Civil Air Patrol Arizona

bc2209

bc2209

Well-Known Member
I'm interested in exploring CAP.

Do we have any members that belong in Phoenix or Arizona?
 
Word of warning from a former CAP member of nearly 25 years. I hold nearly every SAR rating they have. I am a ground team leader, ground team trainer, ground branch director, mission pilot, Wing staff, etc etc etc....

I finally quit the organization after the absolute Mongolian cluster frack that it has become got too much. I could write a book of the things I saw. Everything from people impersonating war heroes (who never served a day in the actual service), to idiot members storm trooping around in uniform demanding Air Force enlisted render salutes. The theft, and illegal activity. Do a search for court cases involving CAP, you'll be surprised at the number of times the organization has been sued.

Then there are the Mission pilots wearing combat insignia and gear. One idiot mission observer wore, I kid you not, nearly 50 lbs of survival gear on a SAR mission in the mountains on a near 100 degree day. Wanted to make sure "he would be comfortable in a survival situation". This with a crew of 4 in a 206 in the mountains above 10,000 feet.

Then the constant political bull spit. Guys who couldn't lead their way out of wet paper bags in charge of squadrons. The back biting by adult members. Old pilots who band together to keep new members from access to the aircraft. Old pilots who have no business being in the cockpit never mind driving a car, yet are flying a bunch of screaming kids around. Guys way overweight who strut around the airport in flight suits they had to have adjusted to GP Medium size so they could squeeze their fat azz in and look cool like they are fighter pilots.

Then the guys who can't follow simple rules for airport operations and when you point this out they say "we are the Air Force, we can do what we want". Then there is the complete inability to follow the rules or very clear manuals.

Then all the parents of the snot nose little kids who want to know why little johnny isn't a General yet, 6 months after they join the organization. The fact that no local community wants them involved in any actual emergency. I know sheriff departments who refuse to allow them access to missions due to the imbecilic nature of the group.

But the number 1 issue that burns the crap out of me is all the idiots running around say "were the Air Force, we don't have to work with anyone else, we do it our way and they can work with us".

I'd like to see the whole organization disbanded. I hate seeing my tax dollars spend so needlessly. It used to be a great organization where leaders were made. Now its a clown car skit.

There is a member here at JC that has a tag line that says "CAP: Renegade Band of Degenerate Homosexuals". Truer words were never written.
 
av8tr1 said:
Word of warning from a former CAP member of nearly 25 years. I hold nearly every SAR rating they have. I am a ground team leader, ground team trainer, ground branch director, mission pilot, Wing staff, etc etc etc....

I finally quit the organization after the absolute Mongolian cluster frack that it has become got too much. I could write a book of the things I saw. Everything from people impersonating war heroes (who never served a day in the actual service), to idiot members storm trooping around in uniform demanding Air Force enlisted render salutes. The theft, and illegal activity. Do a search for court cases involving CAP, you'll be surprised at the number of times the organization has been sued.

Then there are the Mission pilots wearing combat insignia and gear. One idiot mission observer wore, I kid you not, nearly 50 lbs of survival gear on a SAR mission in the mountains on a near 100 degree day. Wanted to make sure "he would be comfortable in a survival situation". This with a crew of 4 in a 206 in the mountains above 10,000 feet.

Then the constant political bull spit. Guys who couldn't lead their way out of wet paper bags in charge of squadrons. The back biting by adult members. Old pilots who band together to keep new members from access to the aircraft. Old pilots who have no business being in the cockpit never mind driving a car, yet are flying a bunch of screaming kids around. Guys way overweight who strut around the airport in flight suits they had to have adjusted to GP Medium size so they could squeeze their fat azz in and look cool like they are fighter pilots.

Then the guys who can't follow simple rules for airport operations and when you point this out they say "we are the Air Force, we can do what we want". Then there is the complete inability to follow the rules or very clear manuals.

Then all the parents of the snot nose little kids who want to know why little johnny isn't a General yet, 6 months after they join the organization. The fact that no local community wants them involved in any actual emergency. I know sheriff departments who refuse to allow them access to missions due to the imbecilic nature of the group.

But the number 1 issue that burns the crap out of me is all the idiots running around say "were the Air Force, we don't have to work with anyone else, we do it our way and they can work with us".

I'd like to see the whole organization disbanded. I hate seeing my tax dollars spend so needlessly. It used to be a great organization where leaders were made. Now its a clown car skit.

There is a member here at JC that has a tag line that says "CAP: Renegade Band of Degenerate Homosexuals". Truer words were never written.
Click to expand...

Damn. Unfortunate to hear but glad I did.

