know you're butt hurt about me calling out your racist comments about white people, but that doesn't excuse this.

P.S. Your article has neither claims nor sources for your comment that the majority of sex workers are trans. I think you know this claim can't possibly be true when only about 1% of the population is trans.

 

[JordanD]

No, if you're going to make that kind of allegation, you're going to show your f***ing work and not just engage in a drive-by character attack. I know you're butt hurt about me calling out your racist comments about white people, but that doesn't excuse this.

P.S. Your article has neither claims nor sources for your comment that the majority of sex workers are trans. I think you know this claim can't possibly be true when only about 1% of the population is trans.

Grab a Snicker’s.

 

[MikeD]

I don't think you understand how this works. Nobody works out a deal to come to the US by working in a massage parlor. They are promised something very different, that doesn't actually exist. And then to pay off their transportation fee, they end up working in the massage parlor, and because of all the fees that get tacked on to doing that job, they never make enough to pay off the initial debt.

Yes, I suppose you could say they made the initial choice to leave where they came from (although that isn't always the case), but not under the terms they end up getting stuck with.

Most people working in the world's oldest profession are not doing so against their own agency.

This is simply a lie. A quick perusal of interviews of massage parlor workers right after the Atlanta shootings a few months ago will turn up several examples. The same people who tell the story you're telling are telling that ridiculous story about escorts in America. In their minds, everyone is always coerced, and no one could ever make a decision on their own to enter that line of work. Which is absolute nonsense (to the extent that decision making is even a thing in the absence of free will, of course).

You are both correct, it’s just has to do with what kind of person is being talked about here.

Duck is talking about people who are involuntarily involved in a situation and there against their will. In those cases, it’s like a macro-version of those car title loan companies: they’re happy to lend you money, but at 400% interest that they know you won’t be able to pay off, so they keep you working in a nearly impossible situation, and one that you never knew the terms to until well after signing on the proverbial dotted line. Many of these people, when they show up, have their passports taken away from them by their “employers”, and that’s the equivalent of the car title loan that they need to “buy back”.

On the other hand, there are people who voluntarily and knowingly get into some of these situations and these are the people Todd is referring to. These people come from a variety of personal situations such as maybe having nothing else and want something to do where they have things like a place to stay taken care of for them……shabby as that may be; or in some cases, sex work or other servitude is just something they want to do for whatever reason. Who knows. The point is, that these particular people are ones that know what they’re getting into and accept those terms. Even if they have things like a passport taken away, they’re fine with that, they aren’t planning on going anywhere.

Just to try and keep straight that two different situations are being discussed above…

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

You are both correct, it’s just has to do with what kind of person is being talked about here.

Duck is talking about people who are involuntarily involved in a situation and there against their will. In those cases, it’s like a macro-version of those car title loan companies: they’re happy to lend you money, but at 400% interest that they know you won’t be able to pay off, so they keep you working in a nearly impossible situation, and one that you never knew the terms to until well after signing on the proverbial dotted line. Many of these people, when they show up, have their passports taken away from them by their “employers”, and that’s the equivalent of the car title loan that they need to “buy back”.

On the other hand, there are people who voluntarily and knowingly get into some of these situations and these are the people Todd is referring to. These people come from different personal situating such as maybe having nothing else and want something to do where they have things like a place to stay taken care of for them……shabby as that may be; or in some cases, sex work or other servitude is just something they want to do for whatever reason. Who knows. The point is, that these particular people are ones that know what they’re getting into and accept those terms. Even if they have things like a passport taken away, they’re fine with that, they aren’t planning on going anywhere.

Just to try and keep straight that two different situations are being discussed above…

Well, while I would acknowledge that these situations are different, I am also someone who believes that the car title loan companies are doing nothing wrong. Caveat emptor.

 

[MikeD]

Well, while I would acknowledge that these situations are different, I am also someone who believes that the car title loan companies are doing nothing wrong. Caveat emptor.

oh absolutely. They wouldn’t be in business, if there was no business to be had. I’ve never used one personally, but I would think that the terms of the loan would be explained and that it would be known that the money being lent isn’t for free.

