A little trouble with landings -- From a Student

Place a mark on the windshield that represents your flight path and then when you turn final just lock that mark on your aim point and then you only have to adjust power as required to keep a good glide path/descent rate until you cross the threshold. This is when you transition your focus to the end of the runway/horizon and bring that mark smoothly to the horizon (round out) while slowly reducing power to idle. After this, just continue to increase the mark above the horizon (flare) as the plane begins to settle and sink toward the runway while focusing on the far end of the runway/horizon the whole time and letting your peripheral vision judge runway vertical closure. The goal is to allow the plane to ever so slowly sink toward the runway with the use of pitch to control the descent rate. Once you land you should continue to hold back pressure in the yoke and use rudder pressure to keep the plane rolling out on centerline.
The mark helps you see pitch change and it sort of makes a poor man's HUD on the windshield. To set properly you must be in level flight and then place the mark so that it is directly on the horizon. This will give you an Attitude Indicator on your windscreen. It is common for new pilots to have the pitch changing, thus making the approach unstable, and not even being aware of this because they don't have a good way to see or measure pitch change. The only problem now is getting an instructor to show you this.
 
Thank you all so much for your suggestions. Unfortunately, my flight today got canceled because of MX, but I'm looking forward to trying all of these suggestions out and talking it over more with my CFI. I'll post back my results.

Thanks again!
 
Like everyone has said already...just relax, it will come. Eventually, all the pieces will fall into place for you. People told me the same thing when I felt desperate for tips & tricks to help me disect what I was doing wrong when learning to land, but really, you just have to keep practicing until it happens for you...and it will, just keep after it and try not to get discouraged.

However, in the technical department, if I can offer any tips, it would be a stabilized approach airspeed, and trim for it...hang in there, you will figure out what works for you.
 
This one time, I was flying with a Navy friend who hadn't had much time in 172's and the like. We taxied onto the runway, and when ready to takeoff I threw the yoke forward and said I was pitching for airspeed. Needless to say, we gained no airspeed, didn't take off, and he didn't laugh. Pitch for airspeed sucked at that point.
Click to expand...

That isn't technically correct but you can go read our 40 page long discussion or whatever it was on that. Instead I will leave with this, I don't know what you crazy pilots were taught, rudder controls altitude!
Click to expand...

The first one is funny.

I dont really want to read a 40 page discussion I will just take your word for it. The fact that pitch controls airspeed when power is fixed is a quote from the complete advanced pilot. Again I can see where it isn't technically correct but my instructor always used to say pitch for airspeed and use throttle to control your altitude. Example.. if I want to slow from 110 to 90 pitch up to slow and retard the throttle to prevent a altitude gain.. maybe that's not technically correct but that way of teaching worked well for me.. Maybe I do need to read that 40 page discussion though do you have a link?
 
Jbroz04 said:
Maybe I do need to read that 40 page discussion though do you have a link?
Click to expand...
Save yourself the hour of your life.

Funny thing is I could take your comment:

"Example.. if I want to slow from 110 to 90 pitch up to slow and retard the throttle to prevent a altitude gain..."

and make it say this:

"Example.. if I wanted to slow from 110 to 90 retard the throttle to slow and pitch up to prevent a altitude loss..."

So, basically there is more than one way to skin a cat but both schools of thought basically do the same thing. The difference is how your brain processes the cause and effect. Technique is all personal preference and as long as it is safe and gets the desired outcome then more power to ya.
 
Subpilot I was actually thinking that same thing when I walking through sams club last night. I realized hey you could explain it the other way around to. I guess I just like the way I was taught it.
 
Oh yeah, I totally understand. I think to each his/her own. I just have a hard time when people tell me that my way is mathematically incorrect. My best reply when someone wants to get into a heated argument about this in person is to state "there is a pitch/power relationship and you must manage both to be successful."
 
I still have some crap landings here and there but most have gone to the better side. It just took time and practice to get them right. You'll be low on some, high on a few and then you'll realize what you need to see. Airspeeds are key for me. Too much and you'll float and BAM! Too little airspeed and you still go give yourself a spinal injury. Get it right on and you'll be golden. :D Good luck and be safe out there!

RD
 
Jbroz04 said:
I realized hey you could explain it the other way around to.
Click to expand...

Only on the front side of the power curve. Because the yoke and throttle are moving in the same direction, both moving forward or both moving backwards to speed up or slow down, it's easy to get confused about which control is doing what, and not enormously important.

Not so on the back side of the power curve, because the controls need to move in opposite directions. If you try to slow down by retarding the throttle and pitching for altitude, you'll just end up with a continually decaying airspeed and altitude loss, followed eventually by a stall.

The same thing is likely to happen when trying to increase airspeed, if you try to repair altitude deviations with the yoke. If you're low and slow on short final, you may mush into the ground or have a stall/spin accident.
 
Hey Matt.

It sounds like you are shying away from the ground. In other words, you know you are supposed to be going down but you just can't quite bring yourself to let the nose down and point the airplane at the ground.

Ask you instructor to let you do some low passes down the runway (uncontrolled field of course). Get used to being low to the ground and "fast".

I did it, I had many students who did it, and it helps.

The real secret to landings is not trying. Fly on speed, on centerline and have the airplane aligned with the runway centerline and cross at 50 feet or so and everything else will work out just fine.
 
400A said:
Hey Matt.

It sounds like you are shying away from the ground. In other words, you know you are supposed to be going down but you just can't quite bring yourself to let the nose down and point the airplane at the ground.

Ask you instructor to let you do some low passes down the runway (uncontrolled field of course). Get used to being low to the ground and "fast".

I did it, I had many students who did it, and it helps.

The real secret to landings is not trying. Fly on speed, on centerline and have the airplane aligned with the runway centerline and cross at 50 feet or so and everything else will work out just fine.
Click to expand...

I think you're right. This is a great idea (it even sounds fun). I'll ask if we can head out to Agua Dulce (L70) and do some low passes. Thanks! :D
 
for the sight picture maybe have your instructor sit on the tail, and crank your seat up or down till you hit the right sight picture
 
So I think I figured it out. This is going to sound so stupid.

I didn't realize the full available travel of the yoke when pulling back and "holding it".

Now that I'm actually pulling the yoke into my stomach, my landings are no longer 3 pointers.

I have no idea why I wasn't doing this. I think it was masked by the fact that my approaches were and still often are too high and that's why I couldn't figure it out.

At any rate, the lightbulb turned on and I'm progressing in my ability to land an airplane.
 
Good!
Congrats

Edit: there will be many more light bulbs to come, even when you are positive you know everything.
 
EGGSALAD!!!! Now, stop thinking about greasing the landings and just do it, and watch your confidence and skill sky rocket.


Keep up the good work!
 
My advice is to not force it, working on it will slowly bring it to something acceptable. I know that I was bad at landing the airplane when I first started. I was convinced each and every time that I was going to miss, that I was short, things like that. As I got more comfortable and familiar with flying, my landings improved.

So, what I think is that this is perfectly normal and you just need to get more comfortable with the aircraft.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top