Navy T-45C Goes For A Swim

[A Life Aloft]

SAN DIEGO — A Navy T-45C jet assigned to Training Squadron 9 from Meridian, Miss., ran off the end of a runway at North Island Naval Air Station at roughly 2 p.m. today.

The pilot ejected safely from the aircraft and was being evaluated at a hospital.

Local mariners safely recovered the pilot from San Diego Bay.

The aircraft was conducting routine training in advance of aircraft carrier landing qualifications.

A safety investigation will be carried out to determine the cause of the accident, Navy officials said.

The Navy is currently working to recover the aircraft.

Bejebus, hope he's okay.

 

[Old Dominion Flyer]

Does the military have a publicly accessible database for incidents/accidents, like the NTSB database? I see these things in the news but never hear about the findings. @MikeD

 

[///AMG]

Does the military have a publicly accessible database for incidents/accidents, like the NTSB database? I see these things in the news but never hear about the findings. @MikeD

nope. we absolutely do not release SIR findings. Some of the higher profile accidents yield FOUO access to our JAGMAN (legal investigation which is completely separate, often not the same, and publicly releasable). I think Kara Hultgreen's SIR was leaked to the public but that is about it. I think the USAF is a little more liberal, but I might just be ignorant of their process (ie the ones I've seen on the internet might be the equivalent of our legal investigation).

 

[A Life Aloft]

At what rate of speed and how high does that seat shoot your ass up and out? Was the "bang" that the witnesses heard, the canopy blowing off?

 

[///AMG]

At what rate of speed and how high does that seat shoot your ass up and out? Was the "bang" that the witnesses heard, the canopy blowing off?

never done it but I have flown on NACES (and more recently ACES II) seats all my life, and they are 0/0. As for how fast the seat goes, I don't really know, it is fast enough. There are weight restrictions, ie a low and a high limit. The low weight limit is associated with flail/tumbling injury probability, and the high weight (normally around 230, ie fat status for most body types) is associated with not clearing the vertical stab. On deck, as I am assuming this ejection took place, my guess is that the guy clears the tail by a pretty small margin.......also I am guessing this was a low speed ejection (which maybe or maybe does not affect that clearance....not sure of the aerodynamics involved there), based on a lot of assumptions that I won't write here.

 

[hook_dupin]

nope. we absolutely do not release SIR findings. Some of the higher profile accidents yield FOUO access to our JAGMAN (legal investigation which is completely separate, often not the same, and publicly releasable). I think Kara Hultgreen's SIR was leaked to the public but that is about it. I think the USAF is a little more liberal, but I might just be ignorant of their process (ie the ones I've seen on the internet might be the equivalent of our legal investigation).

It's ok, I speak Jive....


The AF's Safety Investigation Board (SIB) is the same as your SIR and our Accident Investigation Board (AIB) is the same as your JAGMAN. The SIB stays within safety channels while the AIB is often releasable in some form and can be the basis for military justice or civil cases.



There are a couple of sections in Title 10 (10 USC 2254 & 2255) that lay out what gets to be public as part of a military aircraft accident investigation, so hence the similar structure.

 

[A Life Aloft]

never done it but I have flown on NACES (and more recently ACES II) seats all my life, and they are 0/0. As for how fast the seat goes, I don't really know, it is fast enough. There are weight restrictions, ie a low and a high limit. The low weight limit is associated with flail/tumbling injury probability, and the high weight (normally around 230, ie fat status for most body types) is associated with not clearing the vertical stab. On deck, as I am assuming this ejection took place, my guess is that the guy clears the tail by a pretty small margin.......also I am guessing this was a low speed ejection (which maybe or maybe does not affect that clearance....not sure of the aerodynamics involved there), based on a lot of assumptions that I won't write here.

Thanks! I was also thinking/wondering that if he was landing when he ejected that he must be pretty lucky to have cleared his plane. But I know zip about ejections in any fighters or trainers, really. How long in time does it take or the entire ejection sequence until you are shot out? I assume we are talking less than a minute?

 

[MikeD]

I was at NZY the last time this happened in 2004 with an F/A-18 that was diverting into there from the boat. At night on the transient line with a broken jet, when this guy landed, couldn't stop, missed the departure end (long field, for you Navy types) A-gear and went for a swim in the bay.