I think in the situation Duck is talking about, is one where it’s a form of bait and switch……what was promised, is a far cry from what actually is. Perhaps like the proverbial small town midwest girl who goes to Los Angeles because she’s been promised she’d be on the way to stardom as an actress………just nothing about what kind of actress she would be, and probably one she wasn’t planning on being.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

oh absolutely. They wouldn’t be in business, if there was no business to be had. I’ve never used one personally, but I would think that the terms of the loan would be explained and that it would be known that the money being lent isn’t for free.

I think in the situation Duck is talking about, is one where it’s a form of bait and switch……what was promised, is a far cry from what actually is. Perhaps like the proverbial small town midwest girl who goes to Los Angeles because she’s been promised she’d be on the way to stardom as an actress………just nothing about what kind of actress she would be, and probably one she wasn’t planning on being.

Agreed, those situations surely exist. Where we have the disagreement is in numbers. The idea that there are 25 million of these is comical. It’s an inflated number lumping in the second scenario to make it sound far worse than the situation actually is. And that sort of statistical manipulation is exactly what leads to the sort of bad policies we’re talking about here where flight attendants are being enlisted as pseudo-LEOs to harass innocent people.

 

[Skåning]

Look at the middle east if you wanna see the biggest human trafficking travesty on this planet.

Saudi, UAE, Qatar, using Bangladeshis, Pakis, and Indians for forced labor to build their mega projects.

When you're in the region, you see it every day. They are lied to and drawn to the region on false promises, have their passports confiscated, and really get effed (that's my minor contribution to this thread)

 

[Pilot Fighter]

The definition of human trafficking has expanded to cover some pretty benign examples.

On a related note, what percentage of Amber Alerts involve a stranger abducting a child versus a contentious custody dispute? I now treat them like a snooze button.

 

[mwflyer]

Dunno bro, I was just letting you know that "those" types of people are out there. So be aware.

He’s got nothing to worry about. White adults with black children is perfectly fine and raises no suspicion among the ”well meaning” Karen’s. Black adult (particularly male) with white children..........be prepared for some hassles.

 

[Pilot Fighter]

Kinda reminiscing about plane crash threads and arguments about Just Culture.

 

[Cherokee_Cruiser]

Can't really fault the FA there, he did exactly what they're trained to do. Sounds like Delta will throw him under the bus though, as expected.

No worries, his union will get his back…

 

[Old Pete]

I’m the first one to jump on Delta Airlines (corrected spelling) and make fun of them, but in this situation?

IMHO, justified.

I will say airline employees should get more training in human smuggling recognition, but that said, aren’t the red flags present?

* Male adult traveling with a lone young girl/woman
* Different races (put PC aside for a minute)
* Female doesn’t respond much
* Male answers for female
* Female seems visibly uncomfortable

You’ve got to be kidding me. This is outrageous behavior should be denounced. We have no trouble calling out “Karens” for calling police on suspicious African Americans in the park or Criticizing Captains for returning to the gate after a Muslim throws a prayer rug out in the aisle, but tell me how this is in any way acceptable behavior for a flight attendant?
It’s clearly bigoted and possibly racist behavior, at a minimum she/he should be pulled off line and retrained, possibly fired.
A man and his daughter treated this way is outrageous.
And by the your first two bullet points. Homeland security specifically says the being of a specific race, or a male travel with a younger woman should not be used to identify Human trafficking. I would copy and paste from from their “Blue campaign” but they’re may be some SSI issues with that.

 

[Old Pete]

Add in the seems stressed, and won't make eye contact or answer conversational questions from the FA, and you've got almost all the text book signs of human trafficking. .

You’ve just described 90% of the flying public. Ask your flight attendants how many passengers make eye contact during their demonstrations. They get in their seat, put their heads phones on, try to ignore everyone for the duration of the flight.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

but tell me how this is in any way acceptable behavior for a flight attendant?

Simple: the "human trafficking" issue has become a cause of the far left. It's okay to discriminate when the "progressives" approve of it. The funny thing is that the far left and the far right are both on this issue, though. The far right has latched on to it because it plays into their conspiracy theories about pedophile liberals. The far left has latched on because the extremist feminists want to pretend that everyone in sex work is being coerced.