zmiller4
Well-Known Member
Interstate routes prior to deregulation.
Challenger Truckee
- Thread starter Boris Badenov
- Start date
Interstate routes prior to deregulation.
Skåning
Well-Known Member
What kind of retirement plans do you guys have?
Most airlines now have a 16+% contribution (not a match, you dont have to put anything in)
That's a lot of dough over a long career.
BEEF SUPREME
Well-Known Member
DE727UPS
Well-Known Member
Brown has a pension and what they call a defined contribution plan that puts 12% into a fund like a 401K. Also, most guys do the optional non-matching 401K. You have to be 60 years old and 30 years of service to qualify for the full pension. 4K (ish) times number of years of service.
KLB
Well-Known Member
That's their argument, but even that is something that they can take if there is a downturn in the industry. Look at how pensions were gutted post 9-11.
I'm averaging 350-375 hrs a year with a lot of off time. My current contract rate 2000 bucks a day as much as 2500 bucks a day international. There is such a shortage of pilots that I have about as much contract as I want to handle l. So in the end, (at the moment) I can make up in that contribution with contract flying.
Autothrust Blue
"Well, on the Brasilia..."
🦈💜
All dragon~
FWIW my pay is ~$170/hr, and goes up a fair bit in January.
It's nothing huge, and I can't really move forward at this rate, but survival is doable at least.
Autothrust Blue
"Well, on the Brasilia..."
I mean, I’d certainly hope so.
///AMG
Well-Known Member
I agree with your sentiment. Though from a practical perspective on the topic of an isolated industry downturn, you at least get to keep what you already have in the 401K (assuming it isn't also suffering major losses), rather than potentially losing a pension forever and starting over. But you are right about the inherent risk of a market based retirement plan. That is one of my current homework problems.....trying to figure out my strategy to ensure that I am not reliant on 401k funds.
KLB
Well-Known Member
I am betting on myself in thar aspect. There is a vulnerability on both sides. My hope is that the airline industry continues to crush it so that I can leverage what is happening on the airline side for my compensation. A lot of my buddies who have been ln on the corporate side for years have made the transition. This has only strengthened my negotiations for increased salary at my full-time gig and the contracting on the side...I have morals. But some operators are in such dire strates that they can't help but pay whatever price that give them.
And what % of your take-home goes to the costs of doing your job? It’s pretty nice that if I need anything it goes on the corporate card. And when I’m done work it’s a quick drive or not as quick bike ride home. We might not have nonrev benefits but our last vacation was with hotel and airline points I get to keep. Look, we all have jobs nicer than 90% of the country…but the “mine is better” argument from a certain someone gets a touch old. There are pluses and minuses to everything.
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
I just said big 6, I didn't differentiate it.
IMO, the big 6 are legacy carriers plus Southwest, which is big enough (and close enough) to meet the definition.
AA, DL, UA, SW, AS, HA
Heck, even before 9/11. Just ask A Life Aloft about UAL in ‘95/‘96 and their Employee Stock Option Program, and how that all went. What a crazy story. In his own words quoted below from the Purple TA thread
“..........what a special time that was. So if you lucky to have a job with us employees, just take even more benefit and pay cuts than you already have, plus eat more work rule concessions, we'll make you "owner-employees" of this wonderful airline by giving you stock options that won't be worth the price of a box of kleenex when you try to sell them down the road, and we're also going to furlough even more of you at all levels and then file for bankruptcy in the nearish future anyways. The ESOP as it turned out, was created to fund the buyout of Stephen Wolf. Surprise surprise. My brother used his stock certificates to wallpaper part of a wall in his garage where his hand tools hung. I and two other pilots held a Viking type funeral for ours at the lagoon in Long Beach.”
