SWA taking off with music over PA?

[MikeD]

The good thing about that is only once several years ago had I ever needed to use them to get somewhere. It was an experience I will not forget and reinforced my idea that I will NEVER pay to fly that airline and I will continue to avoid them to the max extent possible free.

There was a flight attendant carrying a sound making toy dinosaur who was continuously using it over the PA before we left. Then later in flight (night flight) came up in the row behind me (as I was sleeping) and made the noise RIGHT IN MY FREAKING EAR. Seriously, how inconsiderate can you be? Fornicate that airline.

The times I jumpseated on SWA, back in the day when I did jumpseating long ago, I do remember first trying to get on a UAL 727 flight, but ended up getting bumped by a higher priority, and even though there were many open seats in the back, the UAL pilot could only take as many jumpseaters, as there were jumpseats on the aircraft, per policy.

Wandered over to SWA and a 737-200, and same thing......told the jumpseat is already taken. As I thanked the gate agent for the info (all pre 9/11 travel, mind you) and began to wander away to find another possible JS opportunity in my little JS book we were given back then, the gate agent told me to talk to the Capt anyway when he shows up. I wait, the crew shows up, I talk to the Capt and make the standard greeting and ask about the jumpseat, and he says they've got about 25 or so open seats in the back, and feel free to grab one. Once onboard, there were about 12 other jumpseaters going to work or going home, also sitting in the open seats in the back.

So, that was my experience. Positive. I understand the UAL Capt had policy to follow and couldn't deviate from that, certainly nothing held against him for that, although the policy seemed a bit dumb. But SWA was more than accommodating, whether it was policy to be so, or whether the Capt used his own discretion. I never knew which one it was.

 

[Luigi]

Oh good grief. Don't be a drama queen. You didn't like it. You quit. Smart man! But you wouldn't grab the jump if you needed to get somewhere? Gimme a break.

That's like me saying I won't shop at Walmart again. If the price of milk is ten cents cheaper guess where I'll be!

(Actually couldn't find s bunch of stuff on the wife's list at the Target Supercenter last night, so went over to WM and there it was.)

I hate them with a passion, but I'll still stop there if they have what I need. And that's after wasting 9+ years of my life working there!

Agreed, the most important thing is getting to where your going. The means don't matter. I have a rule, I never plan to fly US Airways, but believe me if they were the last flight available, or even if it would get me home a little sooner, I'd take it in a heartbeat.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

I've taken two legs to get somewhere in order to avoid a single leg on SWA. To each his own.

 

[hcaeborev]

We may not consider it fair, but yes, the captain is responsible for what his crew does. Most inspectors would not write up the flight crew for what the cabin crew does. But again, not all inspectors are so reasonable. The smart move on the part of the flight crew would be to fill out an ASAP.

I'm ceasing reading this thread because it's stupid but before I go I'm going to fully disagree with you here.(I know this is a bad idea) What about the numerous incidents involving FAs in the relatively recent past? The JetBlue guy that jumped out the pax door? What if a FA assaults a PAX? what if they steal booze from the bev cart and drink it during flight? What if they smoke in the lav? What if they incorrectly brief the pax during the safety demo? What if they just straight up don't do a safety demo? I can list millions of things, most of which would be way more egregious than what these SWA guys did. Was it a good idea? Probably not, but not because of some trumped up idealism that this was actually unsafe. It's not a good idea because there's people running around that would get bent out of shape about it(you) and probably file a lawsuit or something.

There is NO WAY a captain, or flight crew in general, would be violated for an action by the FAs while in flight with the flight deck door closed. Especially if the had no knowledge of it.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

That's fine. Play games with your livelihood. Nothing would make me happier than to see some corndogs get their comeuppance.

 

[hcaeborev]

That's fine. Play games with your livelihood. Nothing would make me happier than to see some corndogs get their comeuppance.

Why would that make you happy? Seeing a flight crew violated for the actions on an FA would give you pleasure?

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Why would that make you happy? Seeing a flight crew violated for the actions on an FA would give you pleasure?

A corndog crew that stole my seniority and made threats about ending our careers? I lack sympathy, yes.

 

[derg]

I love corn dogs. Do not use that as an expletive.

Dip it right in the mustard jar… Frenchs!

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Corndogs are nasty! Hot dogs? Awesome.

 

[jskibo]

I love corn dogs. Do not use that as an expletive.

Dip it right in the mustard jar… Frenchs!

Not good timing, sounds like someone took a Grey Poopon @ATN_Pilot

 

[Deleted member 27505]

I've taken two legs to get somewhere in order to avoid a single leg on SWA. To each his own.

Why all the animus for SWA?
That's a serious question. I'm not trying to call you out. I'd just really like to know. Do you have history with the company? Are there salient issues of which I am unaware? ??

 

[jskibo]

Why all the animus for SWA?
That's a serious question. I'm not trying to call you out. I'd just really like to know. Do you have history with the company? Are there salient issues of which I am unaware? ??