Thank you
 
av8tr1 said:
Word of warning from a former CAP member of nearly 25 years. I hold nearly every SAR rating they have. I am a ground team leader, ground team trainer, ground branch director, mission pilot, Wing staff, etc etc etc....
Click to expand...

All a great view of the organization... But, I'd like to add that it is still an opportunity that you should pursue and make your own decision on.

I'm not going to dispute any of the problems that @av8tr1 has pointed out. I am, however, going to say that the program is run by people that aren't getting paid. And the most vocal and entrenched people within the organization are those that are getting exactly what they want out of it... Free flying, being in a position of "authority", etc.

I have been a member of CAP for about 5 years now and can say that it is what you make of it. I have put in a lot of effort to be involved in many different facets of the group, including help organize and staff one of the national flight academies for a couple years. I recently relocated, due to retiring from the Navy, and have had to begin anew in another state, where CAP operates a bit differently. It has created another learning curve, and provided more obstacles to over come.

I toyed with the idea of backing out. After all, I don't need the CAP. But, I'd rather put in the effort and try to become the squeaky wheel to point out some of the deficiencies I might find. It's all about putting yourself in touch with the right people, in the right positions, and learning exactly what their thoughts on the matter are... Hopefully you might be able to provide a better way.

Within a month of transferring into one of the local squadrons here in Washington, I've been placed in a place of "authority" and am working on meeting with the right people to discuss things that happen within the state. It's actually been quite easy to become deeply involved in the day-to-day, with hopes of making a difference within the organization.

The advice I would give you... Don't listen to either me or @av8tr1. Get out there and visit some of the squadrons. Don't stop at one, visit several. Seriously talk to the squadron commanders and ask questions that will help you determine whether it is the right fit for you. It took me four squadrons here in Washington before I found one that I felt was right for me.
 
bc2209 said:
Any other good volunteering organizations focused around aviation in the Phoenix area?
Click to expand...

Mesa wing of the CAF is huge out there and stays pretty busy. You are far less likely to get poked fun at wearing the flight suit while getting out of a T6 than a 172. ;)

Edit - as KS already mentioned
 
@av8tr1 Sig!

I'm torn about CAP. In Colorado, it'd be a good mission and there are always hikers getting lost that need finding.

But the uniforms, the rules, the "pretending to be Air Force" thing...really grinds me the wrong way. I think CAP needs some freshening up with young, mission-oriented blood.
 
I was a member of a cadet squadron in Georgia more than 25 years ago.

It had very little to do with aviation. Most of the kids wanted to be SEALs, Force Recon and/or Mercs. It was a bigoted, hateful collection of kids led by people who were well-intentioned but ultimately incompetent; think "Stanford Prison Experiment" writ large. During the annual Encampment I saw pretty much everything from my squadron replicated among the rest of them from around the state and region.

I know there are probably "good" CAP units out there, but I've never seen one, personally.
 
killbilly said:
I was a member of a cadet squadron in Georgia more than 25 years ago.

It had very little to do with aviation. Most of the kids wanted to be SEALs, Force Recon and/or Mercs. It was a bigoted, hateful collection of kids led by people who were well-intentioned but ultimately incompetent; think "Stanford Prison Experiment" writ large. During the annual Encampment I saw pretty much everything from my squadron replicated among the rest of them from around the state and region.

I know there are probably "good" CAP units out there, but I've never seen one, personally.
Click to expand...

Was Josh Duggar a member? :)
 
I joined a squadron here in Florida a couple of years ago . . . nice people all around but some of their systems leave much to be desired . . . I still cannot be get checked off on the initial Level 1 Foundation course (which you need to complete first before you can move on to your desired track) because it´s a computer based system that both the squadron commander and training officer hardly understand. I think the mission of CAP is loable but they sure as hell make it hard for volunteers who may want to spend their time not dealing with some of the bureaucratic govmt crap that I've seen already.
 
NewYorkophile said:
@av8tr1 Sig!

I'm torn about CAP. In Colorado, it'd be a good mission and there are always hikers getting lost that need finding.

But the uniforms, the rules, the "pretending to be Air Force" thing...really grinds me the wrong way. I think CAP needs some freshening up with young, mission-oriented blood.
Click to expand...

Heh, I was a member in Colorado. Not one single local law enforcement unit wanted anything to do with CAP. Not one single SAR group would give them the time of day because CAP has limitations on the terrian they can work. So no mountain work for CAP ground teams.

How stupid is that in Colorado.

Everyone else in Colorado follows the Nasar certification but CAP refuses to follow it because their "the Air Force" and can do it however they want.
 
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