BEEF SUPREME
Well-Known Member
I had a fairly basic bitch 2 day trip yesterday and today. Drove my car 35 minutes to SEA. I'm assuming you pay for your car too and your company pays for parking. So we'll call that even. I bought a 7 dollar with tip coffee at Cafe Deletant or whatever inside security. Flew to SJC super early so there was breakfast served on a 1:40 minute leg. That was free. I was going to get coffee at SJC but it was a total crap show at the one coffee place so I bailed. DH to LAS on SWA. They gave me a drink coupon but I gave it away. Tipped the van guy 5$ because I felt bad just tipping him 2$ since I was the only guy on the pick up. Bought dinner in the MGM Park. 25$ with 20% discount then tip: 31$. I also walked across the street and bought a coconut water for 7$ dollars lol. I also bought hot sauce that helps the crew meals but this is amortized over many trips. So, I wont include it. I went to bed early and tried to get coffee. Skunked again. Van was at 6:05 and the Starbies didn't open until 6. Weak. Van ride. Paid for my tip and my FO didnt have change so I covered him 4$ Went to Starbies at LAS 7$ offered to get my FO something but he didn't want anything. They fed us on the 1:50 minute leg from LAS to SEA. Breakfast again. The best of the crew meals and I reupped my Chalula stash. Which I share with the FOs.
The per diem is $2.55 an hour and I was gone 28 hours and 25 minutes = $72.42 My total meal costs were 61 or so dollars.
I have never done the math before. Sometimes I buy the crew coffee. Sometimes I splash out on food and drinks if I feel like it but I rarely do anymore. I probably come out about even or lose a couple hundred dollars a year? I don't track it.
milleR
Well-Known Member
If "big" is the only qualifying factor in your definition why didn't you include Skywest? They have more planes and pilots than your airline.
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
When someone says “the big 3” I don’t think anything other than AA, DL, UA.
When they say “legacy” I include AS and HA.
Sorry to JC for confusing them by saying big 6. The big 6 would be large major airlines, not counting regionals.
Bob Ridpath
Pit Bull love
Respect.
Personally, the dollars which passed thru my hands were considered as dirty paper and used for the benefit of others (and self). Might be further ahead if I held on to those relatively few bucks but what the hell ... no regrets here. Bought a few meals for strangers, sprang for other things on behalf of people which weren't necessary, and a slew of other things for friends and family.
Did it make a difference? Damned if I know. Am I content to have done so? 100%.
YMMV.
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
September
No vacation, no training, nothing.
16 days of work. All day trips. Home every night in bed. 0 hotels.
14 days off.
104.5 credit
Could make it 17 day trips and 13 off for 110 credit, but that's too much work.
Or I could drop all the way down to 11 days of work, 19 days off, for 71 hrs credit. But that's paycheck lite.
I could advertise my day trips and those picked up by others would allow me to go below 70 hrs and all the way down to 0. But that's like unemployed.
Plus 16% DC.
When it comes to aviation jobs, this amount of vast schedule flexibility, pay, and retirement, make 121 major airlines the pinnacle of aviation jobs. That's not to say other jobs aren't good, but one would be surprised at just how good major 121 can be.
No vacation, no training, nothing.
16 days of work. All day trips. Home every night in bed. 0 hotels.
14 days off.
104.5 credit
Could make it 17 day trips and 13 off for 110 credit, but that's too much work.
Or I could drop all the way down to 11 days of work, 19 days off, for 71 hrs credit. But that's paycheck lite.
I could advertise my day trips and those picked up by others would allow me to go below 70 hrs and all the way down to 0. But that's like unemployed.
Plus 16% DC.
When it comes to aviation jobs, this amount of vast schedule flexibility, pay, and retirement, make 121 major airlines the pinnacle of aviation jobs. That's not to say other jobs aren't good, but one would be surprised at just how good major 121 can be.
zmiller4
Well-Known Member
The pinnacle of aviation jobs *for you*.
Although I’m unsure if you know enough about the the non-121 world to even say that with confidence.
KLB
Well-Known Member
Flew 2 days in July got paid my salary and contracted when I felt like flying. I really only fly 350-375hrs a year.
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