Hey guys just a quick questions, I'm trying to get the general consensus about when to drop the gear/flaps on a single engine ILS and a normal pattern. It seems like everyone has their own way of doing it. My instructor now is telling me on a single engine ILS that gear and flaps 10 (seneca if it makes a difference) down by the outer marker. In the pattern I am being told that gear comes down on downwind but again I hear some people say final or base to delay the drag. Just trying to see some other opinions on this. Thanks.
Single engine ops on a multi
- Thread starter sampson
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29.92inHg
Well-Known Member
It really depends on the plane, but in general I drop the gear on the ILS the same time I would on a two engine approach (outer marker). If it is straight in then you should be okay. If it is a circle to land or a nonprecision I bring the gear up if it is already down, or wait to drop it until I am ready to start the final decent from MDA or the pattern (basically abeam the numbers) In the end, it comes down to not having to level off or climb with gear and flaps down on one engine. They don't do too well then. Also in a practical sense, If the plane isn't performing well emough to hold the glideslope reduce the drag.
one mans opinion
one mans opinion
dasleben
That's just, like, your opinion, man
I agree. You want to treat a single-engine approach like a normal approach as much as possible.
In the Seneca I teach gear down and flaps 25 at glideslope intercept. Same configuration as a normal ILS. If you are at a high density altitude, you might consider waiting on the flaps. But it really requires you to use your own judgment for the conditions.
For what it's worth, the Emergency Procedures of the Seneca manual says "Do not extend landing gear until certain of making field. Do not lower wing flaps until certain of making field."
ppragman
FLIPY FLAPS!
Welllllllll, the gear don't cause that much drag compared to the Flaps at the fairly low speeds of an approach, so I say drop the gear fairly early (somewhere between the initial fix and the final approach fix preferably closer to the initial unless you'd have to drive 45miles with the gear out) so you don't forget to throw the lever later if things get extra dicey as you come in. Take that with a grain of salt however, as I haven't flown a twin in awhile.
deadstick
Well-Known Member
This is key so that a SE landing does not turn into a gear-up landing. If you can't hold altitude at MDA, bring it up. Just ensure you put it back down. With that said, take note as to whether the EPs restrict the amount of flaps when SE.
The plane can be easily reused if you make a controlled SE landing (not too fast/high and the engine gets fixed) without full flaps, but the same doesn't hold true for the gear.
Baronman
Well-Known Member
I don't think I'd be dropping the gear till I was descending....Let's say Glide Slope Intercept.
No reason to try to be flying level with flaps and gear out on a Single Engine.
Plus I think it makes for the smoothest transition. The more you have to add/reduce power, the more the plane is out of trim and you're struggling. By adding the gear as you begin your descent, you make a relatively small power adjustment...
No reason to try to be flying level with flaps and gear out on a Single Engine.
Plus I think it makes for the smoothest transition. The more you have to add/reduce power, the more the plane is out of trim and you're struggling. By adding the gear as you begin your descent, you make a relatively small power adjustment...
Baronman
Well-Known Member
As far as where to drop the gear in a normal pattern (Visual) I'd say the same thing. Drop the gear when you intercept a visual 3 degree path. I'd stay as high as possible, then the goal is a constant 3 degree descent in with the gear coming down at intercept. I'm trying to avoid having to level off somewhere far out on a base leg with the gear and flaps out and on a single engine.
///AMG
Well-Known Member
In my aircraft we do a low oil / engine malfunction precautionary instrument approach profile that might carry over pretty well to this (though we are single engine). Power is set at a fixed setting (for us it is an N2 setting of 80-odd % which prolongs the seizure of a dying jet) and we use speedbrakes to maintain airspeed just below gear speed. In a twin with an engine out, I'd imagine you could just use max continuous on the remaining prop and have similar results w/o using drag devices in level flight being boxed around by ATC. From there we wait until up and on glidepath and then drop gear, slats and half flaps, using speedbrakes/boards to maintain a fairly high approach speed while flying the glideslope with the nose. For us this ensures we are within the safe ejection envelope in case the motor shiats itself, for a twin this would ensure you have some extra smack on the airplane in case you get low on glideslope and have to get up while maintaining above Vmc. You can of course modulate flaps and gear on the way down if things get off profile, but I would not drop full flaps or pull any power until the runway is made in any case. I'd want to have as much energy on the aircraft as possible at DH in case I have to go missed. Also runway length would of course be a consideration for how soon to dirty and slow up. I'd hold the extra speed coming into an 8 or 10k ft runway, but anything below that and I'd be a little bit more conservative on how fast I came into the short end of the runway at.
R
Roger, Roger
Guest
Keep everything as normal as possible.
Unless of course you are a new multi student.
Then you leave full power in, forget to extend gear and flaps until very short final, and come in at about 140 knots. Then, when you see the runway, you do one of 2 things: 1) pull power to idle and start flaring, resulting in the stall warning horn going off at 50' AGL or 2) keep your speed about 40 knots above what you should and nearly float off the end of the runway.
Unless of course you are a new multi student.
Then you leave full power in, forget to extend gear and flaps until very short final, and come in at about 140 knots. Then, when you see the runway, you do one of 2 things: 1) pull power to idle and start flaring, resulting in the stall warning horn going off at 50' AGL or 2) keep your speed about 40 knots above what you should and nearly float off the end of the runway.
adk
Steals Hotel Toilet Paper
I was taught in the Seminole to drop the gear whenever the plane is on its final descent to land. This means glideslope intercept on an ILS or when leaving MDA on a nonprecision (abeam the touchdown point in the pattern). I suspect, though, that this is only applicable to the Seminole since it is the three-legged Basset Hound of single engine performance. Single engine service ceiling of 1600 on a hot day ... gotta love it!
Had no comment, read this before you came in to mock me. All I have to say sir, grow up.
*sigh*
http://forums.jetcareers.com/faq.php?faq=vb_faq#faq_rules
...specifically:
Oh, and we aren't going to do any "...but HE said blah blah blah - HE started it!" stuff 'cause:
Finally:
You guys (plural) need to get past your little personal fued. Either kiss and make up or just ignore each other.
http://forums.jetcareers.com/faq.php?faq=vb_faq#faq_rules
...specifically:
Oh, and we aren't going to do any "...but HE said blah blah blah - HE started it!" stuff 'cause:
Finally:
You guys (plural) need to get past your little personal fued. Either kiss and make up or just ignore each other.
Had no comment, read this before you came in to mock me. All I have to say sir, grow up.
Now who is following who around!.?
And I aint kissin you either!