:stir:


Where's the popcorn one?

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Why all the animus for SWA? That's a serious question. I'm not trying to call you out. I'd just really like to know. Do you have history with the company? Are there salient issues of which I am unaware? ??

Is that sarcasm? Or is there really someone around here who doesn't know? Have you been living under a rock for the past five years?

 

[derg]

Are there cookies under the rock?

 

[Deleted member 27505]

MOST of the rules are written in blood, by someone with WAY more experience, or lastly, insurance requirements. I have a VERY hard time believing that a self proclaimed(possibly even verified) Bob Hoover of *insert aircraft* would ever possibly know better. For an airshow, probably, getting from A-B in the safest possible manner in any condition? I HIGHLY doubt it.

I see it EVERYDAY in freight. "It's just freight". No, the company wants you to fly the airplane this way! I, as your boss, DEMAND you fly this way as well or else you'll get a stern talking to and a passive aggressive email!

Bob Hoover can fly the ever living crap out of a commander, but I'm willing to bet all of my pay that he would operate the same plane the way that central air cargo wants it operated in that environment.

Yes, there is some design in training and the SOP to accommodate the lowest common denominator. Why be the lowest common denominator though? Or why fly like a crotch pheasant? The stereotypes outside of 121 make me SO mad because the intent is there, but there is still enough buttholes out there to perpetuate it.

I see ZERO difference between 121/135/91 as a pilot. There isn't really, when it comes down to it. If you're being paid to fly, be professional. Want to blast music? Do it in your own plane, on your own time. Or while you're flipping burgers. Even then, do it at your own grill, on your own time

I think you missed my point. I'm not saying to go out and do stupid stuff, violate FARs or flagrantly disregard safety. I don't believe you'll find any post I've ever made that would suggest otherwise. I'm saying that one can have fun and still be safe and operate within prescribed and proscribed bounds.

The issue is how those bounds are pre- and proscribed by various operators. Some operators require a formal uniform, some an informal one, and some none at all. Some companies have op specs that read almost like computer code. Others have op specs that respect the intent of the regs while granting the crew wide latitude to act as agents of the company and support the company's mission and values. All things being roughly equal (price, schedule, etc.) most folks will choose a fun, relaxed, service-rich customer experience over a dour, regimented customer experience. Southwest encourages its employees to have fun and create a fun customer experience. Does that sometimes get hokey? Sure. But dangerous? I don't think so. Any human performance study will show you that someone in a flow state of eustress is far more alert, adaptive, and effective at preventing and dealing with threats and risks than someone who is stressed and/or acting solely in accordance with a checklist or rule book. Based only on my personal experience as a customer, I would argue that the eustress state of the typical SWA cabin (crew and pax) probably makes it a safer place than the cabins of many other airlines I've flown. (No, I'm not shilling for SWA).

I absolutely agree with your zero delta 121/135/91 statement as far as flying the airplane goes.

As far as blasting music in "your own plane"... Because of the nature of the Captain's position, especially when granted agency aegis, the captain does, for the duration of the flight in a de facto sense, own the plane, and is encouraged (at least it seems at SWA) to act accordingly in furtherance of the company's goals and values.

 

[Deleted member 27505]

Is that sarcasm? Or is there really someone around here who doesn't know? Have you been living under a rock for the past five years?

Nope, it was sincere. I was a geology major.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Nope, it was sincere. I was a geology major.

1. SWA's product sucks, and has contributed to the decline in the quality of US air carrier product quality for over three decades.

2. SWAPA has been dragging down pilot contracts for decades.

3. SWAPA won't even join forces with CAPA, let alone ALPA. Horrible for the profession.

4. Woefully unprofessional operation. FAs dressed like camp counsellors? Singing over the PA during safety announcements? Cattle call for boarding? Disgraceful.

Those were my reasons before the merger. I'd venture to say that my reasons after the merger are pretty obvious.

 

[BobDDuck]

Nope, it was sincere. I was a geology major.

The after the merger part he is skipping...

He was a Trannie, in the end, during the SLI, they ended up bargaining with southwest management (instead of SWAPA, which is kind of strange) were threatened with shut down if they didn't take a pretty poor integration deal, and agreed to it, despite the possibility of a very good legal challenge if the shutdown threat went through.

 

[ozziecat35]

-????
-Profit?

No no no, no room for that.

I don't hesitate to fly on SWA. I don't jumpseat so I can't comment there. The kitchy PA's they do before pushback or during I think can help hold people's attention, but only just. It's easy to go past the annoying line and I've seen it go both ways. I'm a pretty easy going guy, and Todd and I have our disagreements, but in the end, he's free to his opinions as I am to mine. Now you may feel the ground shake here shortly but I actually agree that in this instance, it was unprofessional, and not needed.

 

[Boris Badenov]

To be fair, the average SWA passenger has the attention span of an ADHD gnat, so you could make a strong argument that being incredibly irritating is a safety device.