 

[MikeD]

Thanks! I was also thinking/wondering that if he was landing when he ejected that he must be pretty lucky to have cleared his plane. But I know zip about ejections in any fighters or trainers, really. How long in time does it take or the entire ejection sequence until you are shot out? I assume we are talking less than a minute?

We're talking less than a couple seconds. From activation, to canopy jettison, to seat going up the rails. Has to be, in order to make low altitude ejections possible.

 

[MikeD]

Does the military have a publicly accessible database for incidents/accidents, like the NTSB database? I see these things in the news but never hear about the findings. @MikeD

@hook_dupin covered it already. The AIB used to be known as the Collateral Board back in the day. I've worked both boards as both Investigating Officer, and Pilot Member. SIB is your white hat guys, while AIB is your black hat guys.

To put it in layman's terms, the Safety Board or SIB works to find the safety cause of the accident. The AIB works to find blame.

Funny thing is, these are two completely separate accident investigations done by two completely separate boards.....the SIB first, and when they're complete, the AIB. The only thing the SIB shares with the AIB is the non-privileged information from their investigation. But even so, each board can potentially come up with substantially different findings, and hence, different conclusions.......from the SAME accident. Interesting that.

 

[MikeD]

SAN DIEGO — A Navy T-45C jet assigned to Training Squadron 9 from Meridian, Miss., ran off the end of a runway at North Island Naval Air Station at roughly 2 p.m. today.

The pilot ejected safely from the aircraft and was being evaluated at a hospital.

Local mariners safely recovered the pilot from San Diego Bay.

The aircraft was conducting routine training in advance of aircraft carrier landing qualifications.

A safety investigation will be carried out to determine the cause of the accident, Navy officials said.

The Navy is currently working to recover the aircraft.

Bejebus, hope he's okay.

Looks like someone is going to SWO school now.......

 

[///AMG]

I was at NZY the last time this happened in 2004 with an F/A-18 that was diverting into there from the boat. At night on the transient line with a broken jet, when this guy landed, couldn't stop, missed the departure end (long field, for you Navy types) A-gear and went for a swim in the bay.

floating hornet

 

[A Life Aloft]

We're talking less than a couple seconds. From activation, to canopy jettison, to seat going up the rails. Has to be, in order to make low altitude ejections possible.

Thanks, Mike!

 

[A Life Aloft]

Navy lifted her out and the pilot is supposedly fine. Good news.

The best part of the latest article was, "While most of the plane appears intact, the canopy did fly off." Ya think?

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/Pilot-Forced-to-Eject-in-Coronado-Landing-304761211.html

 

[MikeD]

Navy lifted her out and the pilot is supposedly fine. Good news.

The best part of the latest article was, "While most of the plane appears intact, the canopy did fly off." Ya think?

Going to be one heck of a corrosion control problem. I don't think the F/A-18 that I saw in 2004 ever flew again. I think it went to the NADEP storage there.

 

[A Life Aloft]

Going to be one heck of a corrosion control problem. I don't think the F/A-18 that I saw in 2004 ever flew again. I think it went to the NADEP storage there.

That was going to be my next question, actually....... depending on the physical damage, let alone the sea water, if it is repairable or not. With all the systems/electronics, engine, seems rather doubtful, I guess. I wonder if we'll ever know what happened. That is, did he have issues with the aircraft, or did he just cock up the landing. Either way, I'm glad he's okay.

 

[PositionAndHold]

It's ok, I speak Jive....

This might be the greatest start to a reply I've ever seen on here. I award you all the internet points for the day.

 

[Roger Roger]

That was going to be my next question, actually....... depending on the physical damage, let alone the sea water, if it is repairable or not. With all the systems/electronics, engine, seems rather doubtful, I guess. I wonder if we'll ever know what happened. That is, did he have issues with the aircraft, or did he just cock up the landing. Either way, I'm glad he's okay.

Hey we were running a 206 that had been sunk upside down in 60 feet of saltwater then rebuilt over 5 years by an assortment of mechanics using everything from a calibrated squirrel to a jar of bondo.

 

[bunk22]

I was at NZY the last time this happened in 2004 with an F/A-18 that was diverting into there from the boat. At night on the transient line with a broken jet, when this guy landed, couldn't stop, missed the departure end (long field, for you Navy types) A-gear and went for a swim in the bay.

I know that pilot, jet wasn't broken I did a JAG on another mishap of his later on.

The canopy doesn't fly off the Goshawk either, it shatters.

 

[ahw01]

Why eject if you can step out, or is that quite tricky?